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ID Foundations 15(c) — A FAQ on Front-Loading, thanks to Genomicus

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Onlookers, Geno concludes for the moment with FAQ’s:

____________________

Geno: >>

A Testable ID Hypothesis: Front-loading, part C

In the last two articles on front-loading, I explained what the front-loading hypothesis is all about and some research questions we can ask from a front-loading perspective. This article will be an FAQ about the front-loading hypothesis. So, without further introduction, let’s begin (note: some of the content of this FAQ can be found in the previous two articles).

  1. What is front-loading?

Front-loading is the investment of a significant amount of information at the initial stage of evolution (the first life forms) whereby this information shapes and constrains subsequent evolution through its dissipation. This is not to say that every aspect of evolution is pre-programmed and determined. It merely means that life was built to evolve with tendencies as a consequence of carefully chosen initial states in combination with the way evolution works.” Mike Gene, The Design Matrix: A Consilience of Clues, page 147

In short, this ID hypothesis proposes that the earth was, at some point in its history, seeded with unicellular organisms that had the necessary genomic information to shape future evolution. Necessarily, this genomic information was designed into their genomes.

 

  1. How is front-loading different from directed panspermia?

 

In a paper published in the journal Icarus, Francis Crick and Leslie Orgel proposed the hypothesis of directed panspermia. According to this hypothesis, the earth was intentionally seeded with life forms by some intelligence. The front-loading hypothesis goes a step further and proposes that these life forms contained the necessary genomic information to shape the course of future evolution. For example, the origin of metazoan complexity would have been planned and anticipated by the genomic information in the first genomes. Thus, the front-loading hypothesis is inherently teleological and an ID hypothesis.

 

  1. Does front-loading propose that all the genes found in life were in the first life forms?

 

No, it does not. Front-loading does not suggest that all genes were there from the start. Indeed, many genes found in modern life forms are probably the result of purely unplanned mechanisms (gene duplication and subsequent divergence, for example). Nevertheless, genes essential for the origin and development of the metazoan body plan would be present in the first genomes (or have homologs in the first genomes).

 

  1. If genes necessary for the origin of metazoan life forms were placed, then random mutation would have destroyed them and they would decay, right?

 

This is a common objection to the front-loading hypothesis, but it can be easily answered. These genes would be given an important function in the first life forms, such that they would be preserved across deep time. Front-loading doesn’t involve much of simply turning genes (that were previously unexpressed) on at some given time.

 

  1. How could sophisticated molecular systems be front-loaded?

There are two basic solutions to the problem of front-loading sophisticated molecular systems, but more research is needed so that we can find out exactly how these solutions would work in practice. In theory, however, there’s the “bottom up” approach and the “top down” approach to front-loading molecular systems. In the “bottom up” approach, the original cells would contain the components of the molecular machine we want to front-load, but these components would be carrying out functions not related to the function of the molecular machine. Then, somehow (here’s where we need research), something causes them to associate such that they fit nicely with each other, forming a novel molecular machine.

The “top down” approach proposes that the first cells had a highly complex molecular machine, composed of, say, components A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, and J. If we want to front-load a molecular machine composed of components A, B, C, and D, then this highly complex molecular machine contains a functional subset of A, B, C, and D. In other words, components E, F, G, H, and J would simply have to be deleted from the highly complex molecular machine, resulting in a molecular machine composed of A, B, C, and D. This model is actually testable. Under this model, we would tentatively predict that a homologous system of a molecular machine will be more complex if it is more ancient than the molecular machine.

  1. What testable predictions does the front-loading hypothesis make?

There are several testable predictions the front-loading hypothesis makes:

