“Requirements Explosion”

_{Barry Arrington

October 20, 2011

Intelligent Design}

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In Response to InVivoVeritas, another commenter writes:

Thanks for an interesting post.

As you’re probably aware, there is a well-known phenomenon in software development called the “requirements explosion”. It’s documented, for example, in Robert Glass’s book, Facts and Fallacies of Software Engineering. Even after a specification is complete, and especially as concrete implementation of the specification gets underway (i.e. development of the actual software begins), a plethora of other requirements come out of the woodwork. Several things might account for this, including (1) the requirements were probably incomplete to begin with; (2) not all the implications of the requirements were thought through in advance; (3) the stakeholders don’t like what the “incarnation” of their specifications in functional software actually looks like, or behaves like; etc.

I observe a similar phenomena in the ongoing naturalistic-macroevolution vs. ID debate. The analogy is imperfect, but it seems to me that scientists (ironically, primarily evolutionists) are presiding over an exponential “requirements explosion” of their own creation. The more they drill down into the nitty-gritty details of life, the more strictly bounded and detailed the specifications for viable life become. And, on purely naturalistic grounds, scientists seem less and less able to account for life’s successful implementation(s) of those increasingly complex and demanding specifications.

Kent
Omaha, Nebraska, USA

I find Kent’s post very interesting, because DrRec and Dr. Liddle keep suggesting that it is all really a lot more simple than all that in defense of the un-guided OOL school. Well, DrRec and Dr Liddle, experince suggests that, if anything, we are probably underestimating the problem for un-guided OOL.

Comments

If the laws of physics are a requirement, then is a requirements explosion a sudden increase in the complexity of the laws of physics?
I did not intend to imply that the laws of physics are a requirement, in and of themselves. I'll try to clarify my thoughts. There obviously are many unwritten requirements (perhaps a better word would be "constraints") imposed on life by the physical universe. In our software development analogy, the first organism is the software system: the program, so to speak, which is as yet potential, not actual. The inorganic universe is the platform on and within which two systems must "run": abiogenesis itself, and the product of abiogenesis -- the first life-form. On materialistic grounds, any pre-existing systems or processes that have a role in the genesis of life must play by the rules; they must adhere to the laws of physics. And the first life-form must play according to the same rules that governed the systems that created it. The working assumption of most biologists is materialistic: life is 100% material (i.e. it has no immaterial component), both in its origins and in its actualized forms. How is it, then, that life's genesis seems to be an obvious violation of the second law of thermodynamics? The onus is on the molecular evolutionists to answer that question. However a scientist defines life, at a minimum (at least for Darwinian purposes), the definition must include viability and replicability. Physics places severe constraints on how matter can be arranged to satisfy the viability requirement. For example, if random material processes dysteleologically converge on an arrangement of amino acids as a basis for a life-form, the amino acids must be homochiral. To me, that seems to be a physical constraint. Violation of that constraint, given our current state of knowledge, results in a failure to satisfy the viability requirement, since a mixed-chiral set of amino acids can't be used to construct a functional life-form. Caveat emptor: I am a neophyte in the subject of biology, so my viability example might not be a very good one, and my understanding of chirality in organisms might actually be incorrect. An expert could probably come up with better examples -- probably very many of them. The analogy that I drew between "requirements explosion" in software development and a similar phenomena I observe in biology is imperfect, as I admitted in my initial post on the subject. But I think it's fair to say that many constraints are placed on the design of a life-form by the physical universe within which it (at least in its material components) must function. Functionality (viability) is an explicit requirement of life. Since physical constraints have unavoidable implications for satisfying the viability requirement, it seems appropriate in a loose or informal sense to label those constraints as "requirements". But I'm OK with "constraints" if it helps to avoid ambiguity. There can be no doubt that there has been a "constraints explosion" in biology in the last 60 years or so. Do you agree?kdonnelly_{October 22, 2011
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That a particle or object can 'contain' 'knowledge' of or reference to something apart or outside of itself, this is why its called 'quantum information' ? I think it is certain we are not done and we are not without error, quantum effects will be explained in a more complete theory. Probably a non-spooky regular type interaction I think. Maybe this - there is an aether, it is the sea of neutrinos, light speed is like the ripple on the water compared to the speed of sound in the water.butifnot_{October 22, 2011
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It’s trivial to detach classical information theory from physical representations This sounds like the map/territory thing - information could be real and non physical. Maps may well be wrong, reality remains unfazed. Intelligence assigns meaning to anything it wants - one if by sea, two if by land.butifnot_{October 22, 2011
