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On Why Liars Lie

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In a previous post, I exposed yet another of eigenstate’s outrageous lies.  Then I asked:

The real question is what motivates him to engage in such insane denials? I have to admit that I am utterly flummoxed by it. He knows he is lying. I know he is lying. Everyone else who reads his comment knows he is lying. What in the world motivates such outrageous conduct? If I did not see it myself I would not believe it.

Commenter Charles replies:

He can’t help himself. It has become his nature. I have watched liars lie for years, and I have noted their inability to admit even the simplest of truths. I have observed their self-destructive behavior (as a consequence of losing the trust and charity essential in routine communication and cooperation) over matters both mundane and mission-critical.

This fellow suggests a mechanism for something I have suspected for years:

Dishonesty reduces applied intelligence: re-wires the brain

What I am suggesting is that, although the fundamental efficiency of neural processing is an hereditary characteristic which is robust to environmental differences and changes (short of something like destructive brain pathology – encephalitis, neurotoxin, head injury, dementia etc) – habitual dishonesty (such as is mainstream among the modern intellectual elite) will generate brain changes, and a long-lasting (although probably, eventually, reversible) pathology in applied intelligence – such that what ought to be simple and obvious inferential reasoning becomes impossible.

 

I would add impossible not only in communication with others but equally impossible when alone and merely analyzing (rationalizing) information they find disagreeable.

UPDATE:

After observing Carpathian’s hi-jinks in the comment thread to this post, Charles adds:

Carpathian demonstrates the corollary, why liars lie badly.

A consequence of chronic, pathological intellectual dishonesty is a narrowing of ones sphere of influence to other liars. A further consequence of which is the positive reinforcement from other liars that their lies are credible and compelling. But when those lies are trotted out to an informed and experienced audience, those same lies don’t pass muster and are recognized as vapid and vacuous.

 

