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Bad news: New atheism is still over


It’s been so easy to get people to take the claims for design in nature seriously after they’ve been inundated by a huge dump of new atheism. But hey, the easy stuff never lasts:

To be sure, New Atheists could be very, very bad at arguing that God does not exist. There was, for example, Lawrence Krauss writing a book about how something can come from nothing while attributing material qualities to the latter. There was Richard Dawkins trying to refute the famous “Five Ways” of Aquinas without even attempting to understand their terms. (“Whereof one cannot speak,” groaned Wittgenstein, “Thereof one must remain silent.”) There was Christopher Hitchens striding into philosophy like an elephant onto an ice skating rink and saying:

…the postulate of a designer or creator only raises the unanswerable question of who designed the designer or created the creator.

Why is it unanswerable? People have certainly tried to answer it. Answers readily came centuries prior to Hitchens himself, actually. Hitchens is free to take issue with Aquinas’ distinction between contingent and necessary existence if he wants, but he’s not free to suggest no answers have been offered. How does the concept of the “necessary being,” for example, fail? Hitchens offers no sign of knowing what it is, because that “unanswerable” is not a logic conclusion but a rhetorical sledgehammer swung at the reader’s skull.

I know atheists can make better arguments. But the New Atheists never felt obliged to, because they were so confident in their own rationality that they never learned about the ideas they were mocking.

Ben Sixsmith, “New Atheism: An Autopsy” at Arc Digital

Fair cop.

Sixsmith also talks about elevatorgate and a few other stories from the glory days. Don’t miss it.

