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Timaeus Exposes Larry Moran

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All that follows is from UD commenter Timaeus:

Larry Moran wrote:

“I’ve been trying to teach Denyse about evolution for almost twenty years. It’s not working.”

Perhaps teaching is not your strong point, Larry. There is some empirical evidence of that, I believe.

Or perhaps it is expertise that is the problem. Last time I checked your website for your publications on evolutionary theory, I found many popular articles on ID and creationism, and some apparently self-published biochemical data on your university website. I couldn’t find a single article on evolutionary theory in a peer-reviewed journal on the subject for over 10 years into the past. For someone who has so many opinions on evolution, and voices them so loudly in non-professionally-controlled environments such as blog sites, you are surprisingly absent from the professional discussions. Perhaps you can explain the inverse relationship between your popular involvement in debates over evolution and your visibility in the technical books and articles on the subject of evolution.

It strikes me that spending hundreds of hours every year trying to convince ID people and creationists they are wrong would not be as profitable a use of a Toronto professor’s time as actually researching evolutionary mechanisms and publishing the findings at academic conferences, in books, and in journals.

[TIME PASSES]

I’ll take Larry Moran’s silence on my request for a list of his recent peer-reviewed publications in evolutionary biology as a concession that he has no such publications. I.e., I will infer that he is a commentator on debates over evolutionary theory, not an evolutionary theorist himself.

Of course, being a commentator on something is not a bad thing in itself. For someone to say: “Gould says such-and-such about evolutionary mechanisms, and Futuyma says something different, and Coyne says something different, and here are some of the points over which these men have disagreed” — that would be pedagogically useful for many readers. But that’s not the way Larry Moran has ever written about evolution.

Larry writes in this fashion: “Evolution doesn’t happen that way; it happens this way.” That is, Larry does not merely describe what the experts think, and indicate areas of possible strength in weakness in their various views, but tells his readers which views are right and which are wrong, which evolutionary biologists know what they are talking about and which don’t. He poses as someone who can referee the conflicts, who stands above all the others and can pass judgment on their scientific competence and the correctness of their theories, and, in a pinch, when none of them is right, can tell us the way evolution really happened, on his own authority. This is pretty arrogant for a guy with no recent publications in the field, and whose work (as far as I can tell) is never or rarely cited by Shapiro, Newman, Wagner, Jablonka, or any of the other currently important evolutionary theorists.

Larry has an inflated idea of his own importance within evolutionary theory. In fact, in reality, he is just one more of 10,000 guys in the world with a Ph.D. in biology or biochemistry or genetics who is under the illusion that knowing one of those fields automatically makes one an expert on evolutionary theory and evolutionary mechanisms. But the people who actually *do* evolutionary theory seem to take little notice of Larry Moran (or his blog site) at all.

Of course, maybe I’m wrong. Maybe Larry regularly gets invited to big conferences on evolutionary theory to be the keynote speaker; maybe his judgments are revered around the world the way Ernst Mayr’s used to be. If so, I’ll be glad to be corrected, and to retract my statements. Someone here can write in with evidence of the hundreds of times Larry’s research on evolutionary mechanisms have been cited in the literature, with the details of the publications Larry hasn’t bothered to list on his web site, etc. What I can see for the moment, however, is that Larry Moran is a nobody in evolutionary theory, a biochemistry teacher at Toronto with an interest in evolutionary theory who is convinced he knows more about it than almost everyone else on the planet, but with no track record to corroborate that opinion.

That’s the problem with the internet age. Through web sites and blogs, it gives people the ability to be prominent, and many readers assume that prominence equals importance. But it doesn’t. The Kardashians and Paris Hilton are as prominent in popular culture as Tom Hanks or Meryl Streep, but they aren’t nearly as important. To be important, as opposed to prominent, one has to demonstrate ability. *Ability*, not the verbal fluency to hold forth on a subject on a blog site. And in science, ability is proved not on blog sites but at conferences, in articles, and in books. So what is needed is a list of Larry’s publications in these venues.