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I'm trying to reason through a purely physical accounting of events - a concept in brain 1 > innervate muscles > sound waves produced > pressure variations strike ear of another > electric/chemical input to brain 2 > concept (not identicaly equivalent though) in brain 2 ?? Or a concept in brain 1 > innervate muscles > writing produced > light waves strike eyes of another > electric/chemical input to brain 2 > concept (not identicaly equivalent though) in brain 2 ??butifnot_{October 22, 2011
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Until there is a demonstrated understanding of 'brain states', which could be evidenced by say building your own working brain, proclamations are premature.butifnot_{October 22, 2011
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as to: If you’re dealing with information in the macro world, you will eventually have to rearrange some material part of that macro world. If anybody disagrees, please show us an example. https://uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/requirements-explosion/comment-page-1/#comment-405105bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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Well dm, you asked for an example you got it. You don't like the implications because they don't fit your illusory materialistic view of reality? Oh well, that's not my problem!bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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"Three" and "green" are concepts in your mind and they are ultimately formed by atoms and pulses in your brain. To 'give you' a three or a green, I'll have to activate those concepts in your mind. To do that, I'll have to arrange something in threes, whether the something is apples, oranges, RF pulses, xenon atoms, electrons in memory chips or what have you. Your brain has circuitry, made ultimately of atoms, to help you read the printed letters "three" or hear the word "three" and trigger that concept in your mind. French speakers have similar circuitry for "trois". For green, I'll have to arrange some matter so it emits electromagnetic radiation with a wavelength of roughly 520 to 570 nanometers. Atoms in your eye and brain will arrange themselves so as to provide the sensation of green in your mind. Your mind also contains circuitry, also encoded eventually by atoms, which will let you see printed letters on a page and activate the concept of green in your mind. French speakers have circuitry that does the same thing for "vert". In both cases, I'll have to do something to activate a pre-existing concept in your mind. These concepts will have a material base - atoms and impulses in your brain. If someone doesn't have those concepts, they're either very young and haven't formed them yet or they have a serious problem. This is all fairly standard physics, philosophy, psychology and physiology.dmullenix_{October 21, 2011
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BA77, you seem to have some sort of private version of quantum physics that is shared by few others. I keep following your links and finding articles about local realism and other standard quantum physics that are generally considered to be a part of physical reality. Overall, I get the impression that you believe that if there's not a bright shiny sphere at the center of every elementary particle, then God. I disagree. The quantum universe seems bizarre to us macro organisms because we don't deal with it in our ordinary lives so our brains and minds have never had to develop an intuitive understanding of quantum physics like we've had to develop of "ordinary" physics. Nevertheless, the quantum world seems to be "real" in the sense that it follows laws and eventually seems to resolve to "regular" or "macro" physics. Biology operates in the macro world. If you want to change the information in DNA, you rearrange atoms. If you want to change the information in RNA, you rearrange atoms. If you want to change the information in tRNA, you rearrange the atoms. If you want to change the information in a protein, you rearrange the atoms. If you want to change a memory or a thought in your own mind, you will eventually have to rearrange some atoms or at least some electrons to do it. If you're dealing with information in the macro world, you will eventually have to rearrange some material part of that macro world. If anybody disagrees, please show us an example.dmullenix_{October 21, 2011
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Eigenstate, I disagree, but I'm done debating you.bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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Dr. Liddle, It appears very clear to me that you employ an unprofessional tactic in the way you debated this topic: - You avoid pursuing a specific, engineering/scientific – like approach to a particular topic and you respond with generalities, changes in direction and focus, changing the terms or direction of the debate. - There is a strong suspicion that you are missing arguments and your debate tactic is to “float” ABOVE and BESIDES any specific discussion point and make unsupported statements.
Some people have gone so far as to accuse her of intellectual dishonesty. How's that refutation of ID coming along Dr. Liddle?Mung_{October 21, 2011
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As to: No physical entities, no information. If you don’t agree, just try to find an exception to that. notes: It is important to note that the following experiment actually proved that information can be encoded into a photon while it is in its quantum wave state, thus destroying the notion, that was/is held by many, that the wave function was not ‘physically real’ but was merely ‘abstract’. i.e. How can information possibly be encoded into a entity that is not physically real but is merely abstract? It simply would not be possible!
