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Why Would Anyone Base Their Beliefs Regarding The Most Vitally Important Question Of All On The Ever Shifting Foundation of Modern Cosmology?

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In a comment to a recent post Timaeus makes a fantastic point about basing one’s ultimate beliefs on a scientific theory in a state of flux.  All that follows is his:

If one were to try to derive knowledge of God from the latest discoveries of science, modern cosmology is not a good science to choose. It changes almost yearly. One cannot read the science news without discovering, several times a year, claims that major aspects of cosmology — quasars, black holes, the big bang, dark matter, dark energy — need to be radically rethought or perhaps even abandoned, due to new measurements which show that X can’t possibly account for what it was supposed to account for. Why would one base one’s theology (or worse, one’s personal faith) on a field as mercurial as this?

By contrast, one doesn’t read science headlines like: “Flash! Science now proves that iron is really a non-metal!” or “Faraday proved wrong about the existence of a relationship between electricity and magnetism,” or “Harvey’s theory of the circulation of the blood debunked by scientists at the Wistar Institute.” A theology based on basic electromagnetic theory, or on the classical modern discoveries in physics, chemistry, physiology, and anatomy, would have some wings to fly with. A theology based on very tentative areas of science, such as cosmology, or evolutionary theory, or string theory, or chaos theory, is going to be as tentative as the science from which it extrapolates.

In short, even if everything Hawking says about the physical universe is true, his theological and philosophical pronouncements are vacuous nonsense; and it is questionable whether the entire field of intellectual endeavor in which this genius has occupied himself is stable enough to provide a secure basis for any extrapolation from science to metaphysics. I certainly would not care to revise any of my religious beliefs or theological formulations on the basis of the speculations of Hawking (any more than I would revise them based on the speculations of Mayr, Dobzhansky, or Dawkins). But if I were to revise my theology based on Hawking’s science, I would make my own extrapolations; I would never rely on his.

It is so amusing. We are told over and over again that scientists should stay out “fields” in which they have no training. We are told that Behe should stay out of evolutionary theory because his “field” is not biology but only biochemistry. We are told Dembski should stay out of evolutionary theory because his “field” is probability theory, not biology. But when Hawking pronounces on matters of theology and philosophy, the entire world of science journalism opens its doors to him, and broadcasts his most casual obiter dicta as if they are profound truths. Yet Hawking is far, far less competent to talk about God than either Behe or Dembski are to talk about evolutionary theory.

The double standard is plain for all to see. If you are against conventional religious belief, if you are against the idea of design in nature, you can say anything you want about fields in which you are ignorant and untrained, and no one will complain about your violation of specialist boundaries. If you hold to the reigning secular humanism practiced by the so-called “elite” scientists, you can get away with spewing any crap that you like. And what Hawking spews about God and creation out of nothingness is sub-academic, sub-intellectual crap, and should be identified as such.

Einstein’s sophomoric ventures into theology were bad enough, but they do not appear to have been animated by hostility to religious belief as such; but Hawking’s apparently more calculated strikes at religious belief, based on a theological understanding even more naive than Einstein’s, is beyond even the most generous tolerance levels that a theologian or philosopher can extend to dilettante materialist scientists. The world needs to be told that Hawking is completely incompetent to speak on the subjects he is addressing.