Oh yes, the elevator row from the glory days …

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Seversky December 3, 2019 at 8:10 am Good news, good ol’ down-home atheism/materialism/naturalism is still going strong.and still waiting for compelling evidence for the claim that the Christian God actually exists..
The evidence is there that He exists. When you want to look for it you will find it. We are in an Information Age. bill cole
Seversky @ 2 and any other evolutionists I'm still waiting for compelling evidence to support macro evolution. Not one atheist has ever shown a positive mutation exists in nature. Without positive mutations, there can be no evolution. Not one atheist has ever come up with a theory to explain how you go from no life to life. You cannot get something from nothing. Not one atheist can explain the constants that exist in the universe. There is no evidence to support the claim at all and all atheists have is circular reasoning and attacks. They are the ones that lack a single shred of proof to prove their position. BobRyan
F/N: I see, "the postulate of a designer or creator only raises the unanswerable question of who designed the designer or created the creator." Someone here does not understand logic of being, necessary vs contingent being and reality-root. KF kairosfocus
From the article cited in the OP:
Religion had initially served as an answer for why half of America insisted on voting Republican, but as the liberal coalition began to contain “too many Catholic Latinos, too many Muslim Arabs, too many Baptist African-Americans,” faith became an unattractive explanation and was replaced by “sexism and racism.” Suddenly, the defining feature of GOP voters wasn’t a faith-based approach to politics, according to this analysis, but holding to views on gender and race that progressives found deplorable. In concert with this shift from the GOP is the party of the religious to the GOP is the party of the bigots, Alexander maintains that a corresponding shift took place in which New Atheists (whose dominant frame is anti-God) became progressives (whose dominant frame is anti-bigotry). That might be true for some. (PZ Myers of the Pharyngula blog comes to mind.) But it’s at best an incomplete explanation. Sure, Alexander admits that “atheists are heavily affiliated with the modern anti-social justice movement,” like Sam Harris, Peter Boghossian, Michael Shermer, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, and the ghost of Christopher Hitchens. But:
“That’s because the only people remaining in the atheist movement are the people who didn’t participate in the mass transformation into social justice. It is no contradiction to say both “Most of the pagans you see around these days are really opposed to Christianity” and “What ever happened to all the pagans there used to be? They all became Christian.”
But this ignores the fact that “anti-SJW” atheists have lost interest in the argument as well.
The problem for any theory of social justice for atheism (new or old) is that atheism does not provide any basis for interpersonal morality or universal human rights. So the SJW movement is for them a non-starter. It also undermines so-called secular progressivism itself because it is also basically atheistic. In other words, progressivism is a mirage with no real moral foundation and no real moral or "social justice" goals. john_a_designer
Good news, good ol’ down-home atheism/materialism/naturalism is still going strong...
In the minds of the willfully ignorant, perhaps. Good ol’ down-home atheism/materialism/naturalism still relies solely on faith. ET
Seversky states
Good news, good ol’ down-home atheism/materialism/naturalism is still going strong.and still waiting for compelling evidence for the claim that the Christian God actually exists..
States the man who blatantly ignores, or tries to superficially rationalize away, the many findings of modern science that have falsified the predictions of atheistic materialism at every turn and, in the process, have verified the predictions of Christian Theism: The materialistic and Theistic philosophy make, and have made, several contradictory predictions. These contradictory predictions, and the evidence found by modern science, can be tested against one another to see if either materialism or Theism is true.
1. Naturalism/Materialism predicted space-time energy-matter always existed. Theism predicted space-time energy-matter were created. Big Bang cosmology now strongly indicates that time-space energy-matter had a sudden creation event approximately 14 billion years ago. 2. Naturalism/Materialism predicted that the universe is a self sustaining system that is not dependent on anything else for its continued existence. Theism predicted that God upholds this universe in its continued existence. Breakthroughs in quantum mechanics reveal that this universe is dependent on a ‘non-local’, beyond space and time, cause for its continued existence. 3. Naturalism/Materialism predicted that consciousness is an ‘emergent property’ of material reality and thus should have no particularly special position within material reality. Theism predicts consciousness precedes material reality and therefore, on that presupposition, consciousness should have a ‘special’ position within material reality. Quantum Mechanics reveals that consciousness has a special, even a central, position within material reality. - 4. Naturalism/Materialism predicted the rate at which time passed was constant everywhere in the universe. Theism predicted God is eternal and is outside of time. – Special Relativity has shown that time, as we understand it, is relative and comes to a complete stop at the speed of light. (Psalm 90:4 – 2 Timothy 1:9) - 5. Naturalism/Materialism predicted the universe did not have life in mind and that life was ultimately an accident of time and chance. Theism predicted this universe was purposely created by God with man in mind. Scientists find the universe is exquisitely fine-tuned for carbon-based life to exist in this universe. Moreover it is found, when scrutinizing the details of physics and chemistry, that not only is the universe fine-tuned for carbon based life, but is specifically fine-tuned for life like human life (R. Collins, M. Denton).