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Getting away from the AHA! Moment re the origin of life

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At least this new approach gives scientists the advantage of working in the real world:

Traditionally, research into the origins of life too often has been performed in silos defined by a researcher’s specific expertise. Now that Earth’s earliest environments are coming into sharper focus, thanks to concerted efforts to understand Earth’s early rock record and the insights gained from numerical simulations, a more interdisciplinary approach in origins-of-life research is becoming increasingly possible.

Dustin Trail, Jamie Elsila, Ulrich F. Müller, Timothy Lyons and Karyn L. Rogers, “Rethinking the Search for the Origins of Life” at Eos (February 4, 2022)

The good news with the interdisciplinary approach is that a greater awareness of the sheer complexity of the situation will be forced on the researchers so perhaps we will be hearing fewer “lucky strike” origin of life theories. The bad news… well, they might want to talk to chemist James Tour about that.

You may also wish to read:

Did giant mountain ranges provide nutrients in early Earth’s history? According to the new thesis, the erosion of mountains provided nutrients that were hitherto unavailable, that helped life forms get started. Sounds like a rollout, actually.

and

Researchers: Poisonous cyanide may have been a harbinger of life 4 billion years ago Note the “may have” and “could have been.” That’s where a lot of origin of life studies are, really. Nothing wrong with that, of course, as long as it is not mistaken for “the findings of science.” It’s speculation, pure and simple. It would be a great hard sci-fi novel, maybe a flick. And fun for chemistry students!

