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News-watch: yet another incident of mass violence in FL, USA — where is this nihilism coming from?

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First, condolences and prayers for victims and families.

Daily Mail has a useful header that seems to capture key themes to ponder as we head into the weekend:

These was of course — within minutes — the usual talking point exchange on firearms, gun-free [= target-rich] zones, mental illness and effects of certain antidepressants, affiliations (Antifa and Islamism have also been suggested and there is a picture of him in a MAGA hat) and the like, etc.

U/D: My email inbox has a link to Townhall that points to a claim that “Leon County law enforcement sources told the Tallahassee Democrat that they could not find information linking Cruz, 19, to the Republic of Florida Militia, as first reported by the group’s self-proclaimed leader Jordan Jereb.” So, that one is a bit of a mystery.

My own view is that there need to be mental illness facilities that can effectively detain potentially violent inmates, that we do need to look at effects of drugs and that schools, organisations and public meetings need oversight by an organised, armed civilian marshal corps. Including churches. I have even suggested the Tavor in semi-automatic form and a 6.5 mm Grendel loading, and would add 9 mm pistols where such would be a better fit. That coach should never have been forced to try to use his body as a shield. Obviously, one guard was not enough. Where, too, four or five people (at least two armed), would credibly be able to take down such a would-be shooter in a case where “when seconds count, the police are minutes away.”

While I am at it, if he was repeatedly reported (including to the FBI), was expelled and in a school for the troubled, how was he able to organise and carry out such an attack?

However, we need more.

What is it that is eating out our civilisation and is sending the message to those on the fringes that instead of cherishing one’s neighbour one can view and treat one’s neighbour as little more than a target. Perhaps, all too literally.

Let me add a remark by Pat Buchanan, which points to a further factor:

>>While this massacre may be a product of mental illness, it is surely a product of moral depravity. For this was premeditated and plotted, done in copycat style to the mass killings to which this country has become all too accustomed.

Nikolas Cruz thought this through. He knew it was Valentine’s Day. He brought his fully loaded AR-15 with extra magazines and smoke grenades to the school that had expelled him. He set off a fire alarm, knowing it would bring students rushing into crowded halls where they would be easy to kill. He then escaped by mixing in with fleeing students.

The first ingredient, then, was an icy indifference toward human life and a willingness to slaughter former fellow students to deliver payback for whatever it was Cruz believed had been done to him at Douglas High.

In his case, the conscience was dead, or was buried beneath hatred, rage or resentment at those succeeding where he had failed. He had been rejected, cast aside, expelled. This would be his revenge, and it would be something for Douglas High and the nation to see – and never forget.

Indeed, it seems a common denominator of the atrocities to which we have been witness in recent years is that the perpetrators are nobodies who wish to die as somebodies.

If a sense of grievance against those perceived to have injured them is the goad that drives misfits like Cruz to mass murder, the magnet that draws them to it is infamy. Infamy is their shortcut to immortality.>>

Maybe, we need to ponder a point raised by Bryan, in the 1920’s — though it will doubtless excite ire in some quarters:

>>Darwinism leads to a denial of God. Nietzsche carried Darwinism to its logical conclusion and it made him the most extreme of anti-Christians . . . . As the [First World] war [of 1914 – 1918] progressed I [William Jennings Bryan was from 1913 – 1915 the 41st US Secretary of State, under President Wilson] became more and more impressed with the conviction that the German propa-ganda rested upon a materialistic foundation. I se-cured the writings of Nietzsche and found in them a defense, made in advance, of all the cruelties and atrocities practiced by the militarists of Germany. [It didn’t start with the Nazis!] Nietzsche tried to substitute the worship of the “Su-perman” for the worship of God. He not only re-jected the Creator, but he rejected all moral standards. He praised war and eulogized hatred because it led to war. He denounced sympathy and pity as attributes unworthy of man. He believed that the teachings of Christ made degenerates and, logical to the end, he regarded Democracy as the refuge of weaklings. He saw in man nothing but an animal and in that animal the highest virtue he recognized was “The Will to Power”—a will which should know no let or hin-drance, no restraint or limitation . . . . His philosophy, if it is worthy the name of philos-ophy, is the ripened fruit of Darwinism — and a tree is known by its fruit . . . .

