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Why do evolutionary psychologists exist?

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A reader wrote to me to say,

I greatly enjoy your writing and I would like to ask your opinion about something I really find puzzling.

Well, once someone has decided to praise my writing, how can I resist responding? Anyway, this person goes on to say,

My question concerns the so-called agent detection device” and the affirmation that it disproves God’s existence beyond any reasonable doubt.

Sounds like a scam to me, but then I have shut the door on the feet of so many people selling winter home heating plans that I may have an innate door-shutting mechanism that “evolutionary psychology” can explain … (Like, it would never have anything at all to do with suspicion that the new plan would end up sticking me with more expenses than the present one – or anything else that suggests that the human mind is real, right?)

According to many experimental studies, human beings seem to have an innate mechanism enabling them to identify the presence of an agent under some circumstances. ( if one is in a deep wood, the shuffling of trees and bushes and a sudden silence would lead one to believe some creature is present).

Well, all I can say is, when that happens to me in the deep woods, I institute my wilderness survival plan immediately.

Admittedly, the last time that happened to me, wandering down a trail in Muskoka, the creature I nearly collided with was a fox that had apparently missed his rabbit. So the fox ran off. But what if it had been a bear who had missed his deer? …

Anyway, my correspondent went on to explain,

However, this mechanism can easily fool us. What if we are, for instance, alone in an old house and hear some noise. We may be inclined to assume, too easily, that someone or something must be there, even if other explanations (like wind) would be much more likely.

Okay, not me. I’ve never had any trouble detecting the difference between, say, a fox and a ghost.

Not that I believe in ghosts. I figure, either a spirit is a holy soul or it is not. If it is a holy soul, I need not worry. And if it is not a holy soul, it would never approach a baptized and confirmed Christian like me.

True, during high summer, the floorboards of old houses can start to creak. It can sound like someone is walking there, due to the wood’s adjustment to the temperature difference between day and night. I learned that as a small child.

(This was especially useful information for us girls because we were often yakking far into the night when we should have been asleep. … So it was important for us to know whether an adult was sneaking in to check on us, as opposed to natural night noise that we could ignore.)

My correspondent advises me that evolutionary psychologists think that this “agent detection” mechanism is hyperactive and therefore completely unreliable.

That doesn’t sound right to me. (Admittedly, not much about “evolutionary psychology” – a discipline without a subject – sounds right to me. But this “agent detection” stuff sounds especially unright.)

I wrote back and said, essentially,

I am nearly 60 years old, and have often faced real danger – and have never found the mechanism unreliable at all.

In every situation in which I suspected real danger, I was right to be concerned.

Yes, false alarms are common, but people learn to ignore them after a while.

If the mechanism is so unreliable, why am I still here? Why are you? Why is anyone?

Re God: I never thought God existed on those terms! I assumed it was because of the majesty and fine tuning of the universe and the moral law, and reason and revelation.

However, I have never uncovered a really good reason for why evolutionary psychologists exist, apart from taxpayer-funded universities. But if someone comes up with one, please let me know.