  1. Cytosine deamination. Of the three bases in DNA (adenine, guanine, and cytosine) that are prone to deamination, cytosine is the most likely to undergo deamination. This ultimately results in a C –> T transition. Cytosine deamination often causes severe genetic diseases in humans, so why would a front-loader choose cytosine as a base in DNA? It has been observed that C –> T transitions result in a pool of strongly hydrophobic amino acids, which leads to the following prediction from a front-loading perspective: a designer would have chosen cytosine because it would facilitate front-loading in that mutations could be channeled in the direction of increased hydrophobicity. This prediction would be confirmed if key protein sequences in metazoan life forms were the result of numerous C –> T transitions.
  2. The genetic code. The front-loading hypothesis proposes that the universal optimal genetic code was present at the dawn of life: in other words, we won’t find precursors of sub-optimal genetic codes, because the genetic code was optimal from the start. Further, the front-loading hypothesis predicts that all 20 amino acids would have been used in the first life forms, and that the transcription, translation, and proof-reading machinery would have all been present at the start of life on earth.
  3. Biological complexity. Front-loading predicts that the last universal common ancestor (LUCA) was quite complex, complete with genes necessary for the origin and development of metazoan life forms.
  4. Protein sequence conservation. In eukaryotes, there are certain proteins that are extremely important. For example, tubulin is an important component of cilia; actin plays a major role in the cytoskeleton and is also found in sarcomeres (along with myosin), a major structure in muscle cells; and the list could go on. How could such proteins be front-loaded? Of course, with some of these proteins they could be designed into the initial life forms, but some of them are specific to eukaryotes, and for a reason: they don’t function that well in a prokaryotic context. For these proteins, how would a designer front-load them? Let’s say X is the protein we want to front-load. How do we go about doing this? Well, firstly, we can design a protein, Y, that has a very similar fold to X, the future protein we want to front-load. Thus, a protein with similar properties to X can be designed into the initial life forms. But what is preventing random mutations from basically destroying the sequence identity of Y, over time, such that the original fold/sequence identity of Y is lost? To counter this, Y can also be given a very important function so that its sequence identity will be well conserved. Thus, we can make this prediction from a front-loading perspective: proteins that are very important to eukaryotes, and specific to them, will share deep homology (either structurally or in sequence similarity) with prokaryotic proteins, and importantly, that these prokaryotic proteins will be more conserved in sequence identity than the average prokaryotic protein. Darwinian evolution only predicts the first part of that: it doesn’t predict that part that is in bold text. This is a testable prediction made exclusively by the front-loading hypothesis.

 

  1. Does the front-loading hypothesis suggest that evolution was programmed?

 

No. Front-loading does not propose that all biological innovations were the result of planning and teleology.

 

Conclusion

 

The more I discuss front-loading with its opponents and proponents, the more I will add to this FAQ. Please add any questions, comments, etc., below.

 

About me

Over the years, I have become quite interested in the discussion over biological origins, and I think there is “something solid” behind the idea that teleology has played a role in the history of life on earth. When I’m not doing multiple sequence alignments, I’m thinking about ID and writing articles on the subject, which can be found on my website, The Genome’s Tale.

I am grateful to UD member kairosfocus for providing me with this opportunity to make a guest post on UD. Many thanks to kairosfocus.

Also see The Design Matrix, by Mike Gene.  >>

____________________

So, here we have one specific model for how ID could possibly have been done. Obviously, not the only possibility, but a significant one worthy of investigations. END

