Uncommon Descent Serving The Intelligent Design Community

Expert, Smexpert

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IN A RECENT THREAD VJTORLEY WRITES:

Here’s a question for everyone: when is it rational NOT to believe an expert? That’s a difficult one. The following is a (by no means exhaustive) list of “warning signs” which indicate that what an expert says may be open to legitimate doubt:

(1) The question in dispute relates to a single discipline, in which the known facts are dwarfed by the unknowns, as much remains to be discovered. In that case, even if the expert knows a LOT more than you do, he/she is about as much in the dark as you are.
(Here’s a concrete mathematical illustration: if you know 0.01% of everything that could be known in the relevant field, and the expert knows 100 times more than you do, that’s still only 1%, which means that he/she is 99% in the dark, while you are 99.99% in the dark. That’s not much of a difference.)

(2) The question in dispute relates to a single discipline, in which the relevant uncertainties have not been adequately quantified.

(3) The question in dispute relates to a single discipline, in which the predictions made by the dominant scientific model are based on mechanisms whose causal adequacy to generate the effects predicted has not been established – in other words, where the capacity or efficacy of the mechanisms has not been adequately quantified.

(4) The expert makes a claim which strikes you as prima facie outrageously implausible, but is unable to demonstrate that the dominant scientific model upon which he/she relies is adequate to support that claim – in other words, the expert can’t prove to you that his/her model is at least capable of getting you from X to Y.

(5) The question in dispute relates to a single discipline, in which the predictions made by the dominant scientific model are highly sensitive to the initial assumptions which are input, so that a tiny revision in these assumptions dramatically alters the predictions made by the model.

(6) The question in dispute relates to a single discipline, in which the predictions appear to accord well with the data, but the mechanics of the phenomenon itself are poorly understood, so that the currently accepted model, while plausible, is not necessarily the only possible way of explaining the phenomenon – in other words, another model may supplant it in the future.

(7) The question in dispute relates to multiple disciplines, in several of which you have a limited degree of expertise, whereas the expert you are listening to has a great deal of expertise in just ONE of these disciplines.

(8) The expert in question has a track record of making bad judgements on other subjects with which you are familiar, and most of these judgements tend to betray a common cognitive blind-spot.

(9) The expert in question is very dogmatic about his/her claim, even though other experts in the same field have contrary opinions, or are considerably less certain about the claim.

(10) The claim itself appears to be ideologically motivated to some degree – i.e. it is accompanied by snide put-downs of alternative world-views which are held by many people, but not by the expert.

(11) The expert has been financially rewarded or has obtained fame or promotion by promoting his/her claim, but would not have been so rewarded had he/she promoted a contrary claim.

(12) The expert’s claim is asserted hotly and with great vehemence, accompanied by moral indignation and/or contempt towards those who question or reject the claim.

Can anyone think of any other warning signs? If so, please feel free to add to the list.

As an exercise, readers might like to check the boxes for neo-Darwinian evolution (as opposed to common descent) and the hypothesis of dangerous anthropogenic global warming.

Regarding global warming, I think it’s best to be prepared. Personally, I’m skeptical that anthropogenic global warming is likely to be dangerous on a global scale over the next 100 years. But of course, I could be completely wrong. The good news is that even if anthropogenic global warming does pose a real threat to the biosphere, we have a feasible action plan that won’t cost the earth, that won’t line the pockets of the bureaucrats, and that will solve all our energy problems:

Sustainable Nuclear Power by Professor Barry Brook.

The following articles show (I hope) why it remains rational to doubt the claim that anthropogenic global warming is likely to be dangerous in the foreseeable future.

Why I am a Global Warming Skeptic by Dr. Doug Hoffman.

The Crumbling Pillars of Climate Change by Dr. Doug Hoffman.

The Grand View: Four Billion Years of Climate Change by Dr. Doug Hoffman.

Could Human CO2 Emissions Cause Another PETM? by Dr. Doug Hoffman.