The corroding influence of Darwinism has spread as the doctrine has been increasingly accepted. In the American preface to “The Glass of Fashion” these words are to be found: “Darwinism not only justifies the sensualist at the trough and Fashion at her glass; it justifies Prussianism at the cannon’s mouth and Bol-shevism at the prison-door. If Darwinism be true, if Mind is to be driven out of the universe and accident accepted as a sufficient cause for all the majesty and glory of physical nature, then there is no crime or vio-lence, however abominable in its circumstances and however cruel in its execution, which cannot be justi-fied by success, and no triviality, no absurdity of Fash-ion which deserves a censure: more — there is no act of disinterested love and tenderness, no deed of self- sac-rifice and mercy, no aspiration after beauty and excel-lence, for which a single reason can be adduced in logic.” [The Menace of Darwinism, pp. 52 – 54. Emphases and explanatory parentheses added.]>>

Is this one root of what we are seeing? This is worth pondering, too. For, nihilism, surely, is not distilling itself out of thin air and imposing itself on us. END

PS: As it has come up, some BBC numbers, c 2007 when policy on holding the 50 rounds at home changed:

PPS: Here is an illustration on how Israeli Teachers protect their charges in loco parentis:

Are Israeli Teachers armed? Notice two adults, one on obvious overwatch for an outing carrying an instantly recognisable US WW2 issue/era M1 carbine [not a likely equipment for a security guard or a soldier on active duty], the other interacting more closely with the children. And of course we do not know if the second adult has a concealed weapon. This image is of course scoffed at, but it makes the point — armed overwatch, some open, some not.
Comments
MB, your numbers were simply wrong -- for civilian numbers; for military, the implication is essentially every soldier's home. In a moment, some figs for the OP. KFkairosfocus
February 16, 2018
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“MB, you overlooked that essentially every Swiss male is drafted into the army.“ No I didn’t. I actually commended their idea of mandatory service. The gun numbers I cited include these service weapons.Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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F/N: Read on Switzerland: https://www.scribd.com/doc/24621951/Swiss-Army-in-WWII KF PS: The Swiss gun debate c 2007 (the 50 rd immediate reserve largely removed but open to be restored in a crisis): http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/soldiers-can-keep-guns-at-home-but-not-ammo/970614kairosfocus
February 16, 2018
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Truth, those who have played politics of division will likely eventually get what they have stoked up. It will not be pretty. Already, a major political party and its agit-prop arm are very close to implying that they will not accept elections that do not go their way and will use mind-bending power to smear and discredit whoever they don't like. Wikipedia is likely a look at a very close-term future, and somebody with nothing to lose is going to resort to rule 303. KFkairosfocus
February 16, 2018
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MB, you overlooked that essentially every Swiss male is drafted into the army. The weapons I speak of were there per mobilisation, sitting next to uniforms and kit, ready to go; the inference was, you may have to fight through to your unit. They were not personal weapons. KF PS: On second amdt debates and organised compulsory training and service, there is a point for courses in school, registration and training: every child in the cadets so to speak. I have spoken of a civilian marshal corps. That will get increasingly realistic as chaotic disintegration proceeds.kairosfocus
February 16, 2018
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MB @ 7: "Sadly, we view our constitution as our second Bible. Inerrant and immutable." The U.S. Consitution has been amended 18 times (the first ten amendments were ratified collectively) for a total of 27 amendments. It obviously isn't inerrant and immutable, and I have never met a person who thinks it is. Also, it is a mistake to think that people who like and support the Second Amendment somehow equate the Constitution with the Bible. Millions of Second Amendment supporters have no religious affiliation at all. The real problem for anti-gun people is that they do not have the votes to amend the Second Amendment, nor do they have enough votes on the Supreme Court to neuter it via judicial decree. An even bigger problem is the fact that the U.S. now consists of two very large dominant tribes (with smaller tribes nestled within each) that absolutely hate each other. The cultural division in this country is very dangerous... and getting worse.Truth Will Set You Free
February 16, 2018