Comments
I’ll repeat my question for a third time, since Genomicus has ignored it in the two previous threads, and it became eminently important again in the light of his last comment on this thread: Genomicus said: “The prediction I proposed goes like this: you find a gene in all eukaryotes, and by comparing its sequences across various eukaryotic taxa, you find that it’s probably very important to eukaryotes. On the other hand, you find a gene in all eukaryotic taxa, but it doesn’t seem to be all that important. Front-loading predicts that the former gene is far more probable to share deep homology with prokaryotic genes than the latter gene.” So, what you are saying here is the following: A gene that is highly homologous across eukaryotic taxa is more likely to also be highly homologous in prokaryotic taxa than a gene that is not highly homologous among eukaryotes. That would be a pretty straightforward prediction of ANY theory that assumes common descent. I don’t understand why you think that only frontloading would make this prediction?molch
February 15, 2012
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eigenstate: You stated that:
Because you’ve defined “important” in terms of our observations, because “important” is only determined as post-hoc assessment, then BY DEFINITION your prediction will true. In order for your prediction to hold scientifically, you would have to: 1. Identify which protein sequences you identify as “important”, and declare why they are important, INDEPENDENT of any observation we may have in the field regarding their conservation. 2. Propose those protein sequences as sequences that will be highly conserved as your prediction to be verified by observation. 3. Check our observations. If the basis for “important” is NOT derived from our observations regarding conservation, and we find conservation for those very same sequences you predicted, your golden, and champagne corks start popping all around.
I'm not sure if you quite understand this prediction (that might very well be my own fault in my manner of explaining it). This prediction states that prokaryotic homologs of important genes in eukaryotes and multicellular taxa will be well conserved in sequence identity, more so than the average prokaryotic protein (it is my understanding that you have read part of The Design Matrix; one of the chapters in that book discusses protein sequence conservation across different prokaryotic taxa). So, how do we find out which eukaryotic genes are important, independent of this prediction? That's fairly simple. You can (a) check its levels of sequence conservation across eukaryotic taxa, (b) take a look at its substitution rates per an amount of time relative to other genes, (c) delete that gene in different organisms. Once we find this gene is important in eukaryotes, we can then predict that its prokaryotic homolog will be well-conserved in sequence identity across prokaryotic taxa - more so than the average prokaryotic protein.Genomicus
February 6, 2012
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@Genomicus,
Will reply to you ASAP. Thanks for the link on Mike Gene’s input.
No hurry.eigenstate
February 6, 2012
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eigenstate: Will reply to you ASAP. Thanks for the link on Mike Gene's input.Genomicus
February 6, 2012
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My stance is we exist and there is only one reality behind that existence. It is also my stance that we can determine that reality and that it matters.Joe
February 6, 2012
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Thanks Joe! I think I've got a handle on your stance now. No more questions for the present.Bydand
February 6, 2012
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I do not know what the originally designed populations were, nor what planet they originally inhabited. I infer that living organisms were designed and I understand what we now observe is the result of many, many generations of heritable variance. And again, we can have evolution and not have universal common descent. We can have evolution without humans sharing a common ancestor with knuckle-walkers/ having a knuckle-walker for an ancestor. We can have evolution without having an "inner fish"-> of course except when we eat fish, then we will have an inner fish :) We can have evolution without ever having a new, useful multi-protein configuration.Joe
February 6, 2012
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Thanks for that, Joe. Noted - you're NOT a fan of front-loading. But from posts above, you do seem to believe that OoL was designed, and you have no problem with the fact that evolution has happened since, by means of directed mutations. How is this different from front-loading?Bydand
February 6, 2012
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I don't adhere to front-loading. I do understand its basic concepts and I do understand that there is more than just one flavor. That said I have looked at and into the "evidence" for the OoL and evolution via unplanned, blind, mindless and mechanistic processes and have yet to find anything that would show thiose processes can construct new, useful multi-protein configurations. I then ask myself if there are any other types of processes that could account for multi-protein configurations. And the answer is always "design"- either direct or via a targeted search.Joe
February 6, 2012
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1- Yes I have- to wit: a- the OoL- as in if the OoL was via design then it is a safe bet that evolution is also by design, ergo the mutations are by design b- break-down the internal programming much as one would do in order to understand a computer's program 2- Spetner's book has as much evidence and data for his claims as evos have for theirs. However Spetner offers better logic and reasoning to support his claims. 3- Directed in the same sense computer programs (especially GAs) are directedJoe
February 6, 2012
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Joe, this is a thread about front-loading, and I was trying to get your take on that, is all. I'm not adhering to any particular position here. Why are you trying to avoid telling me what your evidential base is for adhering to your position on front-loading?Bydand
February 6, 2012
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1. No, you didn't, actually, old chap. I've looked again, but if I missed it, please link, and I'll make full apology. 2. Dr Spetner's book contains no evidence or data to support the hypothesis. If I'm wrong, perhaps you could provide a suitable quote from the book. 3. Determinism "The philosophical doctrine that every state of affairs is the inevitable consequence of antecedent states of affairs." So you are not a determinist, but you believe that evolution (with which ID is OK, remember?)is in some form directed. Right?Bydand
February 6, 2012