Comments
Damn! The second blockquote in comment #73 should read:
"The “capacity” to learn and speak language is the result of evolution, but the actual language one learns to speak (and tho content of one’s spoken words) when one uses one’s capacity for language are not.
Time for bed; final exams are tomorrow...Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Maybe not: here's what I (and virtually every evolutionary psychologist and human ethologist I know) would say:
The “capacity” to see is the result of evolution, but the things one sees when one uses one’s capacity for sight are not.
and here, reworded to apply to the capacity for spoken language:
The “capacity” to learn and speak language is the actual language one learns to speak (and tho content of one's spoken words) when one uses one’s capacity for language are not.
and here, reworded to apply to the capacity for religious experience:
The “capacity” to have religious experiences (beliefs, etc.) is the result of evolution, but the things one experiences (and believes, etc.) when one uses one’s capacity for religious capacity are not.
Does this finally, at long last, make sense to you, Clive? Or will you persist in accusing me of asserting exactly the opposite?Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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One more time, so I won't have to do this again. Here's your quote:
"...religious “capacity” is the result of evolution, through this notion of “agency detection”, but not religion or religious belief itself, right?"
and here's how I would rewrite it to make the point I've been trying to make all along:
"...the “capacity” to see is the result of evolution, through this notion of “vision”, but not the things one sees when one uses one's capacity for sight, right?"
Do you finally get it, Clive?Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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However, despite all of my efforts to the contrary, you might indeed persist in grossly mischaracterizing both my own beliefs and those of other scientists in my field. If so, please (for the benefit of anyone still reading this thread) cite references (and, if possible, specific quotes) in which I or other evolutionary psychologists have asserted anything even remotely similar to the ridiculous strawman caricature you have chosen to attack.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Clive: Does the physical ability to play baseball determine the rules of baseball? Does the physical and mental ability to read determine the meaning of the words read? Does the physical ability to play the piano determine the music played, or the effect that listening to that music has on the listener? Does the physical ability to think determine the thoughts one thinks? And does the capacity for religious experience determine the content of one's religious beliefs? I think even you might just have an inkling of the obvious answer to these questions. And do you think that, as an evolutionary psychologist, I would answer "yes" to any of these questions, you are either an idiot or determined to misconstrue the most basic principles of evolutionary psychology to conform to your totally uninformed (and extraordinarily biased) personal opinion of them.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Clive, you think this is what evolutionary psychology is:
"...your discipline, which, I suppose, is materialistic when considering the mind, thinks that it is studying the mind when it studies the physical matter?"
because you've apparently never bothered to actually study it. Let me make this as clear as I possibly can: THE MIND IS NOT THE BRAIN: ideas are NOT "matter". They are two fundamentally different things, regardless of how strongly you think otherwise. Ideas are what "live" in the neural circuitry of the brain, but they are not the same thing as that circuitry, any more than the letters in these words is the same as the meanings of these words. Why do you persist in conflating what are clearly two fundamentally different things? And plese don't insult everyone's intelligence by saying that's what I'm doing, because I have repeatedly and clearly said just the opposite, here and in every comment I have made on this distinction. Again, another example (one more time, slowly and clearly, because you seem to be an extraordinarily slow learner): the capacity to learn and speak a language is not the same as the content of the language learned. This is precisely the distinction made by Lumsden and Wilson, Richarson and Boyd, Jablonka and Lamb, and virtually all other core thinkers in the field of evolutionary psychology/human ethology. I have stated this multiple times, as clearly and as forcefully as I can. Do you finally acknowledge this, or not, and if not, why not?Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Allen, So, religious "capacity" is the result of evolution, through this notion of "agency detection", but not religion or religious belief itself, right? So at what point does the 'psychology' come into the whole affair? All you've given me is your 'evolutionary' explanation of a physical ability. I wonder if your discipline, which, I suppose, is materialistic when considering the mind, thinks that it is studying the mind when it studies the physical matter? Thus the very evolutionary capacity to detect anything is the same as considering it mentally? I do not believe that "biological evolution can produce the capacities to formulate, learn, transmit, and apply the information contained in each of the disciplines in the short list", by the way.Clive Hayden