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"MB, You have conveniently left off say Switzerland, where for decades essentially every household had in a cupboard a full auto battle rifle, ammunition and uniform, plus of course training." This simply is not true. Gun ownership in Switzerland is about 24/100 people. Canada's is even higher than that at just over 30/100. US is just over 100/100. Many other countries in Europe have a higher gun ownership than Switzerland. What I agree with with respect to Switzerland is the fact that they have mandatory service, as does Israel. If you are going to allow people to own guns, it is in the country's best interest to make sure that they are properly trained in their use. What training is required before you can purchase a gun in the US? I am not against gun ownership. But I do not believe that it should be a right. It should be a privilege, like a driver's licence. Not frivolously restricted but with background checks, training requirements, storage requirements and the like. "It suggests that population per square mile is a determining factor." It may be, but it is my understanding that parts of Canada are very densely packed, mostly along the border with the US. The population of Toronto is the forth largest in north america, only surpassed by New York, Las Angeles and Mexico City.Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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Suggesting that population size is not the determining factor.
It suggests that population per square mile is a determining factor. Add to that the fact that gun laws appear to be a joke, a society that allows the wholesale slaughter of its most vulnerable, defenseless gatherings of our young and the spread of "the purposeless doctrine", this is to be expected.ET
February 16, 2018
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MB, You have conveniently left off say Switzerland, where for decades essentially every household had in a cupboard a full auto battle rifle, ammunition and uniform, plus of course training. When particular types of artillery were superseded for the Army, individuals were encouraged to purchase. For many decades, no incidents. IIRC there was one recently. Then over the past few years, we have had France, with extremely strict gun ownership restrictions, only to have Paris turn into a shooting gallery. Further, in the US 100+ millions have 300+ million guns and a serious gun confiscation effort WILL trigger a civil war; so the pols and agit prop operators are playing a dangerous polarisation game, now coming back to haunt them. Plus, with porous borders and a drugs trade, weapons cannot be locked out. There are also signs that terrorists are targetting. In short, a very serious and sober-minded analysis is needed. Part of that will underscore a connection to antidepressants etc, part will show links to nihilism [and UD's President, who weighed in above, is THE world's expert on the mindset of the Columbine shooters]. If he points to Nietzsche, believe him, where, so did Bryan 100 years ago. And more. KF PS: You have also glided over what the Israelis have done.kairosfocus
February 16, 2018
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"Population of Canada = 36.6 million" And had zero mass shootings in 2017. "Population of CALIFORNIA = 39.5 million" And had 32 mass shootings in 2017. Suggesting that population size is not the determining factor. I don't know what the solution is but we should look to what other countries have done and see if any of them can work here. Unreservedly protecting everyone's 2nd amendment rights is obviously not working.Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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Population of Canada = 36.6 million Population of CALIFORNIA = 39.5 millionET
February 16, 2018
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I did a little more digging on Canada vs US and mass shootings. There was a recent looking at recent mass shootings and whether the killers could have obtained the guns in Canada. An interesting read. http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/would-canadian-gun-laws-have-stopped-americas-worst-mass-shootersMolson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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"Theism predicts two things about evil: that it exists, and that we are not able to entirely comprehend it. Evil exists because the created universe is not God, but His creation, so it must of necessity fall short of God, who is perfectly Good. After all, if the universe were perfectly good, without evil, it would just be God. If the universe is God’s creation, then it must fall short of perfection, and it must contain evil, understood as the deprivation of good. So Goff is mistaken that theism predicts a perfect cosmos, free from evil. Theism posits a perfect God, and a creation necessarily short of perfection. Theism seems to have gotten this “prediction” quite right, because the cosmos is certainly short of perfection. Theism predicts evil in the world, precisely because God is Good and because the world is not God. -Michael Egnor https://evolutionnews.org/2018/02/cosmic-fine-tuning-and-the-problem-of-evil/ In other words, there would no universe, no Earth no human society, unless there was evil, so ultimately God allowed evil in order for material existence to be... According to Dr. Egnor's reasoning, no matter how difficult it could be to understand it, one can't help but conclude that God must be, at least indirectly, responsible for evil, which would also include the recent shooting in Florida... God allowed the existence of the inferior to him universe, but at the price of evil... So much for God's unfathomable love...J-Mac