- 6. Naturalism/Materialism predicted complex life in this universe should be fairly common. Theism predicted the earth is extremely unique in this universe. Statistical analysis of the hundreds of required parameters which enable complex organic life to be possible on earth gives strong indication the earth is extremely unique in this universe (G. Gonzalez; Hugh Ross). - 7. Naturalism/Materialism predicted it took a very long time for life to develop on earth. Theism predicted life to appear abruptly on earth after water appeared on earth (Genesis 1:10-11). Geochemical evidence from the oldest sedimentary rocks ever found on earth indicates that complex photosynthetic life has existed on earth as long as water has been on the face of earth. - 8. Naturalism/Materialism predicted the first life to be relatively simple. Theism predicted that God is the source for all life on earth. The simplest life ever found on Earth is far more complex than any machine man has made through concerted effort. (Michael Denton PhD) - 9. Naturalism/Materialism predicted the gradual unfolding of life would (someday) be self-evident in the fossil record. Theism predicted complex and diverse animal life to appear abruptly in the seas in God’s fifth day of creation. The Cambrian Explosion shows a sudden appearance of many different and completely unique fossils within a very short “geologic resolution time” in the Cambrian seas. - 10. Naturalism/Materialism predicted there should be numerous transitional fossils found in the fossil record, Theism predicted sudden appearance and rapid diversity within different kinds found in the fossil record. Fossils are consistently characterized by sudden appearance of a group/kind in the fossil record(disparity), then rapid diversity within that group/kind, and then long term stability and even deterioration of variety within the overall group/kind, and within the specific species of the kind, over long periods of time. Of the few dozen or so fossils claimed as transitional, not one is uncontested as a true example of transition between major animal forms out of millions of collected fossils. - 11. Naturalism/Materialism predicted animal speciation should happen on a somewhat constant basis on earth. Theism predicted man was the last species created on earth – Man (our genus ‘modern homo’ as distinct from the highly controversial ‘early homo’) is the last generally accepted major fossil form to have suddenly appeared in the fossil record. (Tattersall; Luskin)– 12. Naturalism/Materialism predicted that the separation of human intelligence from animal intelligence ‘is one of degree and not of kind’ (C. Darwin). Theism predicted that we are made in the ‘image of God’- Despite an ‘explosion of research’ in this area over the last four decades, human beings alone are found to ‘mentally dissect the world into a multitude of discrete symbols, and combine and recombine those symbols in their minds to produce hypotheses of alternative possibilities.’ (Tattersall; Schwartz). Moreover, both biological life and the universe itself are found to be ‘information theoretic’ in their foundational basis. 13. Naturalism/Materialism predicted much of the DNA code was junk. Theism predicted we are fearfully and wonderfully made – ENCODE research into the DNA has revealed a “biological jungle deeper, denser, and more difficult to penetrate than anyone imagined.”. - 14. Naturalism/Materialism predicted a extremely beneficial and flexible mutation rate for DNA which was ultimately responsible for all the diversity and complexity of life we see on earth. Theism predicted only God created life on earth – The mutation rate to DNA is overwhelmingly detrimental. Detrimental to such a point that it is seriously questioned whether there are any truly beneficial, information building, mutations whatsoever. (M. Behe; JC Sanford) - 15. Naturalism/Materialism predicted morality is subjective and illusory. Theism predicted morality is objective and real. Morality is found to be deeply embedded in the genetic responses of humans. As well, morality is found to be deeply embedded in the structure of the universe. Embedded to the point of eliciting physiological responses in humans before humans become aware of the morally troubling situation and even prior to the event even happening. 16. Naturalism/Materialism predicted that we are merely our material bodies with no transcendent component to our being, and that we die when our material bodies die. Theism predicted that we have minds/souls that are transcendent of our bodies that live past the death of our material bodies. Transcendent, and ‘conserved’, (cannot be created or destroyed), ‘non-local’, (beyond space-time matter-energy), quantum entanglement/information, which is not reducible to matter-energy space-time, is now found in our material bodies on a massive scale (in every DNA and protein molecule).
And here is a defense against Seversky's flimsy naturalistic counterclaims
(January 2019 - defense of all 16 predictions against Seversky’s flimsy naturalistic counterclaims) https://uncommondesc.wpengine.com/philosophy/michael-shermers-case-for-scientific-naturalism/#comment-670894