May 4, 2009
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Sorry, I unintentionally posted the same citation in the comment, above. The second citation should be: Corcoran, R. and Frith, C. D. (2005). Thematic reasoning and theory of mind. Accounting for social inference difficulties in schizophrenia. Evolutionary Psychology, 3: 1-19. This article deals with aspects of the "theory of mind" and demonstrates the kind of reasoning used in applying concepts derived from evolutionary psychology to more traditional topics in human psychopathology.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Once again, the actual science of evolutionary psychology is not to be found in blog posts nor articles in the popular press. As an example of a research report in the primary literature, I recommend the following article: Watson, J. S. (2005). The elementary nature of purposive behavior: Evolving minimal neural structures that display intrinsic intentionality. Evolutionary Psychology, 3: 24-48. this article is available as a free downloadable pdf here: http://www.epjournal.net/Archive/2005_-_Volume_3/index.html I recommend it not only because it has the "classical" form of a scientific research report, but also because it deals with a subject near and dear to ID supporters and myself: the evolution of intentionaliy and the "theory of mind". Take a look and perhaps we can discuss it further. Another original research report available from the same volume is this one: Watson, J. S. (2005). The elementary nature of purposive behavior: Evolving minimal neural structures that display intrinsic intentionality. Evolutionary Psychology, 3: 24-48. Like the previous article, it contains a report of original empirical research testing an hypothesis formulated on the basis of some general principles of evolutionary psychology. A discussion of this article might also shed some light on the actual methodologies used by evolutionary psychologists, and why a detailed knowledge of such methods and the information gained using them is almost never accurately represented in blog posts or the popular press. Lastly, those still interested in this thread might also want to read my own original research paper on the evolution of the capacity for religious experience, published in Evolution and Cognition, a peer-reviewed scientific journal published by the Konrad Lorenz Institute in Vienna. This article has been anthologized since its original publication, and can give some idea of the kinds of arguments that an evolutionary psychologist (that is, me) uses, and the kinds of evidence one can use to test predictions flowing from hypotheses based on the principles of evolutionary psychology. A pdf of my article is available online, and I would be happy to provide the relevant URLS and passwords necessary to download it (as copyrighted material, it cannot be directly available for download without password or firewall restrictions).Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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I have both read David Buller's book, Adapting Minds (of which the linked article is a very small snippet) and corresponded with him on the subject. While I disagree with some of Buller's assertions and conclusions, in general I believe that many of them have merit, and that evolutionary psychologists would do well to incorporate his criticisms in their work. Another book that I have already suggested along the same lines is Richarson & Boyd's Not by Genes Alone. In it, they point out that human behavior and psychology is clearly not simply the product of our "genes" (whatever they are), but equally (and in many cases, much more) the result of cultural evolution. Clive Haydon has asserted that evolutionary psychologists reduce all of cultural evolution to biological evolution. This assertion is false, as anyone who reads Richarson and Boyd can discover. Personally, I tend to prefer the term "human ethology" to "evolutionary psychology", as the latter term has been so thoroughly corrupted by the popular press as to stand for something that the discipline is not (i.e. the assertion that all human behavior is ultimately genetic) rather than standing for what it is (which cannot be reduced to a simple sentence, or even a paragraph). Why do I find "human ethology" preferable to "evolutionary psychology". Primarily because if you ask any ethologist whether animal behavior in general (or human behavior specifically) is innate (i.e. genetic) or learned (i.e. cultural), they will answer "yes". That is, virtually all significant animal behaviors are a complex blend of innate and learned components, in which the innate components are generally the capacities to learn certain general categories of behaviors. Lumsden and Wilson in their foundational book on this subject, Genes, Mind and Culture use mathematical models to formulate (and in some cases simulate) the coevolutionary relationships between genes, minds and the cultures within which they develop. If any work can be considered to be the "core" of evolutionary psychology, this is it. For those who are motivated to explore it, be warned: it is as heavily mathematical as a text in theoretical physics. Take it slowly, and be prepared to work very, very hard on understanding every page.