Ultra-Dense Optical Storage – on One Photon Excerpt: Researchers at the University of Rochester have made an optics breakthrough that allows them to encode an entire image’s worth of data into a photon, slow the image down for storage, and then retrieve the image intact. http://www.physorg.com/news88439430.html
further notes:
Wave function Excerpt “wave functions form an abstract vector space”,,, This vector space is infinite-dimensional, because there is no finite set of functions which can be added together in various combinations to create every possible function. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wave_function#Wave_functions_as_an_abstract_vector_space Explaining Information Transfer in Quantum Teleportation: Armond Duwell †‡ University of Pittsburgh Excerpt: In contrast to a classical bit, the description of a (photon) qubit requires an infinite amount of information. The amount of information is infinite because two real numbers are required in the expansion of the state vector of a two state quantum system (Jozsa 1997, 1) http://www.cas.umt.edu/phil/faculty/duwell/DuwellPSA2K.pdf Quantum Computing – Stanford Encyclopedia Excerpt: Theoretically, a single qubit can store an infinite amount of information, yet when measured (and thus collapsing the Quantum Wave state) it yields only the classical result (0 or 1),,, http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/qt-quantcomp/#2.1 Single photons to soak up data: Excerpt: the orbital angular momentum of a photon can take on an infinite number of values. Since a photon can also exist in a superposition of these states, it could – in principle – be encoded with an infinite amount of information. http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/news/7201
Now, I find the preceding to be absolutely fascinating! A photon, in its quantum wave state, is found to be mathematically defined as a ‘infinite-dimensional’ state, which ‘requires an infinite amount of information’ to describe it properly, and this ‘infinite dimensional’ photon can be encoded with information while it is in its 'abstract' infinite dimensional state, and is also found to collapse, instantaneously, and thus ‘non-locally’, to just a ’1 or 0? state, out of a potential infinite number of possibilities that the photon could have collapsed to instead! Now my question to materialistic atheists is this, "Exactly what ’cause’ has been postulated throughout history to be completely independent of any space-time constraints, as well as possessing infinite knowledge, so as to be the ‘sufficient cause’ to explain what we see in the quantum wave collapse of a photon??? John 1:1-5 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
Jeremy Camp – The Way (Official Music Video) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9q6o4sbndVE
bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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Classical information is not a subset of quantum information. Classical information (discrete states like {0|1} ) are conceptual devices humans use to think in tidy ways (literally , binary thinking, here with {1|0}). Nature is not digital. Anywhere. "Digital" is just a useful human-thinking way to categorize and "quantize" analog, real world information. So when referring to "quantum information" it's important not to get the "map" confused with the "territory". Humans have a conceptual models in their heads about quantum information (some of them, anyway), but that is the "map". The "territory", the extramental world, is comprised of quantum information. That information is physical; it doesn't care what you or I think about it, or our attempts to quantize it or simplify it. It is what it is, and from our now rich history of experimenting with it, we have some decent models that are good "maps" to this "territory". Part of the utility in human use of classic information theory is that it allows us to forget out physical representation. It's not a physical model, it's a conceptual model. But that's the rub here, and the reason I take time to point the difference out: REAL information, quantum information, is real because it is physical. Or perhaps its better to say that the physical is real because it is information. So when you post an article like this, it augurs the other direction that you hope and suppose it does. It's trivial to detach classical information theory from physical representations, and thus thermodynamical constraints; the model was never built to incorporate physical representation as an intrinsic. Quantum information, though, is not information at all without physical context. It cannot be divorced from representation, because the representation IS the information.eigenstate_{October 21, 2011
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kdonelly 7.1.2.1 "Is a bit physical? A bit (as a unit of information) may map to the state of some physical entity, but it is not that entity." The bit is the arrangement of some physical entity. Information can be in the form of the timing of electrical pulses, the physical arrangement of atoms in a CD, the arrangement of electrons in a memory chip, currents in a microprocessor, density variations in air, swarms of pulses in a brain or countless other arrangements of physical entities. But there ALWAYS has to be some physical entity present to be arranged. No physical entities, no information. If you don't agree, just try to find an exception to that.dmullenix_{October 21, 2011
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Requirements are relevant to OOL because requirements are imposed implicitly and unavoidably on abiogenesis by the laws of physics.
If the laws of physics are a requirement, then is a requirements explosion a sudden increase in the complexity of the laws of physics? Sorry, it still does not make sense. The problem of requirements and the risk of a requirements explosion come from designing for a specific goal. If there is no design and no goal, then it isn't clear where the requirements explosion would fit in.Neil Rickert_{October 21, 2011
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eigenstate, all I care about is this:
In the case of perfect classical knowledge of a computer memory (zero entropy), deletion of the data requires in theory no energy at all. The researchers prove that “more than complete knowledge” from quantum entanglement with the memory (negative entropy) leads to deletion of the data being accompanied by removal of heat from the computer and its release as usable energy.