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And I am trying to get from any evo is any evidential reason they might have for adhering to their position. Ya see I find it useless and fruitless to discuss ID with people who will not ante-up by telling us what they accept. Without that all evos do when presented with the evidence for ID is say "That thar ain't no evidence for ID! No it ain't!"Joe
February 6, 2012
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1- I told you how, you just won't accept it for some reason 2- Dr Spetner has it at any change above and beyond point mutations- he has a book explaining why 3- Define "determinist"? I do not believe things are pre-determined.Joe
February 6, 2012
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Yes, your link is purely equivocation as ID is not anti-evolution. And I cannot predict what any given designer will design next but that does not mean the design will come about via stochastic processes. IOW just because we are ignorant of the internal programming of living organisms does not mean mutation is a stochastic process. As far as anyone knows mutations are as directed as computer programs are. And THAT is why the OoL means EVERYTHING.Joe
February 6, 2012
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@14.1.1.1.4 Thanks for clarification, Dr. Liddle - that's why I've been careful to use the term "result of a stochastic process" Perhaps I should have said "non-intentional stochastic process" for the complete avoidance of doubt? Whatever. What I'm trying to get from Joe is any evidential reason he might have, (not just a visceral dislike of "evolutionism"), for adhering to a "front-loading" hypothesis.Bydand
February 6, 2012
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@14.1.1.1.1 I don't know that it HAS been determined in all cases, Joe. I'm not "declaring" anything. That's why I asked if you know of a way to do it. But it seems you do not.Perhaps you have another reason for supporting a "front-loading" hypothesis? And are you a determinist?Bydand
February 6, 2012
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No, it's not "equivocation", Joe. It means "non-deterministic". So does random, usually, although some people use it to mean "non-intentional" or "equiprobable" as well. So a process can be intentional AND stochastic at the same time. It's not an either/or. And obviously we can't tell whether any given mutation is stochastic, because that makes no sense as a question. The right question is whether mutation is a stochastic process, which we know they, because mutation events are not predictable, individually, but only probabilistically, by determining the probability distributions through observation of their frequencies.Elizabeth Liddle
February 6, 2012
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Nice equivocation- BTW "stochastic" 1 : random; specifically: involving a random variable (a stochastic process) 2 : involving chance or probability : probabilistic (a stochastic model of radiation-induced mutation)Joe
February 6, 2012
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Here you go: http://scholar.google.co.uk/scholar?hl=en&q=evolution&as_sdt=1%2C5&as_ylo=&as_vis=0 By the way, "stochastic" means "non-deterministic". Are you a determinist, these days, Joe?Elizabeth Liddle
February 6, 2012
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OK please point me to this alleged "vast body of scientific literature on the subject".
By the way, did you ever come up with a way of determining whether any given mutation was the result of a “directed” or “stochastic” process?
Have you? Ya see evolutionism claims all mutations are via stochastic processes and I was wondering how that was determined. So perhaps if you could tell us that ten we could tell you how to tell if they are directed. But if your position can just declare all mutations to be stochastic then it is obvioulsy OK for ID to declare at least some are directed-> same standards.Joe
February 6, 2012
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Well, of course I understand that your position is that there is NO science whatever that supports "evolutionism", so I'm not going to bother arguing with that, just point you to the vast body of scientific literature on the subject. By the way, did you ever come up with a way of determining whether any given mutation was the result of a "directed" or "stochastic" process? That would be a great advance for some versions of the "front-loading" hypothesis!Bydand
February 6, 2012
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Whatever Bydand- I am just saying that the way to show us IDists what a "real" hypothesis looks like is to actually produce one tat would support evolutionism. That means all criticisms of this ID hypothesis are from whiners who can't or won't produce one for their position.Joe
February 6, 2012
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Joe, I really don't see any "whining" here. Genomicus and Eigenstate seem to me to be having a civilised debate about "front-loading"; which is both interesting and a pleasure to read, whichever point of view one tends to support. No insults, no ad-hominems, and apparent respect for each others' views, despite disagreement. For once, there was no-one acting like little (or even big) babies.Bydand
February 6, 2012
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@Genomicus, Mike Gene has some comments on your hypothesis (and my objection about prediction) on his blog you may be interested to read: A reason for cytosine deamination FYI.eigenstate
February 5, 2012
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@Genomicus, OK, I appreciate your laying out the conditions you understand would obtain in order to falsification. I recognize your quote as something you earlier provided, and to which I also responded earlier. This isn't a falsifiable prediction for the same reason I pointed out before -- YOU DEFINE YOUR TERMS SO THAT THEY ARE SELF-FULFILLING. You say, in closing:
This prediction would be falsified if the prokaryotic homolog of an important, well-conserved eukaryotic protein was found be no more conserved in sequence identity than the average prokaryotic protein. So, this prediction can be very easily falsified.