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Very simple: the content of any given religion is not the same as the capacity for formulating, believing in, and acting on that content. To be even more precise, "religion" does not equal "the capacity for religion". The same is true for all of the "disciplines" listed in my short list. As just one example, the capacity to formulate and apply mathematical concepts is not the same as the concepts themselves, which are purely abstract entities. Everyone is aware that some people can formulate and/or learn mathematics much more easily than others, and that this capacity is not entirely the result of effort or learned skill. The same thing is true for the capacity to learn languages, music, art, etc. To state it as succinctly as I can, biological evolution can produce the capacities to formulate, learn, transmit, and apply the information contained in each of the disciplines in the short list, but has little or nothing to do with the content of those disciplines.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Diffaxial, thank you for the list. BTW, what do you think of David Buller's criticism of evopsych? Evolution of the Mind: 4 Fallacies of Psychology Denyse blogged on this previously. You can also find some of Buller's publications here.TCS
May 4, 2009
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Allen, So you do think that religion is the result of evolution. I asked you, in an earlier thread written by Barry, (which discussed religious and atheistic killings, called Quote of The Day), whether evolution was in fact responsible for both explanations, religious and atheistic killing, given that evolution produced both: https://uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/quote-of-the-day-3/ My comment: 77 Clive Hayden 04/20/2009 4:15 pm e Isn’t all of the above caused by Darwinian evolution? Evolution alone is supposed to account for everything, right? Isn’t religion caused by evolution? Isn’t atheism caused by evolution? It would seem that everything is caused and explained–if we are wholly explicable by evolution–by evolution. To which you responded: "Yes, indeed, you are wrong. There are a great many things in the universe, and in human behavior and thought that are not accountable by evolutionary biology. And thanks for giving me the chance to knock down yet another ridiculous straw man…" So I asked: “And what, exactly, about human thought and human behavior are not accountable to evolutionary biology?” and you responded: "The short list: • Aesthetics • Epistemology • Ethics • Law (common and legislative) • Logic • Mathematics • Metaphysics • Ontology • Religion (including philosophy of religion)" You answered no, now you answer yes. Which is it?Clive Hayden
May 4, 2009
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TCS:
Perhaps you can reference a freely available paper that you feel represents the best of evopsych in terms of adhering to scientific methodology and is low on imaginary scenarios and relatively free of personal and political bias.
A very interesting set of essays is contained in the 1999 volume The Descent of Mind, edited by Michael Corballis and Sephen E. G. Lea (Oxford University Press). The inferences in this volume run in the right direction, and some of the essays are fascinating, e.g. "The evolution of deep social mind in humans" by Andrew Whiten. Excellent critiques of the weakness of the logic of evolutionary psychology may be found in Valerie Hardcastle's edited volume, Where Biology Meets Psychology: Philosophical Essays (The MIT Press). Chapter 3, "Evolutionary Psychology: Ultimate Explanations and Panglossian Predictions" (Todd Grantham and Shaun Nichols), and 4 "The Conflict of Evolutionary Psychology" (Paul Sheldon Davies) are particularly good. I also strongly recommend Michael Tomasello's 1999 book The Cultural Origins of Human Cognition (Harvard University Press), which integrates biological and cultural evolutionary perspectives on human cognition with some very interesting empirical findings. (I see my library is getting rather out of date).Diffaxial
May 4, 2009
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Diffaxial, fair enough.tribune7
May 4, 2009
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Tribune7
I don’t know exactly what you are saying here, but I don’t know why you would need a study to show that a taboo is more likely to be taken seriously than non-judgmental advice.
My brief description really doesn't convey the logic of that research, so I don't blame you for misconstruing it. It refers to an early paper in evolutionary psychology entitled "Cognitive Adaptations for Social Exchange" by Leda Cosmides and John Tooby, found in Barkow, Cosmides and Tooby's 1992 edited volume The Adapted Mind. It's a complex argument and more trouble that it's worth for me to summarize here. There has been a lot of water under the bridge since that volume was published, BTW.Diffaxial
May 4, 2009
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Allen writes @ 52:
Simply attacking some field of scientific endeavor because one doesn’t like it or like its implications is neither productive nor indicative of commitment to the spirit of open-ended inquiry that is supposed to characterize scientific inquiry.
