Eric Holloway: Why engineering can’t be reduced to the laws of physics

_{Denyse O'Leary

August 7, 2020

Engineering, Intelligent Design, Mind, Physics}

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When we reduce the engineer’s mind to a computer, the source of innovation disappears:

The fundamental problem of modern science is the problem of innovation. Where does novelty come from? This problem shows up in physics, biology, artificial intelligence, and economics…
The source of this information puzzles the respective fields. The puzzle is due to the fact that, while each field can describe the target precisely, using its axioms, none of the fields can describe how the target came to be hit…
The one area where we do not encounter this mystery is engineering. In engineering, the cause of purposeful arrangements of parts is well known. This cause is engineering innovation. Engineers create the technical inventions that run our economy. However, once we get into the engineer’s mind, the mystery reemerges.
Eric Holloway, “Why engineering can’t be reduced to the laws of physics” at Mind Matters News

He argues that the problem how to account for innovation cannot be solved by anything built upon the laws of physics.

Comments

#Safespace. #Cancel JVL.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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If anything the Yonaguni Monument was a quarry site.ET_{August 10, 2020
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Butt-loving has to be celebrated. Alcohol-loving has to be ridiculed. JVL the hypocrite SJW. You owe me an apology.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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Drunkard-'phobes' NEED help. You love bullying drunkards on the Internet. You are moral monsters. #Cancel JVL.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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JVL
You need help.
Your mastery of the understatement is impressive.Mac McTavish_{August 10, 2020
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Querius, when you kept referring to Monty Hall I could only think of “Let’s Make a Deal”, and initially ignored it. My apologies. It was a very entertaining video but I didn’t see any compelling evidence or argument for it being man made or man modified. I think the geologist made the most relevant point when he showed them nearby natural rock formations on land that resembled the “monument”. But, still, very thought provoking.Mac McTavish_{August 10, 2020
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Lol. I 'need' help. Says who? Do you hate drunkards, JVL? Would you like for drunkards to be imprisoned? Or stoned to death? Or would you like to ban us marrying our Johnny Walkers? How des-pi-ca-ble.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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UD moderators, I am a victim of hate speech. Please ban JVL. He hates, mocks and derides drunkards. He is a 19th century ape that practices drunkard-'phobia'.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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Truthfreedom: JVL suggests that being a drunkard is ’embarrassing’. What a disgusting human being. So full of hate and contempt. @ Drunkard Pride. #Cancel JVL. You need help.JVL_{August 10, 2020
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Querius: As you saw in the video, any tooling marks were obviously obliterated by the extremely poor condition of the flat surfaces and the team geologist could not rule out human modifications. Or, they might not ever have been there. But, thank you! You’re actually helping me make my point! I deliberately chose the Yonaguni Monument precisely because it’s somewhat likely to be a natural geological formation with some pretty puzzling features. Again, I’m still not decided on whether humans modified the sandstone to give it 90 degree edges, straight lines, and consistent angular directions. Perhaps. But why? However, I was able to make my point because, as I’d anticipated, you immediately passed judgment and uncritically sided with the current consensus. Simply being doctrinaire is not how science is supposed to work. In addition, you’re still unable to find any issues with simply dismissing the formation as natural without considering any contrary evidence. Hang on. Aside from the fact that there really is no evidence the site was even modified by humans without very clear evidence of design the assumption should be undesigned. Now if you can provide very clear and unambiguous evidence of design at that site then I will reconsider my opinion. If you have time to watch the documentary on the Baltic Anomaly (58 minutes) that I linked to, you can see the same dynamics at work. While it’s again likely to be a geological formation, the Baltic Anomaly is admittedly out of place and the scientists investigating it actually found an additional anomaly near it that could lead to new insights. I'll think about it. So far you've just spent a lot of my time on a site that is almost certainly undesigned. Unfortunately, the sensationalist press prefers to publish it either as an “alien craft” or as a (yawn) completely debunked and boring geological formation. Neither of these extremes are scientific. It depends on the evidence. I don't think geography is boring at all.JVL_{August 10, 2020
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JVL suggests that being a drunkard is 'embarrassing'. What a disgusting human being. So full of hate and contempt. @ Drunkard Pride. #Cancel JVL.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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JVL, As you saw in the video, any tooling marks were obviously obliterated by the extremely poor condition of the flat surfaces and the team geologist could not rule out human modifications. But, thank you! You're actually helping me make my point! I deliberately chose the Yonaguni Monument precisely because it's somewhat likely to be a natural geological formation with some pretty puzzling features. Again, I'm still not decided on whether humans modified the sandstone to give it 90 degree edges, straight lines, and consistent angular directions. However, I was able to make my point because, as I'd anticipated, you immediately passed judgment and uncritically sided with the current consensus. Simply being doctrinaire is not how science is supposed to work. In addition, you're still unable to find any issues with simply dismissing the formation as natural without considering any contrary evidence. If you have time to watch the documentary on the Baltic Anomaly (58 minutes) that I linked to, you can see the same dynamics at work. While it's again likely to be a geological formation, the Baltic Anomaly is admittedly out of place and the scientists investigating it actually found an additional anomaly near it that could lead to new insights. Unfortunately, the sensationalist press prefers to publish it either as an "alien craft" or as a (yawn) completely debunked and boring geological formation. Neither of these extremes are scientific. -QQuerius_{August 10, 2020
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JVL is a disgusting drunkard-'phobe'. A nasty un-evolved bigot. He mocks and derides drunkards. We are born this way and suffer a lot. Who are you to 'judge' us? Hate speech against drunkards should not be allowed. DLM: Drunkard Lives Matter! #Cancel JVL.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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Truthfreedom: JVL insulted and mocked me for being born a drunkard. Hate speech should not be tolerated. Drunkard-‘phobia’ = hate. I want JVL banned. Someone left the playpen unattended.JVL_{August 10, 2020