Because you've defined "important" in terms of our observations, because "important" is only determined as post-hoc assessment, then BY DEFINITION your prediction will true. In order for your prediction to hold scientifically, you would have to: 1. Identify which protein sequences you identify as "important", and declare why they are important, INDEPENDENT of any observation we may have in the field regarding their conservation. 2. Propose those protein sequences as sequences that will be highly conserved as your prediction to be verified by observation. 3. Check our observations. If the basis for "important" is NOT derived from our observations regarding conservation, and we find conservation for those very same sequences you predicted, your golden, and champagne corks start popping all around. But as it is, you have a tautology: 1. Important protein sequences will be highly conserved, more than average. 2. By "important" we mean "conserved more than average". If you think that's incorrect, there's an easy way to show I'm mistaken: define "important" without making any use of the observed conservation dynamics. If can tell us why they are important INDEPENDENT of their conservation, why they will drive high conservation, then when we observe that conservation, high fives! I'll again refer to GR as a good example of the principle you're missing here. GR did not -- does not -- need to take heed of any heed of the observed dynamics of Mercury's orbit to predict the precession of Mercury's perihelion. Einstein did not need to be even vaguely aware of that data for him to make his prediction. His model for GR produced those predictions, regardless of what had been observed or not. The prediction was thus "blind" to the observations by which it could be tested, and that is the crucial key for the test. This is why that prediction carries epistemic weight, because it couldn't cheat, as you are (unwittingly) trying to do and offer a tautology through postdiction. So, thank you for the response in efforts to provide some basis for falsification based on conservation. But as it stands (and this is now pass two on this without your addressing the tautology problem previously), it cannot be falsified. For any given protein sequence X, if it's pointed out that it's NOT highly conserved, you're safe. You just say "that wasn't an important sequence!". If I ask "how do you determine whether it was important?", all you have provided us so far is the answer "It depends on whether it is highly conserved. Important sequences will be highly conserved". Hopefully the circular nature of this problem is clear, now?eigenstate
February 5, 2012
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Each of these predictions can be falsified in some way. I'll start with just one so that we don't get bogged down with lots and lots of text. Since the FLH prediction (note: you coined the term "Genomicus-Front-Loading-Theory." However, it needs to be emphasized that front-loading is not a theory, but a hypothesis)concerning protein sequence conservation can be most easily falsified in the most clear-cut way, I'll use that example. So, to summarize this prediction:
In eukaryotes, there are certain proteins that are extremely important. For example, tubulin is an important component of cilia; actin plays a major role in the cytoskeleton and is also found in sarcomeres (along with myosin), a major structure in muscle cells; and the list could go on. How could such proteins be front-loaded? Of course, with some of these proteins they could be designed into the initial life forms, but some of them are specific to eukaryotes, and for a reason: they don’t function that well in a prokaryotic context. For these proteins, how would a designer front-load them? Let’s say X is the protein we want to front-load. How do we go about doing this? Well, firstly, we can design a protein, Y, that has a very similar fold to X, the future protein we want to front-load. Thus, a protein with similar properties to X can be designed into the initial life forms. But what is preventing random mutations from basically destroying the sequence identity of Y, over time, such that the original fold/sequence identity of Y is lost? To counter this, Y can also be given a very important function so that its sequence identity will be well conserved. Thus, we can make this prediction from a front-loading perspective: proteins that are very important to eukaryotes, and specific to them, will share deep homology (either structurally or in sequence similarity) with prokaryotic proteins, and importantly, that these prokaryotic proteins will be more conserved in sequence identity than the average prokaryotic protein. Darwinian evolution only predicts the first part of that: it doesn’t predict that part that is in bold text. This is a testable prediction made exclusively by the front-loading hypothesis.
This prediction would be falsified if the prokaryotic homolog of an important, well-conserved eukaryotic protein was found be no more conserved in sequence identity than the average prokaryotic protein. So, this prediction can be very easily falsified.Genomicus
February 5, 2012
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In physics it's called symmetry breaking.Petrushka
February 4, 2012
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eig: "how you suppose that’s connected to..." var TGG = Tryptophan the variable tgg representing the aa trytophan. i just stuck on a non-global javascript var, not to make a C comparison, just a variable/protocol analogy. My open question to anyone is how a non-intelligent law/force determined which specific molecules will represent aa's etc. In the same way in your example, you chose: int x=4 You had several alpha-numeric/case sensitive characters to choose from. But you chose x. x has nothing to do physically or chemically with 4. The genetic code seems to be compiled in the same manner. representations/variables that are executing functions based only on the fact that they have been assigned to do. It seems in a way like maxwells demon had done some tinkering.junkdnaforlife
February 4, 2012
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@junkdnaforlife,
How would the protocol necessary for the origin of the genetic code get established by chance-necessity?
Dunno. As someone who just follows that are of research casually, but with interest, my answer is it was before to you, up a couple of replies: RNA-world scenarios seem the most likely and promise hypotheses going, but there's not much to go on in terms of hard pathway. Progress is being made, and has picked up considerably in the last few years, but this extraordinarily difficult in terms of forensics. I can say that I know one hypothesis that isn't a serious contender -- the "random shuffle" one-time luck scenario where 784 unlikely things have to happen simultaneously, or whatever tornado-in-a-junkyard scenario IDers suppose is the alternative to God doing it. Like the rest of biology, the educated bets are on a series of incremental steps that do not stretch any terrific odds, and may be highly likely or even inevitable, given the physical environment. Making headway on matching plausible environments for that time frame and conducive to these chemical pathways will be the main trick. But it's science, no magic or impossible odds invoked. Just hard work in uncovering the most likely and empirically supported pathways. I'm not at all aware how you suppose that's connected to "var TGG = Tryptophan", which seems vaguely like the C code I was offering, above. How do your program statements connect in here?eigenstate
February 4, 2012
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