A Demonstration that Global Warming Predictions are Based More On Faith than On Science by Dr. Roy Spencer.

Connecting the Dots: Theoretical and Observational Evidence for Negative Cloud Feedbacks by Dr. Roy Spencer and Dr. William Braswell.

Global Warming Skepticism 101 by Dr. Roy Spencer.

A Climate of Belief by Dr. Patrick Frank

Comments
faded glory, you ask me "What is your alternative for common descent? What is your proposed mechanism for that alternative? Has that mechanism been observed in nature?" I say that intelligence is observed in nature yes, as we humans are part of nature. We do not know that there was no intelligence before life just as we do not know there was variation and natural selection before life. Therefore intelligence is as reasonable as evolution for a mechanism. Maybe it is more so.Morgentau
April 7, 2010
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"That is, do you deny the mainstream explanation for common descent but accept common descent itself, or do you also deny common descent." I am on record and I believe the only honest answer to this is that it is a mystery. By the way that is the term that Behe once used to assess this. Certainly, an intelligence could have made it happen but I am not saying that is the answer for sure. It is certainly more probably than natural means. What the current evidence shows is that there is no natural mechanism known that has or could have created all the novel functional capabilities that have appeared at various times since the first appearance of life on the planet about 3.5 billion years ago. All the following I consider as honest answers or assessments: A. It is highly improbable that life could have appeared naturally. B. It is highly improbable that all the novel functional capabilities could have appeared naturally. C. Life probably appeared just once and it was highly probable the occurrence was due to an intelligent intervention. If it was a natural occurrence, then I would have expected it would have appeared more than once. By the way some evolutionary biologists believe it did happen more than once. D. It is likely that most of the life forms on the earth appeared as a result of natural processes but not all. Personally, I think "most" to be way above 99% but definitely less than 100%. This small percentage that did not appear by natural means could be the source of common ancestry which we see everywhere. E. The mechanism for the appearance of novel functional capabilities is unknown but is extremely unlikely to be a natural one for all or even most of these occurrences. An intelligence could certainly make this happen but just how is certainly unknown. There is a lot of speculation by people and some have said it was through quantum events or some other means of steering variation in gametes. Such events if they were the mechanism would never be visible or traceable. But natural processes would be traceable and the reason they are rejected is because there are no traces. F. If a natural process can be shown to create the novel functional capabilities then the likely assessment is that it may have happened this way. More than one of us here who support ID would assent to such a proposition if a likely process were ever discovered and proved likely. Again, as far as I am concerned the only honest answer is that it is a mystery. So I judge the honesty of others by how they assess the issues. If they are adamant then that immediately says something about their honesty in this debate. Too many are ideologically driven and unless they can give empirical evidence to back their views I consider them faith based and nothing more. And at present anyone who firmly believes in common descent is doing so based on faith alone and not evidence. That is not saying that common descent is false, just that it is far from a proven concept let alone a "slam dunk."jerry
April 7, 2010
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Pardon my not knowing, but what is an EC?Aleta
April 7, 2010
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"do you believe that common descent is true, but that intelligent agency is a necessary part of the explanation" As an EC, who has been branded at athiest on this site, I think that common descent is true with a high degree of probability. I also think that intelligent agency (God) also likely played a part beyond sustaining and originating creation. But I would not claim to know for certain that intelligent agency was directly necessary in producing life, as we know it. Unlike many of the writers of the main posts on this site who claim to know for certain. IMO as Christians we all need to admit that we see through a glass darkly and do not posses absolute knowledge which is the result of both our finitude and also that all portions of our being are affected by the fall into sin.gingoro
April 7, 2010
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Aleta (#26, 36) Thank you for your post. You wrote (#26):