Comments
SA, you appear to have lost the plot. If you have something substantive to say, or an example of Moran's supposed dismissal evolutionary biologists then please provide the links that support that.wd400
June 5, 2015
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What qualifies you to decide who is, and who is not, a “fringe” evolutionary biologist? What is your expertise in the field, that you can make such assignments?
I'm an evolutionary biologist. I can make such an assesment because I am familiar with the field and Shapiro's impact on it, which is minimal.wd400
June 5, 2015
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Which ppl do you regard to be leading evolutionary theorists? I really would like to know.
Well, the claim is from timaeus', you'll have to ask him who he's thinking of. Good luck though. For me, off the top of my head and including only people working at the moment, here are some names. Sally Otto, Demetri Petrov, Hopi Hoekstra, Tomoko Ohta, Allen Orr,Mike Lynch, Brian and Deborah Charlesworth I'm sure I'm missing many.wd400
June 5, 2015
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Zachriel: You moved the goalposts. Originally, I asked for evidence of substantive peer-reviewed research in the past decade by Moran. Your first response was to cite articles from 1985 and 1990. I pointed out that those articles were very old, and would not qualify one as a leader in evolutionary theory today. Without conceding the point and withdrawing the examples, you switched focus and started yapping about an undergraduate biochemistry textbook for which Moran was only approximately 1/4 or 1/5 responsible. And that's what you've been talking about ever since -- while all the while perversely denying that your subject has been biochemistry or Moran's knowledge of biochemistry or Moran's textbook of biochemistry. Of course I never denied that Moran had great knowledge of biochemistry, never criticized his textbook (I have heard it is good, and don't contest that), and never even said that he didn't know a lot about evolution. But there are senior physics textbooks written by people who know a lot about physics; that doesn't make those writers world-class experts in quantum theory or string theory or multiverse theory etc. I am sure that Moran knows a good deal about evolutionary theory. What I doubt is that he is currently one of the big guns in the field, or has been thought of as such in recent years. My argument is merely that he should adjust the degree of certainty with which he expresses himself to his relative intellectual rank within the community of evolutionary theorists. If you find that argument offensive or unreasonable, so be it. I won't withdraw it. And now, whether or not you are done with this, I am.Timaeus
June 5, 2015
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wd400
Shapiro is a very fringe evolutionary biologist, but even there I’m waiting for the haughty dismissal
You might try googling Moran and Shapiro. Use their first names and something about evolution. Then again, you already dismissed Shapiro so why bother?
I didn’t “taunt” you for a link,
Did so.
Even in your link all Moran says is that the Selfish Gene version of evolution is incomplete.
That's all he said? Strange that the pedant suddenly becomes vague and inaccurate when referencing quite a lot of text by Larry. I was going to quote directly but it's more fun watching you distort what is actually there.
Dawkins has not written a science paper for many decades, so even that mild dismissal
What mild dismissal? I thought we saw "all he said"?
As to the claim my other I “completely misses and ignores any higher-level argument”. What argument?
I know. You've offered nothing but a denial of evidence. But the only way to get you to type more than a sentence is to make sure it's a trivial discussion. I should offer some spelling errors for you to focus on also.
I also happen to think exclusionary language is a genuine problem,
Wow - you do actually have something to say. Language is a problem -- and spelling. And grammar also!
and Timaeus weridly antiquated way view of the way scientists discuss topics is relevant.
Now it's my turn to score some points. You didn't write that correctly, wd! Mixed up language combined with poor spelling is a problem! 3 points for me. I'm doing great!Silver Asiatic
June 5, 2015
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wd400: What qualifies you to decide who is, and who is not, a "fringe" evolutionary biologist? What is your expertise in the field, that you can make such assignments? Shapiro has, as far as I can tell from publication record, contributed more to evolutionary biology than Moran has. So if output is the criterion, he is no more "fringe" than Moran is. Or are there other criteria you are employing? And does "fringe" imply "not theoretically or empirically competent" or "wrong"; or does it mean only "holding to a non-majority position? If the latter, is it an intellectual or scientific sin to hold to a non-majority position?Timaeus
June 5, 2015
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wd400:
Shapiro is a very fringe evolutionary biologist
I'd like to hear from design biologists for a change. Evolutionary biologists bore me to death with their silly dogma.Mapou
June 5, 2015
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WD400: (...) we still don’t have an example of the way in which he has dismissed leading evolutionary theorists…
Which ppl do you regard to be leading evolutionary theorists? I really would like to know.Box