Classical Information is shown to be a subset of quantum information by this paper. i.e. they erased information from a computer without consuming energy directly as a result of quantum entanglement. This is about as good as it gets for empirical science. For you to continue to squabble over the second law after entanglement has already 'left the house' with the jewels of information is to completely miss the importance of what they have established. Shoot they even admit that '“We’re working on the edge of the second law. If you go any further, you will break it.”,,, Perhaps I pushed when I said 'PERIOD', but none-the-less, for purposes of directly tying 'transcendent quantum information to encoded classical information, this proof rocks the house,,, PERIOD!!! :)bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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bornagain77, Landauer's insight was always grounded in quantum theory -- that's why "irreversible" is the key term here. All information is quantum information, just abstracted to one level or another (abstracted so humans can think and talk about it, the world itself doesn't care, it is what is). Decoherence is the crucial issue, and the point where information dynamics are unified with physical law: they are inseparable. If you understand what is being related in the article you linked (I suspect you are not tracking with the concepts they are covering), you will understand that while the changes from entanglement are not energy consuming in a direct, local sense, that entanglement itself is very much an energy sink, meaning that your claim that "understand, they erased information without consuming energy! PERIOD!!!" is incorrect. You can push the energy investment back, and consume energy in establishing the entanglements themselves, but then your claim is bogus. The "PERIOD!!!!" doesn't apply. Energy is consumed, just one step up the chain, rather than in the non-entangled erasure step which consumed it directly in Landauer's examples. Nothing to see here, I'm afraid. 2LoT pwns. What you think you can do now -- erase information without energy consumption, irreversibly, cannot be done, according to everything we know, including the article you mistakenly linked to in pursuing your point.eigenstate_{October 21, 2011
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Eigenstate, it is really not that hard to understand, they erased information without consuming energy! PERIOD!!! I doesn't matter one iota what you think it implies!!! The FACT is that the evidence itself clearly, without any ambiguity, shows information was erased without consuming energy!!! Thus proving conclusively that 'classical' information is merely a subset of quantum information. It would be hard to find a more direct confirmation of a principle in science!!!bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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bornagain77,
eigenstate, I was not contesting ‘reversible computation’ (Landauer’s principle), I merely showed that the paper shows that the ‘information is physical’ dictum is false!!! Clearly they erased ‘classical information’ that was physically encoded into a computer without consuming energy by using quantum information! That in of of itself falsifies the contention ‘information is physical’!!! I wasn’t even challenging reversible computation!!!
The paper doesn't address that, or show that by implication, though, which is the point I was raising in my previous post. Did you see the "section title" called "Landauer's principle is given a quantum twist"? del Rio has found a means of employing entanglement to establish "negative conditional entropy". But that doesn't change 2LoT or Landauer's thermodynamic insight one bit. Entropy for the system ratchets up, inexorably, just as always, because the usable energy that must be invested to establish the entanglements that create the negative entropy is greater than that gained on return. Thus it ever is in thermodynamics. If anything, this is just a more extreme validation of the principle -- information is physical. It's a cool trick to be able to coordinate entanglement such that (in theory) you can provide a cooling effect, but you still gotta invest energy to do it, and crucially here, information is empirically bound to its physical context. To destroy information, irreversibly, you must abide by 2LoT.eigenstate_{October 21, 2011
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eigenstate; it might also interest you to know that 'reversible computation', which you should know is a extremely difficult, if not seemingly impossible, task to accomplish in programming a computer, is accomplished to a stunning degree within cells:
Notes on Landauer’s principle, reversible computation, and Maxwell’s Demon - Charles H. Bennett Excerpt: Of course, in practice, almost all data processing is done on macroscopic apparatus, dissipating macroscopic amounts of energy far in excess of what would be required by Landauer’s principle. Nevertheless, some stages of biomolecular information processing, such as transcription of DNA to RNA, appear to be accomplished by chemical reactions that are reversible not only in principle but in practice.,,,, http://www.hep.princeton.edu/~mcdonald/examples/QM/bennett_shpmp_34_501_03.pdf
And indeed, The energy efficiency achieved in the cell, by such techniques as reversible computation, is something engineers can only drool over;
Life Leads the Way to Invention - Feb. 2010 Excerpt: a cell is 10,000 times more energy-efficient than a transistor. “ In one second, a cell performs about 10 million energy-consuming chemical reactions, which altogether require about one picowatt (one millionth millionth of a watt) of power.” This and other amazing facts lead to an obvious conclusion: inventors ought to look to life for ideas.,,, Essentially, cells may be viewed as circuits that use molecules, ions, proteins and DNA instead of electrons and transistors. That analogy suggests that it should be possible to build electronic chips – what Sarpeshkar calls “cellular chemical computers” – that mimic chemical reactions very efficiently and on a very fast timescale. http://creationsafaris.com/crev201002.htm#20100226a
bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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And quantum teleporation has now shown that atoms, which are suppose to be the basis from which ALL functional information ‘emerges’ in the atheistic neo-Darwinian view of life, are now shown to be, in fact, reducible to the transcendent functional quantum information that the atoms were suppose to be the basis of in the first place!