Think about all the theories out there that you, and virtually everyone, accept without really knowing all the evidence or understanding all that has gone into making them the consensus: the atomic theory of the structure of matter, the theory that the liver takes out toxins in the body, the theory that all the elements beyond helium were forged in stars which later exploded those materials into space, the theory of the causes and history on plate tectonics, and so on. I accept the consensus view on those topics. Am I to be just as skeptical of them as you are about common descent, or is it more reasonable to accept what they say about common descent. What is a person who isn’t an expert, which is virtually all of us, supposed to do when told the results of mainstream science?
That's a very good question. Personally, I accept the view that all living things sprang from a common stock, although I do not believe (as neo-Darwinists do) that a combination of natural selection and random variation suffice to explain how that common stock developed into the diverse array of life-forms we see around us today. However, you are quite right to point out that most of our scientific beliefs about the world rest upon the say-so of experts. So why should we not be skeptical of all scientific theories? What's so special about neo-Darwinian evolution? It might be tempting to say: lack of a known mechanism. But that is not quite right. We still haven't detected gravitational waves, but that does not prevent us from accepting Einstein's General Theory of Relativity. Until a few decades ago, we did not know how the continents moved, but that did not make it irrational to accept continental drift. The reason why it makes sense to accept the scientific theories of gravity and continental drift, even in the absence of a mechanism, is that we know that gravity works (apples do, after all, fall from trees) and we can actually measure the rate at which continents drift. Given a sufficient amount of time, it is easy to show, by simple extrapolation, how Africa and South America could have drifted to where they are today. Einstein's General Theory of Relativity has not yet been reconciled with quantum theory, but that does not tell us that it is false, but only that it is incomplete. Neo-Darwinian evolution is different from these theories for three reasons. The first problem with neo-Darwinian evolution is that it purports to be a complete, all-embracing theory: its success stands or falls on whether it can explain all of the variation we see among living organisms today. "Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution" - Theodosius Dobzhansky. Of course, he meant neo-Darwinian evolution. If NDE is merely a partial theory that explains some of the variation we observe in living things, then it is no longer a fundamental theory. The second problem with neo-Darwinian evolution is that it claims that extrapolation of the evolutionary changes scientists have observed to date, over vast periods of time, is sufficient to explain the diversity of living organisms that we see today. But we don't see any numerical calculations to support this claim. For instance, why is four billion years sufficient time to get from a one-celled prokaryotic bacterium to a human being? Why don't we need forty billion years? And why isn't four hundred million years enough? Contrast this with continental drift, where geologists can calculate how much time it should have taken Africa and South America to drift apart, based on known rates of drift, and verify that this calculation is correct by dating the ocean floor sediments lying between the two continents. The third problem with neo-Darwinian evolution is that it resorts to emotional blackmail of the scientific community: anyone who questions the theory is not a scientist at all, but a religious nut. You don't see scientists who defend General Relativity or continental drift talking like that. The shrillness and the ferocity with which some biologists defend NDE is astonishing. They really need to take a cold shower. If they were intellectually honest, they would put their theory forward as a tentative working hypothesis, admit that there is little evidence supporting the theory's controversial "extrapolation claim,” and roll up their sleeves and get to work looking for evidence to back up that claim, even if takes centuries to uncover. That's what a real scientist would do, if he/she were inclined to accept the truth of NDE. Later on, you wrote (#36):
And the alternative explanation for the origin of different kinds of organisms is what? “Poof” by an unknown intelligent designer using an unknown mechanism that defies the laws of physics.
We don't know that the Designer contravenes the laws of physics, and we don't know that the Designer goes "poof." As Professor Michael Behe explained in his book, The Edge of Evolution (Free Press, paperback, 2008, pp. 231-232), it's possible to envisage the Designer as an "uber-physicist" who carefully fine-tunes the initial conditions and constants of nature in such a way that life in all its diversity emerges as the universe unfolds naturally, without any need for interference. Such a universe would still be designed. But suppose you're right, for argument's sake; let us imagine that there is no scientific alternative to neo-Darwinian evolution that is currently available. Does that mean we are bound to accept it by default? No. I profoundly disagree with the slavish mindset that says, "Any hypothesis - even a bad hypothesis - is better than no hypothesis at all." No. A bad hypothesis is still a bad hypothesis, and if we suspect a hypothesis is bad, we should reject it, regardless of whether there are alternatives available. Until we find a good one, we simply need to do more research and collect more data. Sometimes, patience is a virtue.vjtorley