June 5, 2015
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Beau, I don't who Nessa Carey is, but Nobel isn't an evolutionary biologists and neither are the ENCODE crew. EDIT: google tells me Nessa Carey is also not an evolutionary biologist. Here's Moran's post on here book, which provides links describing why Carey's claims are wrong So, not an evolutionary biologists let alone a leading one and no out of hand dismissal of her work...wd400
June 5, 2015
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SA, Shapiro is a very fringe evolutionary biologist, but even there I'm waiting for the haughty dismissal I'm beginning to think exists only in Timaeus' (and I guess your) mind. I didn't "taunt" you for a link, I wanted to see an example of the subject that has lead Timaeus to spend so much time listening to himself type. Even in your link all Moran says is that the Selfish Gene version of evolution is incomplete. Dawkins has not written a science paper for many decades, so even that mild dismissal doesn't get us to the "leading evolutionary theorists" has being going on about. As to the claim my other I "completely misses and ignores any higher-level argument". What argument? Timaeus apparently refuses to support his posts. I also happen to think exclusionary language is a genuine problem, and Timaeus weridly antiquated way view of the way scientists discuss topics is relevant.wd400
June 5, 2015
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Does Denis Noble count? Nessa Carey, the 400 scientists at the encode project?http://sandwalk.blogspot.com/2015/01/a-physiologist-thinks-about-evolution.html?m=1 Stuart Kaufmann http://sandwalk.blogspot.com/2008/02/stuart-kauffman-reinventing-sacred.html?m=1beau
June 5, 2015
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wd400
Do you know, they even let women be scientists in some places.
Classic wd400. Completely misses and ignores any higher-level arguments, but puts a laser-focus on various phrases in the text. You win ten points for that one wd! Spelling corrections count for 2. Catching politically insensitive remarks gives you 5 times that amount. You're doing great. Evolutionary biologists are clearly a lot smarter than everyone else. Plus they're sensitive guys!Silver Asiatic
June 5, 2015
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Zachriel, You miss the point of Moran’s anti-design rants. Among other things, he claims that IDists are IDiots because they don’t understand the difference between ancient Neo-Darwinism and his more modern version of neutral evolution, which has allegedly been sandblasted clean of all previous imperfections. Translation: IDists are stupid because they are not modern. Now we find that Moran is not up to date with his own research, even though he pontificates as one who is on the cutting edge. Another irony is the fact that neutral evolution has been around since the 1960’s, so the mere act of cleaving to that paradigm does not, by itself, indicate that Moran is in step with his contemporaries. Indeed, there are plenty of well-published, up to date, Darwinian naturalists who disavow neutral evolution altogether. Indeed, they continue to call themselves “Neo-Darwinists.” Moran wouldn’t dare call them idiots for rejecting his paradigm nor would he imply that they don’t know the difference between naturalism and neutralism. Accordingly, Moran is recklessly presumptuous to claim that ID proponents are ignorant of neutral evolution simply because they use the term “Darwinism.” In fact, Darwinists and ID proponents typically define that term the same way—as one who embraces unguided macro-evolution. Obviously, that definition includes both naturalism and neutralism. So Moran doesn’t even know what he is arguing against. Even so, that doesn’t prevent him from sustaining this same stupid claim, which I have called him on numerous times. He has never responded. Would you care to?StephenB
June 5, 2015
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wd400 From the publisher: James A. Shapiro proposes an important new paradigm for understanding biological evolution, the core organizing principle of biology. Oh, right - you disagree with Shapiro so he's not "a leading evolutionary theorist". Nobody that holds Dawkins' view on evolution can be either. That's pretty convenient. You didn't know that Mr. Moran openly "dismisses" Richard Dawkins and you taunt me to give you a link? Quote in the OP, then comments #4 and #8 follow, with Moran explicitly calling Dawkins' view "the strawman" version of evolution. https://uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/bad-math-why-larry-morans-im-not-a-darwinian-isnt-a-valid-reply-to-meyers-argument/Silver Asiatic
June 5, 2015
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Professionally, scientists are supposed to behave like gentlemen
Do you know, they even let women be scientists in some places. I'm also not sure you've either spoken to a scientists at a conference or read many peer reviews. Anyway, still waiting for an example of Moran dismissing leading evolutionary theorists. Just one would be a start...wd400
June 5, 2015