Ions have been teleported successfully for the first time by two independent research groups Excerpt: In fact, copying isn’t quite the right word for it. In order to reproduce the quantum state of one atom in a second atom, the original has to be destroyed. This is unavoidable – it is enforced by the laws of quantum mechanics, which stipulate that you can’t ‘clone’ a quantum state. In principle, however, the ‘copy’ can be indistinguishable from the original (that was destroyed),,, http://www.rsc.org/chemistryworld/Issues/2004/October/beammeup.asp Atom takes a quantum leap – 2009 Excerpt: Ytterbium ions have been ‘teleported’ over a distance of a metre.,,, “What you’re moving is information, not the actual atoms,” says Chris Monroe, from the Joint Quantum Institute at the University of Maryland in College Park and an author of the paper. But as two particles of the same type differ only in their quantum states, the transfer of quantum information is equivalent to moving the first particle to the location of the second. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2171769/posts
Thus the burning question, that is usually completely ignored by the neo-Darwinists that I’ve asked in the past, is, “How can quantum information/entanglement possibly ‘emerge’ from any material basis of atoms in DNA, or any other atoms, when entire atoms are now shown to reduce to transcendent quantum information in the first place in these teleportation experiments??? i.e. It is simply COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE for the ’cause’ of transcendent functional quantum information, such as we find on a massive scale in DNA and proteins, to reside within, or ever ‘emerge’ from, any material basis of particles!!! Despite the virtual wall of silence I’ve seen from neo-Darwinists thus far, this is not a trivial matter in the least as far as developments in science have gone!!
Does Quantum Biology Support A Quantum Soul? – Stuart Hameroff - video (notes in description) http://vimeo.com/29895068 non-local ‘epigenetic’ information is also implicated in controlling the 3-D spatial organization of body plans; https://docs.google.com/document/d/1iNy78O6ZpU8wpFIgkILi85TvhC9mSqzUSE_jzbksoHY/edit?hl=en_US
verses and music:
John 1:1-3 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 1 Corinthians 2:14 The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. Todd Agnew – This Fragile Breath http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoGPG4JOcXs Brooke Fraser – Lord of Lords(Legendado Português) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkF3iVjOZ1I
bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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The necessity of 'transcendent' information, to ‘constrain’ a cell, against thermodynamic effects is noted here:
Information and entropy – top-down or bottom-up development in living systems? A.C. McINTOSH Excerpt: This paper highlights the distinctive and non-material nature of information and its relationship with matter, energy and natural forces. It is proposed in conclusion that it is the non-material information (transcendent to the matter and energy) that is actually itself constraining the local thermodynamics to be in ordered disequilibrium and with specified raised free energy levels necessary for the molecular and cellular machinery to operate. http://journals.witpress.com/paperinfo.asp?pid=420
i.e. It is very interesting to note, to put it mildly, that quantum entanglement, which conclusively demonstrates that ‘information’ in its pure ‘quantum form’ is completely transcendent of any time and space constraints, should be found in molecular biology on such a massive scale, for how can the quantum entanglement ‘effect’ in biology possibly be explained by a material (matter/energy space/time) ’cause’ when the quantum entanglement ‘effect’ falsified material particles as its own ‘causation’ in the first place? (A. Aspect) Appealing to the probability of various configurations of material particles, as neo-Darwinism does, simply will not help since a timeless/spaceless cause must be supplied which is beyond the capacity of the energy/matter particles themselves to supply! To give a coherent explanation for an effect that is shown to be completely independent of any time and space constraints one is forced to appeal to a cause that is itself not limited to time and space! i.e. Put more simply, you cannot explain a effect by a cause that has been falsified by the very same effect you are seeking to explain! Improbability arguments of various ‘specified’ configurations of material particles, which have been a staple of the arguments against neo-Darwinism, simply do not apply since the cause is not within the material particles in the first place! ,,,To refute this falsification of neo-Darwinism, one must overturn Alain Aspect, and company’s, falsification of local realism (reductive materialism) ! ================= Alain Aspect and Anton Zeilinger by Richard Conn Henry – Physics Professor – John Hopkins University Excerpt: Why do people cling with such ferocity to belief in a mind-independent reality? It is surely because if there is no such reality, then ultimately (as far as we can know) mind alone exists. And if mind is not a product of real matter, but rather is the creator of the “illusion” of material reality (which has, in fact, despite the materialists, been known to be the case, since the discovery of quantum mechanics in 1925), then a theistic view of our existence becomes the only rational alternative to solipsism (solipsism is the philosophical idea that only one’s own mind is sure to exist). (Dr. Henry’s referenced experiment and paper – “An experimental test of non-local realism” by S. Gröblacher et. al., Nature 446, 871, April 2007 – “To be or not to be local” by Alain Aspect, Nature 446, 866, April 2007 ================= And to dovetail into Dembski and Marks’s previous work on Conservation of Information;,,,