April 7, 2010
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Jerry, you believe that "reproduction with variation plus natural selection" is a localized phenomena that explains common ancestry within kinds or families or whatever you want to call them, but that it doesn't explain common descent (and by common descent I mean that all organisms are biological related through parent-child relationships back to the beginning of life.) Could you clarify your position by answering this question: do you believe that common descent is true, but that intelligent agency is a necessary part of the explanation, or do you believe the common descent is not true? That is, do you deny the mainstream explanation for common descent but accept common descent itself, or do you also deny common descent. And I'd be interested in Stephen's answer to this question, and anyone else who would like to chime in.Aleta
April 7, 2010
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"We would probably all agree that Richard Dawkins and Jerry Coyne are considered experts on evolution." As an EC I would consider them popularizers with a very large new atheist ax to grind, not unlike Henry Moris of the ICR from a different religious position. In the past it appears that both Dawkins and Coyne were likely experts in their respective fields but given their obvious bias I don't expect to read them in the future. When someone needs a particular view on science to be true to support their world view, I tend to get very suspicious. In terms of information content required, Randy Isaac has been arguing that the only kind of CSI that we know is only produced by intelligence is abstract information. I find his arguments compelling. http://www.asa3online.org/Book/ None abstract CSI can be produced by either intelligent or none intelligent sources. For example consider the information produced in a feedback system. The info being fed back is both complex and specified and although often in analog form it could be easily digitized as Shannon information or compressed as algorithmic info. Of course this does not imply that the information in the first cell did not come directly from God but continues to leave the question open. Ignoring OoL much of the information in evolution is extracted from the environment by natural selection. Please note I said much and could be argued into a position of saying some but I strongly doubt that all the information can be generated from the environment.gingoro
April 7, 2010
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And the alternative explanation for the origin of different kinds of organisms is what? "Poof" by an unknown intelligent designer using an unknown mechanism that defies the laws of physics. And tell me why this is a more likely explanation? And you're still playing with words, Stephen. Of course you took the definition right out of the dictionary. You then unilaterally declared that since you didn't believe the views of those the world considers experts, they weren't really experts. Of course there are doubters, but your 1000 signees of the DI's statement is less than 1% of the comparable group of knowledgeable people - the fact that only such a small minority are doubters is itself strong evidence that the experts are right.Aleta
April 7, 2010
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"the proposed mechanism for common descent is reproduction with variation plus natural selection." This is a proposed mechanism for common ancestry, not common descent. Common ancestry is a localized phenomena. We have been down this road many times before. This is a very useful mechanism for life but extremely limited in what it can do.jerry
April 7, 2010
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morgentau, the proposed mechanism for common descent is reproduction with variation plus natural selection. Both of these elements have been observed in nature. What is your alternative for common descent? What is your proposed mechanism for that alternative? Has that mechanism been observed in nature? Thanks, fGfaded_Glory
April 7, 2010