February 16, 2018
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It's sadly ironic, these kind of situations tend to expose some paradoxes of gun ownership. I live in Costa Rica, and right now we have a complex situation with violence because we have one of the highest homicide rates of the region. The homicides mostly happen because there are conflicts between druglords and they usually hire hitmen to kill their rivals or enemies. Sometimes you are walking to get the bus and someone gets killed on the same street, the police never arrests the hitmen and we go on and on everyday. Another serious problem are robbery and assault because guns ownership is quite complicated here for the everyday person, so most of the time if you get assaulted you can't defend yourself, and you may killed even if you don't attempt to do it. But for some reason, even in one of the most dangerous zones in the world that is Central America... we don't have school shootings, crime is mostly drug related. Nihilism is the key....kurx78
February 16, 2018
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Then there are statistics. Compare the population of Canada to the USA. Let's learn from those less populated countries and start kicking people out- say about 250 million. Let's see how that goes. :roll: Clearly we need better gun control. The mere fact this loser was able to legally purchase the weapon is a joke. We need one law to rule them all. One Federal Law that requires a common process and has national database access. Only in the military and under command supervision should a teenager be allowed to have and use a gun. That needs to be part of the law.ET
February 16, 2018
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News@17, Mark has some very good points, but are all of these things not also happening in other countries? Without the level mass shootings that we see here? Given that you are Canadian, I would be very interested in your opinion as to why Canada does not see the proliferation of gun violence (specifically mass shootings) that appears to be epidemic south of the border. It is my understanding that Canada is much further along the evolutionism/atheism spectrum than we are. And Canadian youth are exposed to all of the same TV shows, movies, video games and social media that are often blamed for our problems. Yet mass shootings are almost non-non-existant. Surely we can learn something from the Canadian experience on this. Or the Australian, or the European.Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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The problem is the optimization of the defensive and righteous persuasive utility of firearms vs. the capacity for killing unrighteously. Sadly, it's an ethereal equation even if you aren't a politician trying to stay in the lead of a pack of screaming fanatics. If we could take limit high capacity magazines, and only high capacity magazines, I think that would make mass shootings a lot less costly without harming the defensive use of firearms much, or at all in nearly every case. There will be times and places where a 30 round clip could have saved the right person's life, but I would think that it's more likely to help the wrong person take it. This won't stop mass shootings, of course; but it would help restrain the resultant human toll.LocalMinimum
February 16, 2018
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Let's see if we can put it simple enough: Take away purpouse + Lax gun Control = you have a violent, nihilistic individual whot's going to discharge all his hate on inocent people. Culture is also an important variable here obviouslykurx78
February 16, 2018
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"Perhaps their over-the-top liberal policies help soothe the savage beatsies." "And we don’t want that here. Understand?" I wasn't aware that you spoke for all of us.Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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Canadian commentator Mark Steyn puts the technology in perspective:
Gun-control advocates often say that, well, the Second Amendment was passed in the age of muskets, before all these big, scary-looking semi-automatics came along. In fact, there's a mere quarter-century between the death of the last Founding Father (Madison, in 1836) and the invention of the first continuous rapid-fire gun (the Gatling, in 1861). It's a 19th-century technology, like almost everything else other than the computer. But not until the late 20th and early 21st centuries did schoolboys think to use that 19th-century technology to slaughter their classmates.
So we - or at any rate some of us - have changed, and for the worse. And the question is why that is: The decline of organized religion, the rise of ersatz substitutes, the collapse of the family, the spread of mass media, the expansion of education, its descent into social engineering, the epidemic of over-medication, the absence of men, the metastasization of narcissism and the worship of the self... Maybe we could have weathered two or three of these, but, as I've said before, we changed too much too fast - and somewhere in the void a particular combination of factors incubated the depressingly similar young men who gun down their fellow pupils.