Comments
God bless, and strengthen, Dr. Tour who is unafraid to stand up for what is right and 'speak truth to power'.
“In the last few years I have seen a saddening progression at several institutions. I have witnessed unfair treatment upon scientists that do not accept macroevolutionary arguments and for their having signed the above-referenced statement regarding the examination of Darwinism. (Dissent from Darwinism list), (I will comment no further regarding the specifics of the actions taken upon the skeptics; I love and honor my colleagues too much for that.) I never thought that science would have evolved like this. I deeply value the academy; teaching, professing and research in the university are my privileges and joys… ,,, if the scientific community has taken these shots at senior faculty, it will not be comfortable for the young non-conformist. When the power-holders permit no contrary discussion, can a vibrant academy be maintained?” - Professor James M. Tour – considered one of the top ten chemists in the world https://uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/a-world-famous-chemist-tells-the-truth-theres-no-scientist-alive-today-who-understands-macroevolution/ - Dr. Tour's (impressive) credentials https://www.aiche.org/community/bio/james-tour
Of note:
July 2020 Intelligent Design’s claim that (conscious) Intelligence is necessary in order to explain life, has, for all intents and purposes, now achieved experimental confirmation. https://uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/are-researchers-closer-to-understanding-the-origin-of-life/#comment-708079
Quote and Verse:
"I have been looking for spontaneous generation (of life) for twenty years without discovering it. No, I do not judge it impossible. But what allows you to make it the origin of life? You place matter before life and you decide that matter has existed for all eternity. How do you know that the incessant progress of science will not compel scientists to consider that life has existed during eternity, and not matter? You pass from matter to life because your intelligence of today cannot conceive things otherwise. How do you know that in ten thousand years, one will not consider it more likely that matter has emerged from life?" - Louis Pasteur - [en francais, Pasteur et la philosophie, Patrice Pinet, Editions L’Harmattan, p. 63.] John 1:1-4 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind.
bornagain77
February 25, 2022
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They know every possible ingredient and they have them in their labs. They just cannot make them organize to do anything. Just take a live cell. Puncture it. You then have everything needed by definition to make a living cell.jerry
February 25, 2022
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Sev
So Tour knows lots of stuff that all the other OoL researchers don’t? How do you know – apart from the fact he tells you that’s the case?
Tour has a multi-part lecture series where he challenges other OOL researchers directly, laying out the facts and his arguments. That's rare in itself - most researchers don't go public to defend their proposals. I've watched most of those lectures and Dr. Tour basically destroys all of the OOL claims that have been made. It's not even close. He has an open challenge for anyone to show how life could emerge from undirected material causes, as well as anyone who wants to correct the claims that he makes. Nobody takes him up on it in any serious way.Silver Asiatic
February 25, 2022
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News, And this fun report from NIH: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5206685/EDTA
February 25, 2022
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Largest ever microbe discovered? (Maybe they should call it a "macrobe"!) "Unexpected complexity" https://www.science.org/content/article/largest-bacterium-ever-discovered-has-unexpectedly-complex-cellsEDTA
February 25, 2022
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Nature can produce stones, yet not one scientist thinks that nature produced Stonehenge. However, there is a better chance of nature producing Stonehenge than there is for nature producing life. OoL researchers are just extremely biased infants.ET
February 25, 2022
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In modern day atheism, because it is indefensible, you have people who now redefine it as "I just lack a belief" - in order to escape the burden of proof. They know they cannot defend it. You also have a bunch of people who when pressed to explain what they think happened can only answer "I don't know." Even though they probably have a theory in mind or an alternative they lean toward, they won't put it out there or try to defend it, because they know their epistemology (hyperskepticism) toward Christianity would be used against them. The only thing they are certain of is that they don't like Christianity and are holding out for anything that could be a plausible alternative. Not saying this is all atheists, but it sure catches a high percentage of the ones on the internet.zweston
February 25, 2022
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SEV- I am not an organic chemist , and I can only assume neither are you , but I can read and listen to both sides of the argument and see which is the most logical and reasonable. So Sev please lay out your best guess on how life began , If you are saying Dr Tour is wrong please cite the evidence you have read or heard to the contrary , or at least lay out it rudimentary terms how an unguided process could create so called simple cells. I assume you are disagreeing with Dr tour position because you have some evidence to refute his position , or could it be he is making the case for intelligent design so he must be wrong.Marfin
February 24, 2022
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The good news with the interdisciplinary approach is that a greater awareness of the sheer complexity of the situation will be forced on the researchers so perhaps we will be hearing fewer “lucky strike” origin of life theories. The bad news… well, they might want to talk to chemist James Tour about that.
So Tour knows lots of stuff that all the other OoL researchers don't? How do you know - apart from the fact he tells you that's the case?Seversky
February 24, 2022
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Note the “may have” and “could have been.” That’s where a lot of origin of life studies are, really. Nothing wrong with that, of course, as long as it is not mistaken for “the findings of science.” It’s speculation, pure and simple. It would be a great hard sci-fi novel, maybe a flick. And fun for chemistry students!
I wish they would just work on a good novel instead, but most of those guys can't write. At least they've got a good idea to work with. Cyanide attempted to take over the world but it created its own enemy - life forms. And the battle has raged on ever since.Silver Asiatic
February 24, 2022
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For example, in efforts to chemically synthesize informational polymers, the products of such experiments often define next steps for research with little or no consideration for whether the conditions that yielded a successful reaction (e.g., salinity, pH, oxidation state, dissolved aqueous species) were likely to have existed in early Earth environments.
This is a breakthrough. They've discovered that if you're going to try to demonstrate the origin of life on earth, you should take into consideration the conditions that existed on earth at the time. That must have been an eureka moment. "Just think, all this time we were just using idealized lab conditions." I listen to Dr. James Tour lose his mind and start yelling into the camera whenever he thinks about these sorts of things. I don't blame him one bit. These researchers are either very stupid or they're delusional.
How life began is an integral question central to the human experience, and it is intrinsically linked to the even bigger question of whether we are alone in the universe.
Claiming that how life began is "central to the human experience" is not a scientific statement. It's more theological than anything. Then saying, "an even bigger" issue than "the human experience" - so more important than the meaning of our own lives, is whether we're alone in the universe. They need some reason to get out of bed in the morning. Looks like NASA just paid for a new division based on all the progress origin of life research has made so far.Silver Asiatic
February 24, 2022
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First get rid of the simulations. Just observe reality.polistra
February 24, 2022
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