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---Aleta: "Back to the main point: why should I, or anyone, believe the pronouncements of Stephen or Jerry over the consensus view of mainstream science." Which “consensus” are you talking about? Is it the consensus that once preferred Aristotle’s outdated cosmology over Galileo’s observations, or the consensus that defended Paley’s design arguments against Darwin’s naturalism, or the consensus that defended Newton’s traditions over Einstein’s innovations, or the consensus that now seeks to protect Darwinism from intelligent design? Here is a clue: All true progress in science comes from the original thinkers, better known as the minority, and not from the uncreative, dutiful little worker bees, better known as the majority. With respect to the former, almost a thousand prominent scientists now question the Darwinistic formula. I, for one, am not asking anyone to believe me; I simply point them to the scientists in question. Also, you are using the “argument from authority,” a rather elitist tactic that only works with those who cannot read a scientific report. As it turns out, I know how to do that and I am sure Jerry does as well. Translation: Darwinists are bluffing, which explains why they feel the need to persecute, slander, and “expel” anyone who questions their ideology posing as science. That’s not the kind of behavior that inspires confidence from anyone. ---"Sure, Stephen and Jerry want to define “expert” as “someone who agrees with Stephen and Jerry”, but that really doesn’t work – you just don’t get to pervert the meaning of language that way." I took my definition right out of the dictionary. If anyone is trying to twist the meaning of language it would be the one who sneers at the accurate definition of a word and characterizes its faithful application as a perversion.StephenB
April 6, 2010
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It does no use to say that common descent does not need a mechanism. It does need a mechanism, and it does not have one. Sometimes evolutionists say that intelligent design does not have a mechanism. They are wrong, though. The mechanism is intelligent agency. That is observable all around us.Morgentau
April 6, 2010
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"why should I, or anyone, believe the pronouncements of Stephen or Jerry over the consensus view of mainstream science." Yes, this is true if the consensus can justify itself by evidence. Darwin wrote his book for the masses, not the privileged few who supposedly according to you could only understand the intricacies of evolution. It turns out that the science is understandable at the layman's level so the layman is quite capable of learning the science and in fact most high school students learn the science. Nearly everyone here has gone deeper than that into the science and are quite capable of understanding arguments for or against something in this particular field. When the high priests of the discipline do not explain the basis for their beliefs, then one has to question whether they are in fact experts or not or if they are honest. Dawkins and Coyne do not address the essential question of evolution in their so called comprehensive books on the topic. A prominent evolutionary biologist, Will Provine, has admitted it is all based on faith. It is easy to conclude something from this. Why should anyone listen to Aleta when he himself cannot explain why it is true nor point to anyone or anything to back up his beliefs. So I am afraid your arguments are at best shallow and I bet you know it. The interesting thing is that to a person, the anti ID person goes to the wall with bogus arguments. Interesting phenomena.jerry
April 6, 2010
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Back to the main point: why should I, or anyone, believe the pronouncements of Stephen or Jerry over the consensus view of mainstream science. Sure, Stephen and Jerry want to define "expert" as "someone who agrees with Stephen and Jerry", but that really doesn't work - you just don't get to pervert the meaning of language that way.Aleta
April 6, 2010
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You're just playing with words here, guys, but carry on.Aleta
April 6, 2010
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----Aleta: "The topic here is not whether you think a mechanism for common descent can be discerned. The topic is the role of experts, who in this case do believe that such mechanisms have been discerned, and that large amounts of evidence support that belief. On what grounds, other than your own disbelief, do you think a relatively impartial observer would reject the consensus view of the mainstream experts?" No, the topic is the criteria by which one discerns whether those who claim to be experts really are experts. Let's look at the definition of an expert: Expert--"Having, involving, displaying special skill or knowledge or training derived from training or experience." Evolutionary biologists do not "have" nor can they "display" any knowledge concerning their main claim about naturalistic forces generating macro evolution. They are not, therefore, experts. What they are displaying is not expertise but "solidarity." The two words are not synonyms.StephenB
April 6, 2010
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I got my undergrad in psychology and I can tell you that the experts of yesterday, in this field anyway, are held in derision by experts of today. Furthermore (and maybe this is unique to psychology) there is so much disagreement in the field now (among behaviorists, cognitivists, humanists, feminists, Freudians and neuro-psychologists) that it is difficult to not be skeptical of everybody.Collin
April 6, 2010
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jerry @25,
“What is a person who isn’t an expert, which is virtually all of us, supposed to do when told the results of mainstream science?”