News
February 16, 2018
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“There are plenty of things we can do to make schools safe. Fences, locked doors, cameras and armed security come to mind.”
Indeed. But as my wife (former public school teacher) told me last night... schools won't necessarily buy their kids pencils. Who's going to be paying for security? And who in our beloved government is going to enforce new gun laws (which is a dangerous proposition) when they don't/can't enforce laws already on the books? Andrewasauber
February 16, 2018
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KF, students learn what they are taught. And many of those students act on the lesson. Eric Harris, for example, was a devotee of Nietzsche. It is not hard to connect the dots from Darwin to Nietzsche. And it is not hard to connect the dots from Nietzsche to at least some mass shooters. See my post on Columbine here.Barry Arrington
February 16, 2018
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Perhaps their over-the-top liberal policies help soothe the savage beatsies. And we don't want that here. Understand?ET
February 16, 2018
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"Molson is clueless. Abortions stops the lives of millions per year. And those are our must vulnerable and who need us the most. People who are OK with abortions but rail against guns are the worst type of hypocrite." Where did you get the idea that I was OK with abortions? "There are plenty of things we can do to make schools safe. Fences, locked doors, cameras and armed security come to mind." This is true. But nobody seems to want to find out why these types of security measures are not usually needed in other countries.Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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Molson is clueless. Abortions stops the lives of millions per year. And those are our must vulnerable and who need us the most. People who are OK with abortions but rail against guns are the worst type of hypocrite. There are plenty of things we can do to make schools safe. Fences, locked doors, cameras and armed security come to mind.ET
February 16, 2018
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I don't often post things from social media, but I think this one puts things in perspective:
1967 - Jayne Mansfield is killed when her car runs under the rear end of a tractor trailer. Since then, all trailers have a DOT bar at the rear to keep cars from going under them. 1982 - Seven people die when Tylenol packaging was tampered with. Since then, it takes a PhD, channel locks, and a sharp object to get into a bottle of pills. 1995 - A bombing using a certain kind of fertilizer, solution grade ammonium nitrate, killed 168 people, so the government imposed severe restrictions on the purchase of that fertilizer. 2001 - One person attempts to blow up a plane with a shoe bomb. Since then, all air travellers have to take off their shoes for scanning before being allowed to board. Since 1968 - 1,516,863 people have died from guns on American soil. Gun violence kills an average of 168 people every two days! Now, the problem apparently can't be solved except with thoughts and prayers.
Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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Then why is this not happening in other countries with less “purpose” than ours?
Is that supposed to be an argument? Perhaps their over-the-top liberal policies help soothe the savage beatsies.ET
February 16, 2018
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"Of course it is. Take away purpose and this is what happens." Then why is this not happening in other countries with less "purpose" than ours?Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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I think that your suggestion that the growth of evolutionism and atheism may be a contributing cause (if no a root cause), is simply not supported by reality.
Of course it is. Take away purpose and this is what happens.ET
February 16, 2018
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I think that your suggestion that the growth of evolutionism and atheism may be a contributing cause (if no a root cause), is simply not supported by reality. Of all of the western countries, the US has one of the largest percentage of people who do not believe in evolution, and one of the higher percentages of practicing Christians, yet none of the more atheist/secular countries have the gun violence that we do. Their increased secularism causes all sorts of other problems, but increased violence simply is not one of them. Sadly, we view our constitution as our second Bible. Inerrant and immutable. Does anybody really believe that the founding fathers would have written the second amendment in the way they did if they could foresee the technological advance in armaments? They wrote this when flint-lock was the most advance hand-held weapon. Your suggestion of armed marshals in schools, although possibly necessary, is simply a bandaid. It does not get to the root of the problem. We live in a country where we prevent people from flying if they are on the terrorism watch list, but do not prevent them from legally buying guns.Molson Bleu
February 16, 2018
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