Moreover, modern science is even very good at pointing us to Christianity as the correct solution to the much sought after 'theory of everything'; Specifically, allowing the Agent causality of God ‘back’ into physics, as the Christian founders of modern science originally envisioned,,,, (Isaac Newton, Michael Faraday, James Clerk Maxwell, and Max Planck, to name a few of the Christian founders),,, and as quantum mechanics itself now empirically demands (with the closing of the free will loophole by Anton Zeilinger and company), by rightly allowing the Agent causality of God ‘back’ into physics then that provides us with a very plausible resolution for the much sought after ‘theory of everything’ in that Christ’s resurrection from the dead provides an empirically backed reconciliation, via the Shroud of Turin, between quantum mechanics and general relativity into the much sought after ‘Theory of Everything”. Here are a few posts where I lay out and defend some of the evidence for that claim:
November 2019 - despite the fact that virtually everyone, including the vast majority of Christians, hold that the Copernican Principle is unquestionably true, the fact of the matter is that the Copernican Principal is now empirically shown, (via quantum mechanics and general relativity, etc..), to be a false assumption. https://uncommondesc.wpengine.com/intelligent-design/so-then-maybe-we-are-privileged-observers/#comment-688855 (February 19, 2019) To support Isabel Piczek’s claim that the Shroud of Turin does indeed reveal a true ‘event horizon’, the following study states that ‘The bottom part of the cloth (containing the dorsal image) would have born all the weight of the man’s supine body, yet the dorsal image is not encoded with a greater amount of intensity than the frontal image.’,,, Moreover, besides gravity being dealt with, the shroud also gives us evidence that Quantum Mechanics was dealt with. In the following paper, it was found that it was not possible to describe the image formation on the Shroud in classical terms but they found it necessary to describe the formation of the image on the Shroud in discrete quantum terms. https://uncommondesc.wpengine.com/intelligent-design/experiment-quantum-particles-can-violate-the-mathematical-pigeonhole-principle/#comment-673178 https://uncommondesc.wpengine.com/intelligent-design/experiment-quantum-particles-can-violate-the-mathematical-pigeonhole-principle/#comment-673179
To give us a small glimpse of the power that was involved in Christ resurrection from the dead, the following recent article found that, ”it would take 34 Thousand Billion Watts of VUV radiations to make the image on the shroud. This output of electromagnetic energy remains beyond human technology.”
Astonishing discovery at Christ’s tomb supports Turin Shroud – NOV 26TH 2016 Excerpt: The first attempts made to reproduce the face on the Shroud by radiation, used a CO2 laser which produced an image on a linen fabric that is similar at a macroscopic level. However, microscopic analysis showed a coloring that is too deep and many charred linen threads, features that are incompatible with the Shroud image. Instead, the results of ENEA “show that a short and intense burst of VUV directional radiation can color a linen cloth so as to reproduce many of the peculiar characteristics of the body image on the Shroud of Turin, including shades of color, the surface color of the fibrils of the outer linen fabric, and the absence of fluorescence”. ‘However, Enea scientists warn, “it should be noted that the total power of VUV radiations required to instantly color the surface of linen that corresponds to a human of average height, body surface area equal to = 2000 MW/cm2 17000 cm2 = 34 thousand billion watts makes it impractical today to reproduce the entire Shroud image using a single laser excimer, since this power cannot be produced by any VUV light source built to date (the most powerful available on the market come to several billion watts )”. Comment The ENEA study of the Holy Shroud of Turin concluded that it would take 34 Thousand Billion Watts of VUV radiations to make the image on the shroud. This output of electromagnetic energy remains beyond human technology. http://westvirginianews.blogspot.com/2011/12/new-study-claims-shroud-of-turin-is.html
Colossians 1:15-20 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.
Sev, only as an ideology. Evolutionary Materialistic scientism is inescapably self referentially incoherent and self falsifying. KF kairosfocus
Good news, good ol' down-home atheism/materialism/naturalism is still going strong.and still waiting for compelling evidence for the claim that the Christian God actually exists.. Seversky
Atheists never ask themselves any hard questions, since they have no answers. Arrogance is a distinctly human trait and does not exist in nature. Arrogance is defined as an attitude of superiority manifested in an overbearing manner. Arrogance is from the root word 'arrogate' and means to claim without justification. Atheists make a great deal of claims without any actual justification to support their views. They have no evidence to support their claims, which is why they don't want a real debate. They will lose every time due to a lack of actual evidence. They rely on circular reasoning and demand the impossible from anyone who disagrees with them. They never have to respond to the question of life coming from no life. They never have to respond to the question of a lack of evidence of positive mutations. They simply demand others accept what they say and will demean anyone who dares disagree with them. BobRyan

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