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Timaeus: You *are* discussing biochemistry No. We're discussing the thread topic, "Timaeus exposes Larry Moran". You are using ad hominem to undermine Moran as an authority. It's a weak form of argument, even weaker when so poorly supported by the facts. You don't like his tone. Yes, his tone is probably counterproductive. But your own tone is not the best. You call names. You get upset when facts are provided that contradict your position. You may sneer and stamp your feet, but it doesn't change whether your argument is sound. Who cares? It just means the signal-to-noise level in your comments is lower than it might be otherwise. It just means readers have to wade through maybe 50% of the text to find your relevant arguments. Fortunately, our patented (not really) DeSnark® desnarkification filtering system does most of the work. Then again, this is a thread on ad hominem. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSo0duY7-9s&t=1m14s Timaeus: I ask you again: what *original research* publications has Larry got in evolutionary theory since 1990? As we already stated, Moran moved out of research on molecular evolution into teaching. He then wrote a university textbook on biochemistry using an evolutionary approach. Timaeus: And in fact, it is a reworking of earlier versions That's what is generally meant by an "edition". Timaeus: So the alleged knowledge of evolutionary theory presented in the book can’t be attributed to Moran alone. Moran clearly has a professional knowledge of molecular evolution. Timaeus: What I said was that he had not demonstrated sufficient research expertise in evolutionary theory overall (and evolutionary theory overall includes much, much more than just “molecular evolution”) Actually, molecular evolution is where much of the most important research has occurred. It's how scientists can peer into life before the age of fossils. It's how scientists can determine the importance of neutral forces or horizontal mechanisms in evolution. It's how scientists have unraveled many of the mysteries of phylogeny. Theoretical changes have largely occurred in response to studies of molecular evolution. Mung: Larry Moran literally wrote the book on biochemistry. Yes, he did, with an evolutionary approach consistent with his research experience.Zachriel
June 5, 2015
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But Timaeus, Larry Moran literally wrote the book on biochemistry.Mung
June 5, 2015
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Zachriel: You're being a stubborn fool. You *are* discussing biochemistry -- it is you who keeps coming back to Larry Moran's biochemistry textbook and its contents, even though the subject is not undergraduate textbooks in biochemistry but postgraduate research in evolutionary theory. I ask you again: what *original research* publications has Larry got in evolutionary theory since 1990? And more particularly, in the past ten years? I can't find any. If you can't find any, either, be a man and admit it. By the way, I looked up some information on the textbook. You are grossly misleading the readers here. Moran is not the sole author of the textbook. The 5th edition of 2011 has *four* authors, so it is not Moran's work alone; he gets credit for only part of it -- likely about a quarter. And in fact, it is a reworking of earlier versions, which go back as far as 1993, and those editions had 5 or more authors, so he can take even less credit for them. But even if we use the 5th edition, and give him credit for a quarter of it, the situation is the same: he's merely a co-author of a collective project. So the alleged knowledge of evolutionary theory presented in the book can't be attributed to Moran alone. Your pious little "dictionary definition" of "valid authority" has the silly schoolmarm-lesson look of something written by the idiots at Wikipedia. In any case, I never for a moment denied that Larry was an "authority" in biochemistry or even in some specialty called "molecular evolution." I never said that he was incapable of offering a "valid opinion" on biochemistry or even on certain areas of evolutionary theory. What I said was that he had not demonstrated sufficient research expertise in evolutionary theory overall (and evolutionary theory overall includes much, much more than just "molecular evolution") to be in a position to pose as arbiter of good and bad evolutionary theory at the highest levels of theoretical discussion. Your continued pompous use of the pronoun "we" shows you to be puerile and attention-seeking. Why don't you grow up? You're impressing no one.Timaeus
June 5, 2015
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Timaeus: You’re discussing biochemistry. No, we're not discussing biochemistry, but your ad hominem attack on Larry Moran, and the counterpart, appeal to authority. Timaeus: you can gush over and fondle Larry’s textbook all you like. We just pointed out an interesting irony, that you would complain that we "haven’t even bothered to obtain Larry’s textbook or examine it," when it's clear you "haven’t even bothered to obtain Larry’s textbook or examine it." If you had, you would understand that 1) the student is expected to have already studied evolutionary biology, and 2) that the textbook takes an evolutionary approach to the study of biochemistry. Timaeus: It just means he’s one of thousands of scientists — the majority of them not world leaders in their fields — who have written an undergraduate textbook. One doesn't have to be a "world leader in their field" to be a valid authority.
An appeal to authority is valid when * The cited authority has sufficient expertise. * The authority is making a statement within their area of expertise. * The area of expertise is a valid field of study. * There is adequate agreement among authorities in the field. * There is no evidence of undue bias. The proper argument against a valid appeal to authority is to the evidence.