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JVL insulted and mocked me for being born a drunkard. Hate speech should not be tolerated. Drunkard-'phobia' = hate. I want JVL banned.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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ET: JVL never went to the site. JVL doesn’t know if there are tool marks or not. Show me evidence of tool marks then.JVL_{August 10, 2020
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JVL owes me an apology. Hate speech against drunkards should not be tolerated. Drunkard-'phobia' kills. Apologize or get banned.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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JVL never went to the site. JVL doesn't know if there are tool marks or not.ET_{August 10, 2020
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#Cancel JVL. Drunkard-'phobia' = hate crime.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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Querius: A more extensive, 45 minute version is located here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UbSQOIpkzI Yes, I watched the whole thing. The geologist was very sure and I believe him. What would you look for? Tooling marks, cultural traditions, the absence of other other sites with identical geological forms, right angles and specific angles not due to cleavage planes, orientations, and utility including stairs, platforms and landings, gates, amphitheaters, defensive works, megalithic structures, patterns and regularities, rock carvings, and context with obviously human crafting such as pottery and arrowheads. I didn't see any tooling marks or any of those other things. It's not man made. The Japanese geologist associated with the site (not with Monty Halls’ team) valued two evidences of human activity: one was a stone artifact recovered from the site with a plus shape obviously carved into it (personally, I think it was a primitive boat anchor due to it having holes carved into each end), and a stylized human face that may have been carved into one of the structures–with a pupil in each eye. If it was an anchor, a very primitive one, it could have fallen off a ship. The face is not convincing. The conjecture that this site had evidence of intelligent design obviously provoked much more study than if it were immediately dismissed as a geological feature. This example parallels the additional study into “junk” DNA provoked by the intelligent design paradigm, except that the amount of information represented in DNA is the most densely packed information in the universe. Much more study? That video? My point is that both wild speculation and routine dismissal is not helpful in authentic science. That site is not even a good candidate for design.JVL_{August 10, 2020
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I'm gonna marry my Johnnie Walker.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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JVL would look for 'transgender' bathrooms. A sign of 'civilization'. Beware: JVL is a drunkard-'phobe'. He harasses, mocks and ridicules drunkards on the Internet. He wants drunkards to suffer and die. He is a bully that should be locked up. #Do not stand for bullies. UD: cancel JVL.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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JVL, Monty Hall filmed a more extensive version that also included a geologist. Some of his teams believed it was due to natural forces without human involvement while other's (including Monty Hall) hoped it was man-made. A more extensive, 45 minute version is located here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UbSQOIpkzI The site was once above water and accessible to humans, but what the team couldn't determine was whether the geological forms had been modified by humans. What would you look for? Tooling marks, cultural traditions, the absence of other other sites with identical geological forms, right angles and specific angles not due to cleavage planes, orientations, and utility including stairs, platforms and landings, gates, amphitheaters, defensive works, megalithic structures, patterns and regularities, rock carvings, and context with obviously human crafting such as pottery and arrowheads. The Japanese geologist associated with the site (not with Monty Halls' team) valued two evidences of human activity: one was a stone artifact recovered from the site with a plus shape obviously carved into it (personally, I think it was a primitive boat anchor due to it having holes carved into each end), and a stylized human face that may have been carved into one of the structures--with a pupil in each eye. The real question is whether humans reworked the stone for their purposes. This is still not clear in my opinion. The conjecture that this site had evidence of intelligent design obviously provoked much more study than if it were immediately dismissed as a geological feature. This example parallels the additional study into "junk" DNA provoked by the intelligent design paradigm, except that the amount of information represented in DNA is the most densely packed information in the universe. Another anomaly has been found in the middle of the Baltic Sea. While it's also been both routinely hyped as a UFO and routinely dismissed as a natural geological formation, there is certainly more to discover for anyone with scientific curiosity. An hour-long documentary on the scientific investigation and the new formations discovered is available here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZSCkBzjZSI My point is that both wild speculation and routine dismissal is not helpful in authentic science. -QQuerius_{August 10, 2020
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Drunkard-'phobia' kills. Drunkenness is 'a way of life'. It should be taught in schools.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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Seeing that JVL is reluctant to answer, I will help him out: You cannot have a civilized discussion with people, namely evolutionists in this context, who lie, equivocate and bluff.ET_{August 10, 2020
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#Cancel JVL.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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2+2=677 according to JVL. (Who is an 'statiscian'). The Red Guard = retarded.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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I want JVL 'cancelled'. DLM Drunkard Lives Matter!Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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Being abusive to abusive losers. Get your facts straight or shut up. JVL does neither. JVL thinks that lying, equivocating and bluffing are all OK. That is a definition of a loser. JVL chokesET_{August 10, 2020
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Why 'should' I stop? Because JVL the retard says so? Makes 0 sense. JVL = hypocrite SJW. You have 'ignored' me 20 posts in a row. You are OBJECTIVELY retarded.Truthfreedom_{August 10, 2020
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