I pointed out above that there are no experts on this topic so who are you listening to?
Aleta at comment 24 is speaking in the abstract. Why would you listen to expert group A speaking about subject X but disregard expert group B speaking about subject Y? In other words, why don't you challenge the creation of stars as well as evolution since no human being has physically witnessed either?Toronto
April 6, 2010
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"What is a person who isn’t an expert, which is virtually all of us, supposed to do when told the results of mainstream science?" I pointed out above that there are no experts on this topic so who are you listening to? Common descent requires a mechanism to be a reality. What is that mechanism? Without it, one is just being gullible to say it actually happened. It may have happened but it is not likely based on the evidence currently at hand. No one has ever witnessed common descent happening. One can ascribe to common ancestry because it can be witnessed and shown by genomic analysis to be very logical. But common descent has neither logical or empirical backing. So it is faith based but one that may have less going for it empirically than the Resurrection does. I am the last one to question your faith on something and so will support your right to have faith in common descent or belief in it if you want to express it that way. A lot of what I personally believe is equally faith based but on science I tend to be empirically based and so does most of the ID community. And common descent has no empirical backing. Darwin postulated it and that is the main reason it is still around but it is certainly not science. It is also postulated by some based on religious reasons but again that is not science.jerry
April 6, 2010
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The topic here is not whether you think a mechanism for common descent can be discerned. The topic is the role of experts, who in this case do believe that such mechanisms have been discerned, and that large amounts of evidence support that belief. On what grounds, other than your own disbelief, do you think a relatively impartial observer would reject the consensus view of the mainstream experts? Why would one think that all those people, working within a system which has brought us many other theories that are accepted as valid, would be wrong about common descent, and that Jerry, whoever he is, is the person we should listen to? Note - I'm not talking about why you think common descent is wrong, and that no mechanism for it is known: I am asking why, in general, we should listen to you rather than the experts who communicate the consensus. Think about all the theories out there that you, and virtually everyone, accept without really knowing all the evidence or understanding all that has gone into making them the consensus: the atomic theory of the structure of matter, the theory that the liver takes out toxins in the body, the theory that all the elements beyond helium were forged in stars which later exploded those materials into space, the theory of the causes and history on plate tectonics, and so on. I accept the consensus view on those topics. Am I to be just as skeptical of them as you are about common descent, or is it more reasonable to accept what they say about common descent. What is a person who isn't an expert, which is virtually all of us, supposed to do when told the results of mainstream science?Aleta
April 6, 2010
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"and most would feel that those who deny common descent do also." Until a mechanism for common descent can be discerned one can legitimately question common descent. Remember, common descent is not the same thing as common ancestry which is a localized phenomena in the sense that is restricted to certain subsets of organisms. So those who postulate common descent must provide a mechanism for it or else they are like flat earthers, speculating on the non observable or even on the impossible.jerry
April 6, 2010
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Jerry (#18) Excellent post! Well said.vjtorley
April 6, 2010
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Seversky (#5) Thank you for your post. You write:
So you question the reliability of expert opinion and then cite a list of works by experts who are presumably more reliable because their opinions accord with your own?
First, my post was written in defense of the legitimacy of doubting an expert, not denying what he/she has to say. There's a big difference. Second, I have no idea whether the "experts" I cite who doubt that Anthropogenic Global Warming is dangerous are any more reliable than the "experts" who insist that it is a real threat. All I know is that the objections raised in the articles I cited above have not yet been answered online. The problems with AGW which the authors discuss are not minor quibbbles like the size and global extent of the Medieval Warm Period or the best way of measuring Antarctic sea ice. Rather, the articles deal with fundamental problems relating to AGW models. As such, they deserve a thoughtful, intelligent response. Until one is forthcoming, I reserve my right to remain skeptical. Regarding St. Augustine: I am of course familiar with the quotation you cited. However, I suggest you read Book 15 of his City of God (especially the last chapter, where he responds to common skeptical objections to the Deluge) and then tell me what you think. See http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/120115.htm . It seems to me that he was pretty literalistic in his interpretation of Scripture. By the way, here's what Augustine wrote on the "waters above the firmament" described in Genesis 1: (De Genesi ad litteram ii, 5)