One doesn't always have to go to a "world leading" doctor to get a valid medical opinion.Zachriel
June 5, 2015
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Curly writes, " You’re here on UD writing lengthy posts about nothing, it wouldn’t really surprise me if someone like you, with their feelings hurt like Timaeus’, went ahead and left a bad grade on Morgan’s page." Okay, now you have really trapped yourself. If you would not be surprised if me or 'someone like me' would pretend to be a student to give LM a bad grade, then that means that either: a.) you feel the same way about partisans on YOUR side of the fence. I.e. they might possibly write nasty things about ID educators even if they had never taken a class from them, and that wouldn't surprise you OR b.) You are convinced that such would NEVER be the case from people like you, on your side of the fence, because they have so much greater integrity. All of them. So which are you, a cynic who believes that people who disagree about these matters should not be trusted and can be expected to act without integrity to further even nebulous goals, or a blind, myopic, partisan fool who has so fallen into an Us vs. Them mentality that your ability to reason is thoroughly shot? I'm curious.soundburger
June 5, 2015
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Curly: How something is being said is very important. Arrogance and abrasiveness, dismissiveness and name-calling, get in the way of genuine conversation. This is why Matzke, Shallit, Moran, Myers, Abbie Smith, etc. have made evolution/design conversations worse rather than better. In serious academic environments, such behavior isn't allowed; sections of articles containing verbal aggression or personal characterizations are rejected by journal referees, speakers at conferences are dressed down by the chair of the session for unprofessional manners, etc. Do you think that Dawkins's sentence about anyone who does not believe in evolution being stupid, ignorant, dishonest, etc. would have been allowed in a mainstream journal of evolutionary theory? It would have been caught right away and red-pencilled for omission by the editor and referees. Do you think that if Larry Moran referred to "IDiots" in an article submitted to Science or Nature, it would be allowed to stand? Professionally, scientists are supposed to behave like gentlemen; yet on the internet, a Ph.D. can act like a jerk and get away with it. I think such people should be called out. You apparently think it doesn't matter if people are rude, arrogant, or write or speak in such a way as to get under other people's skin. You seem to think everyone should turn a blind eye to bad manners, arrogance, etc. and just "concentrate on the argument." I totally differ. To respond to the argument of someone who is being personally a jerk is to reward and reinforce the jerkish behavior. To refuse to pay any attention to the argument until the person stops acting like a jerk is to begin the job of eliminating the jerkish behavior. Any parent, any schoolteacher knows this. I will continue to focus, from time to time, on how things are said. If you find that focus uninteresting, don't read my posts. As for your nattering, nagging question, if you gave the matter a moment's thought, you would know why I will not ever answer your question, and would stop asking it. Let me spell it out for you: I cannot identify to you the material I corrected without giving out information that would lead, with very little trouble, to my identity. I do not intend to give out information leading you or anyone else here to my identity. Can you grasp that? If you don't believe that I offered some scientific corrections to a publication which were accepted by the scientist, I don't really care. I don't get my self-esteem from what people on the internet think of me. I don't lie, and I know what I have done. I told you the truth. I don't expect you to regard my word as proof. I never intended to offer you proof. If you were expecting proof, I'm sorry you are disappointed. I can't even remember why I mentioned it in the first place. Probably you were accusing me of knowing nothing about science, or the like. If so, I was simply indicating that that was not the case. But I shouldn't have bothered to give examples that I couldn't confirm. Clumsy argumentative tactics on my part. But I didn't lie. Believe whatever you want about me, but let this go. No one here wants to read your repeated questions for an answer that will never be forthcoming. They just irritate everyone.Timaeus
June 5, 2015
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Zachriel, you wrote: "We’re not discussing natural science." You're discussing biochemistry. Biochemistry is a natural science, you dork! As for the rest, you can gush over and fondle Larry's textbook all you like. It doesn't make him a leading figure in evolutionary theory, and it doesn't guarantee that his judgments of other evolutionary theorists are sound. It just means he's one of thousands of scientists -- the majority of them not world leaders in their fields -- who have written an undergraduate textbook. Big deal! If you were a man, you'd just concede that you have no evidence of any recent *research* activity or *research publications* in evolutionary theory on Larry's part, and that you have no evidence that any substantial number of the world's leading evolutionary theorists regard Larry as their peer (let alone their superior), and, since that was the only thing I was trying to establish, you'd stop arguing. But you apparently don't have the strength of character required to make that kind of concession. You'll continue talking about that textbook until hell freezes over, because your argument doesn't have another leg to stand on. Pathetic. Just pathetic.Timaeus