Comments
"but it serves a purpose to those who believe in it because it leads to social binding" OK. Does this apply to you and whatever group you associate yourself with? Andrewasauber
September 15, 2015
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asauber:
Yes. And Carp has moved oh so deftly from the Why Do People Lie question to Christians Are Liars Too. Great opinion, but doesn’t address the question.
The topic is why liars lie and I gave an example. I also said why. Please read it again:
It is an insane denial of logic to actually believe in this myth, but it serves a purpose to those who believe in it because it leads to social binding.
Carpathian
September 15, 2015
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Carpathian,
A better one would be blowing up a green house and then magically see it re-assemble itself into a white one.
OK. We'll use this analogy. If a house is blown up and then reassembled into a house again, does that mean it was never blown up? Under your logic it would, which is absurd. I expect you will have some response to even this. But before you post it let me implore you to think about this: The ability to keep typing is not the same as the ability to make a rational argument. You really need to ponder on that, because based on my observations of you over the years, I am not sure you understand it.Barry Arrington
September 15, 2015
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asauber:
“Sacrificing what you know and love for an unknown future is a far greater sacrifice” Carp, So now you’ve moved from Not A Sacrifice to Not Enough Of A Sacrifice? Andrew
Alright, I'll rate the sacrifice on a scale of 0-9: 1) Soldier sacrificing himself for his fellow soldiers - 9. 2) Being crucified and after three days, being resurrected to rule the universe - 0. 9 is far greater than 0.Carpathian
September 15, 2015
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Barry Arrington:
Finally, your assertion that to die and be resurrected is the same as never to have died at all is plain nonsense. If my house is green, and then I paint it white, and then I paint it green again, was it never white? According to your logic it never was, which is absurd.
That is an absurd analogy. A better one would be blowing up a green house and then magically see it re-assemble itself into a white one.Carpathian
September 15, 2015
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"Sacrificing what you know and love for an unknown future is a far greater sacrifice" Carp, So now you've moved from Not A Sacrifice to Not Enough Of A Sacrifice? Andrewasauber
September 15, 2015
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Barry, Yes. And Carp has moved oh so deftly from the Why Do People Lie question to Christians Are Liars Too. Great opinion, but doesn't address the question. Andrewasauber
September 15, 2015
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asauber:
Of course He sacrificed His life. Do you think crucifixion is painless? Don’t you think your own children giving you up and loving them anyway doesn’t require sacrifice?
There are human beings who have put themselves through great agony to save the lives of family, friends or fellow soldiers and none had the guarantee of resurrection. Sacrificing what you know and love for an unknown future is a far greater sacrifice than continuing your existence as a god. If you put an ad in the paper that read, "Wanted: Someone who would be willing to be crucified and then resurrected three days later to rule the universe as the right-hand of God", you would have a line of applicants that stretched across the US.Carpathian
September 15, 2015
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Andrew, Carpathian is engaging in a hoary leftist tradition: False assertions of equivalence. I am old enough to remember how during the Cold War leftists would insist on the moral equivalence of the United States and the Soviet Union. That such assertions were manifestly absurd did not seem to faze them then. It does not faze them now.Barry Arrington
September 15, 2015
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"But I see that behavior in Christians." Christians are sinners just like everyone else. "People lie to themselves every day that the “son of God” gave his life to save the souls of humans." You don't know it's a lie. "Clearly, if Jesus knew he was going to be resurrected in three days, he did not sacrifice his life since he knew his existence would continue in whatever way he saw fit." Of course He sacrificed His life. Do you think crucifixion is painless? Don't you think your own children giving you up and loving them anyway doesn't require sacrifice? This line of argument from Carp clearly indicates he simply is in opposition to Christianity, and his thinking goes from there. Andrewasauber
September 15, 2015
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Carpathian, The death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ is one of the most reliably documented events in all of human history. Your response to all of the evidence is to stamp your foot and call it a myth. While it is typical of your ilk, it is hardly a satisfying, or even rational, response. Evidence, Carpathian, is what I want from you. Your bare unsupported, dogmatic assertions establish nothing whatsoever. You state that the following is a lie: "people lie to themselves every day that the “son of God” gave his life" You need to understand that the word "lie" does not mean "statement supported by massive evidence but which Carpathian nevertheless refuses to believe." Finally, your assertion that to die and be resurrected is the same as never to have died at all is plain nonsense. If my house is green, and then I paint it white, and then I paint it green again, was it never white? According to your logic it never was, which is absurd.Barry Arrington
September 15, 2015
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Barry Arrington:
The real question is what motivates him to engage in such insane denials? I have to admit that I am utterly flummoxed by it. He knows he is lying. I know he is lying. Everyone else who reads his comment knows he is lying. What in the world motivates such outrageous conduct? If I did not see it myself I would not believe it.
But I see that behavior in Christians. People lie to themselves every day that the "son of God" gave his life to save the souls of humans. Clearly, if Jesus knew he was going to be resurrected in three days, he did not sacrifice his life since he knew his existence would continue in whatever way he saw fit. It is an insane denial of logic to actually believe in this myth, but it serves a purpose to those who believe in it because it leads to social binding.Carpathian
September 15, 2015
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For some "looking good in front of their peers" is their god. And if the internet makes them look "bigger", then that's even better. Lies, truth, noise, poetry... what's the difference? Post a long comment and pat yourself on the back. Its a desire for attention and making an illusory icon of themselves. Sad. A person's value does not derive from their online persona. Andrewasauber
September 15, 2015
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I have always said that the most interesting part of the evolution debate is the behavior of those who defend Darwinian or naturalistic processes. Lies are just part of the behavior. We have seen many other tactics they use in their comments. It all comes down to not giving an inch. Otherwise maybe their opponents are right on something and if they are right on something they maybe right on much more. That they cannot accept. It is not just in evolution that these tactics take place. It is most frequently seen in politics or religion. Same behavior. Never give an inch. I would look at who they do not like for various reasons. It is hard to admit the truth to those you do not like.jerry
September 15, 2015
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