That's not what is taking place, although I think it is what takes place with you and like-minded individuals with respect to ID. What is taking place is a) questioning the value of the inquiry, b) questioning the methods, c) questioning the political and personal biases that often drive the imaginary scenarios, and d) questioning the societal implications. Now d) is less important if b) and c) are not problematic; however, many of us find them to be promblematic and transparently biased. Perhaps you can reference a freely available paper that you feel represents the best of evopsych in terms of adhering to scientific methodology and is low on imaginary scenarios and relatively free of personal and political bias. Most of us do not have the time or desire to dig that much deeper into the field because of popular press items and the tendency of new atheists to use evopsych as a battering ram against their opponents. Feel free to convince us of the value of evopsych with the best that is offered from the field.TCS
May 4, 2009
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Allen wrote @ 48:
Please cite exactly where in the books I have cited that the authors “fail to follow through” in their use of evolutionary psychology to explain the capacity for religious belief.
But he previously wrote @ 35:
However, I believe that Boyer’s analysis is incomplete, in that he (like Daniel Dennett) simply infers the existence of a set of cognitive modules, the output of which is that function we refer to by the term “agency detection”. He does not, in other words, propose (or even suggest) a testable explanation of how these modules and their output functions evolved. Despite the subtitle of his book (”The Evolutionary Origins of Religious Thought”), he does not explore the question of the origins of the modules and their output. He restricts his analysis to the empirical evidence for the existence and operation of the modules, and their effects on those human behaviors and thoughts that anthropologists refer to as “religious”, and leaves it at that.
So, you answered your own question before you asked it.TCS
May 4, 2009
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Allen, with regard to your post 37 it's not so much that I've read the literature it's that I've been subjected to the evo-psych proclamations of educational authorities in high school and college i.e. love-- whether romantic, brotherly, familial or parental -- is nothing more than chemical reaction created by evolutionary forces. Forget the transcendental or spiritual possibilities. And of course getting this authoritative definition leads to certain results. After all, you and me baby ain't nothing but mammals so let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel. Source I remember one teacher telling me guilt and fear are pointless emotions. A nice recipe for making sociopaths, looking back. Scripture says we shall be judged by every word we utter, so I guess that's something we should all keep in mind if we are in education. With regard to "taboo" it was in regard to my understanding of Diffaxial's statement, and I grant that my understanding can certainly be incorrect. What I meant is that it has long be understood that one is far more likely to influence behavior by saying one is a bad person for breaking a rule, rather than simply posting a rule in a non-judgmental manner.tribune7
May 4, 2009
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...a complex and inter-functional set of cognitive modules (partially “hard-wired” and partially “programmed”) whose function (among others) is to produce what, for convenience, is referred to as “agency detection” and “theory of mind”.
These modules in the brain would have developed embryologically from the zygote. So there must be DNA sequences that result in the development of those modules. Broadly speaking, they would be genes. Those genes can have alleles, thus are available for selection.Alan Fox
May 4, 2009
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Well, to use an example of Dawkins, the behaviour of beavers that result in the building of dams, for the materialist, must be present in the DNA of the zygote. How the behaviour of "if you sense running water, collect mud and sticks to block it" is coded in DNA and translated back into the behaviour by RNA and proteins is not yet understood. No plan of a dam coded in the DNA will be found in beaver DNA, I predict.Alan Fox
May 4, 2009
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As for "god genes", Carl Zimmer wrote this: "...given the low explanatory power of [the hox gene] VMAT2 [Dean Hamer's supposed "god gene"], it would have been more accurate for Hamer to call his book A Gene That Accounts for Less Than One Percent of the Variance Found in Scores on Psychological Questionnaires Designed to Measure a Factor Called Self-Transcendence, Which Can Signify Everything from Belonging to the Green Party to Believing in ESP, According to One Unpublished, Unreplicated Study.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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If people here are genuinely interested in specific examples of human behaviors that are at least partially explainable via evolutionary psychology, then that might be a fruitful (and educational) inquiry to pursue. Simply attacking some field of scientific endeavor because one doesn't like it or like its implications is neither productive nor indicative of commitment to the spirit of open-ended inquiry that is supposed to characterize scientific inquiry.