June 4, 2015
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I'm not concerned Timaeus, and I'm willing to bet he doesn't understand much of it. I haven't paid any attention to the other conversations going on here, I'm mainly waiting for you to point out the paper and mistake you told me about a while ago. I also don't know anything about behe nor have I ever attacked his work, but maybe it's possible that Moran and the like present largely agreed upon science, while behe attempts to contradict what most are in agreement with. Both can say what every want, but I would think that behe would need some heavy research firepower to back his claims.... but he doesn't research anymore. As seems to be typical here, you attack how something's being said instead of what is actually being said. Get over it. The guy is going to say what he wants, how he wants. If ID had some science behind it, maybe your feelings wouldn't be so hurt and you'd actually have an argument. Dont forget to let me know about that article and mistake, I'm not sure why it's so hard to point it out. Ratemyprofessor is anonymous and anyone can contribute, burger. You're here on UD writing lengthy posts about nothing, it wouldn't really surprise me if someone like you, with their feelings hurt like Timaeus', went ahead and left a bad grade on Morgan's page. And nobody is better at promoting the "us vs. them" attitude than the people here at UD.Curly Howard
June 4, 2015
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Timaeus: do you know *any* natural science at all We're not discussing natural science. Timaeus: So while there might be a chapter or two on “molecular evolution,” there will be much else in the textbook that has nothing to do with “molecular evolution.” Moran's textbook is structured based an evolutionary approach. First, they — reasonably — assume the biochemistry student has already studied evolutionary biology. They start with simple fundamental principles or pathways or processes, then show how more complex systems evolved from there. Topics include how the structures of proteins show evolutionary relationships, domain evolution, convergent evolution, evolution of metabolic pathways, evolution of enzymes, and the evolution of metabolic cycles. Timaeus: In any case, textbooks do not count as pieces of research; they are digests of existing knowledge. Quite so! The writer of a recent edition of a university textbook has digested "existing knowledge". Timaeus: you yourself haven’t even bothered to obtain Larry’s textbook or examine it Considering you are still unaware that the textbook takes an evolutionary approach, even after being repeatedly informed, your comment has a certain special irony.Zachriel
June 4, 2015
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Curly writes, without a shred of supporting evidence, concerning Larry Moran's reviews on ratemyprofessor: "anyone could post there actually, maybe you or your friends have" thus abdicating any possibility of being taken seriously. Just conspiracy theory nonsense produced by nothing other than your own extreme bias. Why on earth would anyone go over to rmp to slam Larry's teaching abilities without actually taking a class from him? What a stunningly ridiculous idea that is. People on UD etc. have plenty of other things to debate and take issue with about Larry Moran. Your insinuation, which you just made up and convinced yourself sounds plausible, shows that your mind is clouded by bias. THIS is actually why many of us here dislike Larry Moran. His continual demonization of the other side encourages 'arguments' like yours and brews an Us vs. Them Koolaid that you have drunk with relish.soundburger
June 4, 2015
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Well, the book is not great. I think it's more likely Moran didn't want to say as much about someone who was central to establishing the neutral theory. Whatever the reason for Moran no reviewing Nei's book, we still don't have an example of the way in which he has dismissed leading evolutionary theorists...wd400
June 4, 2015
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wd400, he declined to review it. Perhaps he just didn't feel qualified to review it, not being up-to-date and all on the latest and greatest in modern evolutionary theory. ;)Mung
June 4, 2015
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Mung, And dismissed Nei in the way Timaeus describes. Given Moran's views I think that's very unlikely, but show me the link if so. SA, Well, show me the link if you like, but Dawkins is not a leading evolutionary theorist.wd400
June 4, 2015
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wd400 He called the selection-centric view "the IDiot version of evolution". When I pointed out that Dawkins holds the IDiot view, he did not object.Silver Asiatic
June 4, 2015
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Yes, he declined to review Masatoshi Nei’s Mutation-Driven Evolution.Mung
June 4, 2015
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Jun
4
04
2015
12:32 PM
12
12
32
PM
PDT
1 2 3 4 5 6 9

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