These words of Scripture have more authority than the most exalted human intellect. Hence, whatever these waters are, and whatever their mode of existence, we cannot for a moment doubt that they are there.
I should add that Augustine tended to favor the common-sense interpretation that the "waters above the firmament" refers to that part of the atmosphere where clouds form, to fall on the earth as rain. In De Genesi ad litteram ii, 4, he writes: "I consider this view of the question worthy of all commendation, as neither contrary to faith nor difficult to be proved and believed." Here's Augustine on the age of the human race, in his City of God Book 12, available online at http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/120112.htm
Chapter 10 ...They are deceived, too, by those highly mendacious documents which profess to give the history of many thousand years, though, reckoning by the sacred writings, we find that not 6000 years have yet passed. Chapter 12 ...[A]ccording to Scripture, less than 6000 years have elapsed since He [man – VJT] began to be...
And here's what Augustine writes on the question of whether Paradise (the Garden of Eden) was literal or allegorical in his City of God, Book XIII, chapter 21, available online at http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/120113.htm :
Allegorical interpretations may be suitably put upon Paradise without giving offense to any one, while yet we believe the strict truth of the history, confirmed by its circumstantial narrative of facts.
As you rightly note, believers should indeed take care that skeptics never "find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well." However, a mistake is one thing; the rejection of "consensus science" is quite another. Finally, here's another article that might interest you: http://creation.com/augustine-young-earth-creationistvjtorley
April 6, 2010
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This gets right to the heart of the matter. The vast majority of people with enough training to be called an expert, as well as all the people who trust the scientific consensus of those experts, would definitely feel that young-earth creationists fall into this category, and most would feel that those who deny common descent do also. Irrespective of the strong feelings of those who think those experts are wrong, those standing apart from the fray, including many young people, are skeptical about religion because of those who stand in opposition to mainstream science, and in doing so, to use Stephen's terms, lose credibility and devalue and undermine Christianity.Aleta
April 6, 2010
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----warehuff: "Clive, I think Augustine is giving a general warning against attempting to give mere human opinion the authority of Scripture because it reduces the authority of Scripture if that human opinion turns out to be wrong." Augustine was arguing that if a Christian makes a fool out of himself in the presence of an expert on a matter unrelated to religion, he will lose credibility as a careful thinker on ALL matters and [a] his attempts to interpret the Bible will not be taken seriously [b] Christianity itself will be devalued and undermined because its ambassasadors will appear to be uneducated fools who accept myths as reality.StephenB
April 6, 2010
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Rather than get into any list of criteria as to why an expert may not be an expert, I will list just one criteria for the current experts on evolution. We would probably all agree that Richard Dawkins and Jerry Coyne are considered experts on evolution. But are they? They study it, publish on it and are widely referred to when questions of evolution come up. Some others have obviously achieved similar recognition in the past but as of today, these two would serve as experts in the field. If you wanted to have a definitive conference on evolution, these two would easily be considered a top representative. Yet each of them has failed to show a mechanism whereby macro evolution (definition used on this site) has taken place. They have both published books in the last couple years that were supposed to be definitive summations of what is known about evolution. Yet each has failed to answer the most basic question there is, namely what is the origin of new information in the genomes that govern the origin of novel complex capabilities. Given that piece of information, then we would have to come to the conclusion that there is no such thing as an expert on evolution. Oh, there might be experts on micro evolution and genetics but there is no one who is an expert on macro evolution. Such a person does not exists. So one criteria for an expert in any field is the ability to explain phenomena in a causal sense. When that criteria is missing, the person in question is not an expert. And since no one on the planet can explain macro evolution in any causal sense, there are no experts in this particular field.jerry