LIFE’S CONSERVATION LAW: Why Darwinian Evolution Cannot Create Biological Information William A. Dembski and Robert J. Marks II http://evoinfo.org/publications/lifes-conservation-law/
,,,Encoded ‘classical’ information such as what Dembski and Marks demonstrated the conservation of, and such as what we find encoded in computer programs, and yes, as we find encoded in DNA, is found to be a subset of ‘transcendent’ (beyond space and time) quantum entanglement/information by the following method:,,, ,,,This following research provides solid falsification for the late Rolf Landauer’s decades old contention that the information encoded in a computer is merely physical (merely ‘emergent’ from a material basis) since he believed it always required energy to erase it;
Quantum knowledge cools computers: New understanding of entropy – June 2011 Excerpt: No heat, even a cooling effect; In the case of perfect classical knowledge of a computer memory (zero entropy), deletion of the data requires in theory no energy at all. The researchers prove that “more than complete knowledge” from quantum entanglement with the memory (negative entropy) leads to deletion of the data being accompanied by removal of heat from the computer and its release as usable energy. This is the physical meaning of negative entropy. Renner emphasizes, however, “This doesn’t mean that we can develop a perpetual motion machine.” The data can only be deleted once, so there is no possibility to continue to generate energy. The process also destroys the entanglement, and it would take an input of energy to reset the system to its starting state. The equations are consistent with what’s known as the second law of thermodynamics: the idea that the entropy of the universe can never decrease. Vedral says “We’re working on the edge of the second law. If you go any further, you will break it.” http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/06/110601134300.htm
,,,And to dot the i’s, and cross the t’s, here is the empirical confirmation that quantum information is in fact ‘conserved’;,,,
Quantum no-hiding theorem experimentally confirmed for first time Excerpt: In the classical world, information can be copied and deleted at will. In the quantum world, however, the conservation of quantum information means that information cannot be created nor destroyed. This concept stems from two fundamental theorems of quantum mechanics: the no-cloning theorem and the no-deleting theorem. A third and related theorem, called the no-hiding theorem, addresses information loss in the quantum world. According to the no-hiding theorem, if information is missing from one system (which may happen when the system interacts with the environment), then the information is simply residing somewhere else in the Universe; in other words, the missing information cannot be hidden in the correlations between a system and its environment. http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-03-quantum-no-hiding-theorem-experimentally.html
Further note:
Three subsets of sequence complexity and their relevance to biopolymeric information – Abel, Trevors Excerpt: Shannon information theory measures the relative degrees of RSC and OSC. Shannon information theory cannot measure FSC (Functional Sequence Complexity). FSC is invariably associated with all forms of complex biofunction, including biochemical pathways, cycles, positive and negative feedback regulation, and homeostatic metabolism. The algorithmic programming of FSC, not merely its aperiodicity, accounts for biological organization. No empirical evidence exists of either RSC of OSC ever having produced a single instance of sophisticated biological organization. Organization invariably manifests FSC rather than successive random events (RSC) or low-informational self-ordering phenomena (OSC).,,, Testable hypotheses about FSC What testable empirical hypotheses can we make about FSC that might allow us to identify when FSC exists? In any of the following null hypotheses [137], demonstrating a single exception would allow falsification. We invite assistance in the falsification of any of the following null hypotheses: Null hypothesis #1 Stochastic ensembles of physical units cannot program algorithmic/cybernetic function. Null hypothesis #2 Dynamically-ordered sequences of individual physical units (physicality patterned by natural law causation) cannot program algorithmic/cybernetic function. Null hypothesis #3 Statistically weighted means (e.g., increased availability of certain units in the polymerization environment) giving rise to patterned (compressible) sequences of units cannot program algorithmic/cybernetic function. Null hypothesis #4 Computationally successful configurable switches cannot be set by chance, necessity, or any combination of the two, even over large periods of time. We repeat that a single incident of nontrivial algorithmic programming success achieved without selection for fitness at the decision-node programming level would falsify any of these null hypotheses. This renders each of these hypotheses scientifically testable. We offer the prediction that none of these four hypotheses will be falsified. http://www.tbiomed.com/content/2/1/29