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Alan in #47: No, what Boyer, Atran, and Wilson all describe is most emphatically not "god genes", but rather a complex and inter-functional set of cognitive modules (partially "hard-wired" and partially "programmed") whose function (among others) is to produce what, for convenience, is referred to as "agency detection" and "theory of mind". It is extremely unlikely that this function is controlled (or even regulated) by a single "god gene", any more than the similar capacity for human language is the result of the operation of a single "language gene" or that human behavior as a whole is the result of some hyper-functional "behavior gene".Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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jerry in #46: If joseph is making an assertion about "the lack of content in certain academic areas" then he should be able to cite specific areas in the primary and secondary literature in which this is the case. He did not do so (nor do most of the rest of the commentators here), and so he is not making an "argument" at all, he is merely expressing his opinion about a field in which he has either not read the primary and secondary literature, or which he has read this literature, but wishes to assert that it doesn't exist.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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Let me clarify sentence #2 in the first paragraph of comment #48. When I wrote "I have stated that all of the authors of all of the books cited have done precisely this," what I meant was that the authors have indeed provided a testable hypothesis for the evolution of the capacity for religious experience, and that two of the authors had gone further to suggest a testable hypothesis for the context within which this capacity has evolved. Sorry if my original syntax was confusing.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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In #42, TCS asserts:
"...you cite a book that purports to use evolutionary explanations of religious belief, but fails to follow through."
Please cite exactly where in the books I have cited that the authors "fail to follow through" in their use of evolutionary psychology to explain the capacity for religious belief. I have stated that all of the authors of all of the books cited have done precisely this, and that two of them (Atran and Wilson) have taken their analysis further, suggesting an ecological and social context within which this capacity has most likely evolved. And, while you're at it, would you like to propose an alternative hypothesis for the origin of the capacity for religious experience in humans, and provide citations to at least secondary sources in the scientific literature? I suspect that most of the people following this thread would be very interested in such an hypothesis, and in evaluating for themselves the empirical research supporting it.Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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To sum up on the question of the origin of atheism: it is my tentative conclusion that most atheists come to their beliefs as the result of learning to disregard the inferences that are suggested to their conscious minds by the operation of their “innate agency detectors”.
We're not talking "god genes" here, are we?Alan Fox
May 4, 2009
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Allen, I actually think Joseph's comment at #31 was very content full and not an ad hominem. He was making an observation about the lack of content in certain academic areas and to be countered there should be some examples provided to discuss. Joseph frequently makes the point that this so called theory does not predict anything so of what use is it. It is a point that a lot of here have sympathy with.jerry
May 4, 2009
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In #42 TCS wrote:
"Nearly every book on human psychology I read starts out with musings about evolutionary psychology, and then shifts to the real studies or clinical observations."
I didn't ask about the secondary sources you have read on human psychology, I asked about the primary and secondary sources you have consulted in evolutionary psychology upon which you have based the conclusions you wrote in comment #23. Please list at least the last five relevant journal articles (i.e. primary sources) and at least one textbook (i.e. secondary source) in evolutionary psychology upon which you have based your conclusions. It would help to use APA citations, but if you are unfamiliar with this format, I suppose any format would do... BTW, the links you posted in comments #15 and #23 are all to blog posts and articles in the popular press, except for one which links to a book at Amazon.com (another tertiary reference). In case you aren't aware of this, blog posts and articles in Psychology Today don't qualify as either primary or secondary sources, nor do references to books published by scientists for the lay public. And, despite most of the comments posted here on a regular basis, this website is supposed to be about science, not distortions or misrepresentations of it drawn from blog posts or the popular press. Just check the masthead... Have you ever actually read anything in the primary or secondary literature of evolutionary psychology, TCS? Just curious...Allen_MacNeill
May 4, 2009
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