April 6, 2010
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tribune7 adds another criteria: "Experts who are self- (or incestuously) proclaimed should be treated with extreme skepticism." But, as with warehuff's point at 16, this is quite true of ID. And I'd like to add a comment on (12): "The expert’s claim is asserted hotly and with great vehemence, accompanied by moral indignation and/or contempt towards those who question or reject the claim." "Moral indignation and/or contempt towards those who question or reject the claim" of ID is a very common reaction here. So I think the opening thread is definitely a case of the pot calling the kettle black.Aleta
April 6, 2010
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Clive, I think Augustine is giving a general warning against attempting to give mere human opinion the authority of Scripture because it reduces the authority of Scripture if that human opinion turns out to be wrong. Here's another question to ask: How many of the criteria above fit ID? I count at least 7: (3) The question in dispute relates to a single discipline, in which the predictions made by the dominant scientific model are based on mechanisms whose causal adequacy to generate the effects predicted has not been established – in other words, where the capacity or efficacy of the mechanisms has not been adequately quantified. I've never even seen an ID mechanism offered for consideration. (4) The expert makes a claim which strikes you as prima facie outrageously implausible, but is unable to demonstrate that the dominant scientific model upon which he/she relies is adequate to support that claim – in other words, the expert can’t prove to you that his/her model is at least capable of getting you from X to Y. Same as 3. (8) The expert in question has a track record of making bad judgements on other subjects with which you are familiar, and most of these judgements tend to betray a common cognitive blind-spot. Off the top of my head: Approval of the Bible Code, HIV denial. (9) The expert in question is very dogmatic about his/her claim, even though other experts in the same field have contrary opinions, or are considerably less certain about the claim. (10) The claim itself appears to be ideologically motivated to some degree – i.e. it is accompanied by snide put-downs of alternative world-views which are held by many people, but not by the expert. (11) The expert has been financially rewarded or has obtained fame or promotion by promoting his/her claim, but would not have been so rewarded had he/she promoted a contrary claim. Buy my book. (12) The expert’s claim is asserted hotly and with great vehemence, accompanied by moral indignation and/or contempt towards those who question or reject the claim.warehuff
April 6, 2010
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This study is interesting: Even When Wrong, Political Experts Say They Were 'Almost Right' Excerpt: In one part of this study, Tetlock asked experts years ago to predict outcomes on seven different issues. In 1988, for example, he asked 38 Soviet experts whether the Communist Party would still be in power in 1993; and he asked 34 American political experts in 1992 whether President Bush would be re-elected later that year. After the events occurred, Tetlock then re-contacted the experts to ask them about their predictions. In all seven scenarios, only slightly more than half of the experts correctly predicted the events that occurred. Still, even those who were wrong had been quite confident in their predictions. Experts who said they were 80 percent or more confident in their predictions were correct only 45 percent of the time. Not surprisingly, experts who were correct credited their accuracy to their sound reading of the basic forces at play in the situation, Tetlock said. "More surprisingly, experts who were wrong were almost as likely as those who were right to believe their reading of the political situation was basically sound," he said. When asked to rate how confident they were in their analysis of the issues involved, experts who were correct gave average ratings of 6.6 to 7.3 on a nine-point scale. However, even experts who were wrong continued to give average confidence ratings of 6.3 to 7.1. "It is striking that forecasters who had been incorrect managed to retain nearly as much confidence in the fundamental soundness of their judgments as the forecasters who had been correct," Tetlock said. ,,, he said the results do show how difficult it is for people to let go of their beliefs, even in the face of contrary evidence. http://www.scienceblog.com/community/older/1999/C/199902734.htmlbornagain77
April 5, 2010
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Experts who are self- (or incestuously) proclaimed should be treated with extreme skepticism.tribune7
April 5, 2010
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