The following describes how quantum entanglement is related to functional information:
Quantum Entanglement and Information Excerpt: A pair of quantum systems in an entangled state can be used as a quantum information channel to perform computational and cryptographic tasks that are impossible for classical systems. http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/qt-entangle/
Anton Zeilinger, a leading researcher in Quantum mechanics, relates how quantum entanglement is related to quantum teleportation in this following video;
Quantum Entanglement and Teleportation – Anton Zeilinger – video http://www.metacafe.com/watch/5705317/
A bit more detail on how teleportation is actually achieved, by extension of quantum entanglement principles, is here:
Quantum Teleportation Excerpt: To perform the teleportation, Alice and Bob must have a classical communication channel and must also share quantum entanglement — in the protocol we employ*, each possesses one half of a two-particle entangled state. http://www.cco.caltech.edu/~qoptics/teleport.html
bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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eigenstate, I was not contesting 'reversible computation' (Landauer's principle), I merely showed that the paper shows that the 'information is physical' dictum is false!!! Clearly they erased 'classical information' that was physically encoded into a computer without consuming energy by using quantum information! That in of of itself falsifies the contention 'information is physical'!!! I wasn't even challenging reversible computation!!! notes: Falsification Of Neo-Darwinism by Quantum Entanglement/Information Neo-Darwinian evolution purports to explain all the wondrously amazing complexity of life on earth by reference solely to chance and necessity processes acting on energy and matter (i.e. purely material processes). In fact neo-Darwinian evolution makes the grand materialistic claim that the staggering levels of unmatched complex functional information we find in life, and even the ‘essence of life’ itself, simply ‘emerged’ from purely material processes. And even though this basic scientific point, of the ability of purely material processes to generate even trivial levels of complex functional information, has spectacularly failed to be established, we now have a much greater proof, than this stunning failure for validation, that ‘put the lie’ to the grand claims of neo-Darwinian evolution. This proof comes from the fact that it is now shown from quantum mechanics that ‘information’ is its own unique ‘physical’ entity. A physical entity that is shown to be completely independent of any energy-matter space-time constraints, i.e. it does not ‘emerge’ from a material basis. Moreover this ‘transcendent information’ is shown to be dominant of energy-matter in that this ‘information’ is shown to be the entity that is in fact constraining the energy-matter processes of the cell to be so far out of thermodynamic equilibrium. First, Here is the falsification of local realism (reductive materialism). Here is a clip of a talk in which Alain Aspect talks about the failure of ‘local realism’, or the failure of reductive materialism, to explain reality:
The Failure Of Local Realism – Reductive Materialism – Alain Aspect – video http://www.metacafe.com/w/4744145
The falsification for local realism (reductive materialism) was recently greatly strengthened:
'Quantum Magic' Without Any 'Spooky Action at a Distance' - June 2011 Excerpt: A team of researchers led by Anton Zeilinger at the University of Vienna and the Institute for Quantum Optics and Quantum Information of the Austrian Academy of Sciences used a system which does not allow for entanglement, and still found results which cannot be interpreted classically. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/06/110624111942.htm Physicists close two loopholes while violating local realism – November 2010 Excerpt: The latest test in quantum mechanics provides even stronger support than before for the view that nature violates local realism and is thus in contradiction with a classical worldview. http://www.physorg.com/news/2010-11-physicists-loopholes-violating-local-realism.html Quantum Measurements: Common Sense Is Not Enough, Physicists Show – July 2009 Excerpt: scientists have now proven comprehensively in an experiment for the first time that the experimentally observed phenomena cannot be described by non-contextual models with hidden variables. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/07/090722142824.htm
of note: hidden variables were postulated to remove the need for ‘spooky’ forces, as Einstein termed them — forces that act instantaneously at great distances, thereby breaking the most cherished rule of relativity theory, that nothing can travel faster than the speed of light. This following video illustrates just how 'spooky', to use Einstein’s infamous word, this quantum action truly is:
Light and Quantum Entanglement Reflect Some Characteristics Of God – video http://www.metacafe.com/watch/4102182/
And yet, this ‘spooky’ quantum entanglement, which rigorously falsified local realism (reductive materialism) as the ‘true’ description of reality, is now found in molecular biology on a massive scale!
Quantum Information/Entanglement In DNA & Protein Folding – short video http://www.metacafe.com/watch/5936605/ Quantum entanglement holds together life’s blueprint – 2010 Excerpt: When the researchers analysed the DNA without its helical structure, they found that the electron clouds were not entangled. But when they incorporated DNA’s helical structure into the model, they saw that the electron clouds of each base pair became entangled with those of its neighbours (arxiv.org/abs/1006.4053v1). “If you didn’t have entanglement, then DNA would have a simple flat structure, and you would never get the twist that seems to be important to the functioning of DNA,” says team member Vlatko Vedral of the University of Oxford. http://neshealthblog.wordpress.com/2010/09/15/quantum-entanglement-holds-together-lifes-blueprint/ The relevance of continuous variable entanglement in DNA – July 2010 Excerpt: We consider a chain of harmonic oscillators with dipole-dipole interaction between nearest neighbours resulting in a van der Waals type bonding. The binding energies between entangled and classically correlated states are compared. We apply our model to DNA. By comparing our model with numerical simulations we conclude that entanglement may play a crucial role in explaining the stability of the DNA double helix. http://arxiv.org/abs/1006.4053v1
Quantum Entanglement/Information is confirmed in DNA by direct observation here;
DNA Can Discern Between Two Quantum States, Research Shows – June 2011 Excerpt: — DNA — can discern between quantum states known as spin. – The researchers fabricated self-assembling, single layers of DNA attached to a gold substrate. They then exposed the DNA to mixed groups of electrons with both directions of spin. Indeed, the team’s results surpassed expectations: The biological molecules reacted strongly with the electrons carrying one of those spins, and hardly at all with the others. The longer the molecule, the more efficient it was at choosing electrons with the desired spin, while single strands and damaged bits of DNA did not exhibit this property. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/03/110331104014.htm
bornagain77_{October 21, 2011
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bornagain77, Your sources do not say what you think say. Your link to the ScienceDaily article does not argue against the Landauer principle at all, but rather relates further questions about WHEN the thermodynamic irreversibility is realized, when the Landauer principle actually kicks in, in other words. Your "synapses" is not a synopsis of the article, if that's what you were going for in that paragraph; while we continue to push the limits of reversibility, there is still an energy cost for irreversible information loss, when that happens. UprightBiped,
Info is physical? Then go get a three and show it to me. Bring me a green too.
Here's a fairly recent link that covers some of the ground on this since Landauer, including objections by Norton and a couple others, and counters to those objections regarding "Information is physical": http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/2689/1/irreversibility(rev2).pdf A concept like 'green' has a physical context (brain-state in your head, or mine), just as much as footprint in the sand. We are without exceptions to the implications of Landauer's insight. We have no "immaterial information"; no matter how abstract or virtual we get in our thinking, our thinking is physical, bringing all those ideas about universals etc. right back to the physical domain.eigenstate_{October 21, 2011
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Neil: > Requirements are something that come up as part of design. More properly, design, whether purposeful or not, follows requirements. Requirements are relevant to OOL because requirements are imposed implicitly and unavoidably on abiogenesis by the laws of physics. Inorganic matter behaves in a lawful, consistent way. Living organisms are arranged in ways that run counter to the normal arrangements we would expect from inorganic matter as it moves towards thermodynamic equilibrium. Abiogenesis requires a reversal of entropy -- the imposition of a seemingly unnatural order on matter to overcome the effects of the second law. Intelligent causation is routinely observed to overcome this obstacle. Abiogenesis has never been observed, nor does it seem even minutely likely on theoretical grounds, given our present state of empirical knowledge -- unless certain assumptions are smuggled in on religious grounds to make materialistic abiogenesis feasible. (The openness or closed-ness of a pre-biotic system to energy is irrelevant. The injection of raw, randomly directed energy does not seem sufficient in itself to overcome the entropy problem.)kdonnelly_{October 21, 2011
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Petrushka:
Software is just the current configuration of hardware.
No, it isn't. That was easy...Joseph_{October 21, 2011
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Software is just the current configuration of hardware. There would be less confusion on this is people would think back to the early computers, which were programmed with patch cords and switches. Disk drives and memory chips are just a faster and more convenient set of switches. I believe at least one ID poster on this site refers to DNA as configurable switches. I have no problem with that metaphor.Petrushka_{October 21, 2011
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My point was that our abstractions are capable of reflecting physical reality. So information is a very useful notion of something that goes on in reality. Shortcuts such as "rock containing information" are meaningless out of context. I agree with your other post down below, where you say that the major problem in misconceptions like these is the confusion between information and the medium.Eugene S_{October 21, 2011
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Neil Rickert: "I’m puzzled by this thread. Requirements are something that come up as part of design." "I don’t see where it is relevant to questions on the natural origin of life." ==== Why would Natural ONLY origins of life have need of requirements ??? Or even care ??? Remember, blind pointless purposeless indifference without intent as espoused by one of your own holy men ??? Requirements ??? Evolution doesn't need requirements. It just does things despite it's lack of goal driven ambitions/emotions !!!Eocene_{October 21, 2011
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Info is physical? Then go get a three and show it to me. Bring me a green too.Upright BiPed_{October 21, 2011
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