Comments
Single Malt says: "No, I merely highlight the futility in ever establishing such a fact." Fair enough. I accept it as faith based on my a priori acceptance of the Bible as God's Word. I believe it makes great sense that a Creator who created us with a desire to know where we came from, an interest in life's purpose, a curiosity about what happens after death, a desire to know how best to live one's life, etc. would actually reveal these things to us as opposed to letting us flounder around on our own on an open sea with no answers. An atheist has no meaningful standard of truth or morality whatsoever - unless it is some meaningless eternally elastic one he or someone has made up. It follows that he/she really cannot ever establish anything as fact, including his own beliefs about nature and his own worldview. His a priori belief is in the non-existence of a supernatural deity - which forces him against all odds to come up with a somewhat believable naturalistic explanation for life and the universe. Even agnostics have the same trouble as they believe there is no way of knowing anything about this deity, if He does exist, so functionally they too are in the same boat with the atheist adrift on a vast ocean with no knowledge of or hope of ever really knowing where he came from, where he is going, or why he is even floating. Science is NOT a begetter of truth as the current state of cosmology so clearly shows. In an atheistic world, ultimate truth doesn't even exist, nor does it matter. Actually nothing matters in the ultimate sense, so it is hard to understand why atheists are so worried about IDers and creationists. Things have turned out pretty well so far haven't they? I mean, who would have ever guessed something like humans could ever have evolved on their own by chance?! Maybe evolution is to blame for producing religious people, so why fret? In fact, that is what atheism claims, is it not? So why not just let evolution run it's course? According to materialism, you can't help what you believe and I can't help what I believe. Free choice is a figment of our collective imaginations as the materialistic worldview means that all things are determined. That's a lovely thought, isn't it? Just gives you warm fuzzies all over, doesn't it? In the end, I guess you are right. Neither side can prove it's position. However, philosophically, atheism and materialism has a lot of problems and inconsistencies that don't fit with what we intuitively know to be true of life. (ie there is a purpose for our life, there is free will, how we live our life does matter, there is objective right and wrong, self-consciousness is real, immaterial things do exist(information, laws, etc.) etc. I'll stick with faith in God. And I'm sure you will stick with faith in the ever changing ideas of scientists whose very thinking is determined by the very evolutionary processes that created them.tjguy
November 5, 2011
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Single_Malt wants to poke fun at Moses who met with God on the mountain.
No, I merely highlight the futility in ever establishing such a fact. As for the rest of your post I could not have asked for a more enjoyable demonstration of faulty reasoning; thankyou.
Edmund whoever....
Sigh.Single_Malt
November 5, 2011
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Single_Malt, At least Christians have a reason for the beliefs that they hold—God has declared truth in His Scriptures. What basis does any other philosophy have for the existence of the laws of nature, logic, or mathematics? There is no consistent and rational basis for these things outside of Christian theism. God is a God of order and He is consistent. He upholds/sustains all things by the power of His word. Things look designed because, surprise! They are. See how reasonable that is? The intricate details of the created universe confirm God’s claim as the Creator. To start from a position that does not place God as the authority is to mock God Himself. In Romans 1 the apostle Paul describes a world that worships the creature rather than the Creator. Mankind suppresses the truth in unrighteousness even though God has made Himself known through His creation and His Scriptures. Dawkins said "evolution allows people to be intellectually fulfilled atheists". Unfortunately, it also frees them from God's laws enabling them to be emotionally fulfilled atheists, as now they are free to suppress their conscience without guilt. I suspect this is the greater reason why so many people want to choose that position. They think it allows them freedom to live life however they want to. That's fine until someone else decides to live life in a way that they don't agree with or infringes on their own freedoms. Then all of a sudden they think there is a right and a wrong way to live life. I guess there is not total freedom after all. And if not, then, I guess atheism cannot be true a total freedom and meaningless of life is a logical deduction of that worldview.tjguy
November 5, 2011
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Excellent point! This is one of the reasons the ever changing opinions of scientists don't sway me too much. Almost all of the evidence given at the Scopes Trial to uphold evolution is now known to be false! Cosmology is so full of fudges and special miracles to prop up the Big Bang - ie multiverse, that it is hard to believe any rational person who understood this would actually claim to believe it. The problem is that for the Darwinist, there is no other option as the role of a Creator or Designer is nixed from the starting line. So, it doesn't matter how impossible the odds may seem; it doesn't matter how many fudge factors one has to use to prop up a theory; it doesn't matter how unreasonable it seems, IT HAD TO HAVE HAPPENED so they are willing to believe anything. Darwinism blinds them to the truth. True, the scientific view of the cosmos can be reasoned with and shown to be in error, but the question is, can it ever be shown to be true? Neither can the Bible ever be shown to be true, but there is enough evidence that faith is not blind faith, but actually makes the best sense of the facts imho. Single_Malt wants to poke fun at Moses who met with God on the mountain. The difference between his example of Edmund whoever meeting with God and Moses meeting with God is that all the Israelites KNEW he had actually met with God. The commandments were written in the stone itself by the finger of God. Moses' face shone when he came down from the mountain. The mountain was smoking. A plague broke out when he came down and saw the Israelites involved in idol worship. The people had seen the power of God when they were miraculously delivered from Egypt. The laws make great sense and were affirmed by Jesus. etc.tjguy
November 5, 2011
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All considered, astrophysics and cosmology don’t seem to the the best bet. But I certainly agree that they should be taken into consideration. With great caution.
It depends on how your notions of the universe impact on your life, I suppose. 19th Century astronomers were vastly mistaken about the enormity of the universe; believing as they did that the Milky Way was the whole shebang. Similarly, 20 years ago, I had never heard of Dark Matter/Energy, and so in those respects my ideas about the cosmos were very much in error. But this fairly huge revision in my conception of the cosmos has made no noticeable difference to my life. The reason being that even though I happened to accept a view of the cosmos that was incomplete (and will always be) I did not base my ethical or practical behaviour on these things. I suspect the vast majority of people don't either. But that doesn't mean that our ethical and practical life should therefore be based on immutable dogma either. To reference my first post I can't think of a worse foundation to base one's life than the missives of people who claim to have an exclusive connection with the divine. If you were to ask anyone's reaction to a report that Edmund Hillary spoke to God while perched at Everest's summit; and that God had some instructions for us they would rightly giggle and dismiss it out of hand. And yet there's not the slightest difference between that and Moses' tale. The only thing Moses has going for him is several thousand years of strictly enforced tradition. As uncertain as the scientific view of the cosmos is at least it can at least be reasoned with, shown to be in error and corrected. Religious dogma has no such safeguards.Single_Malt
November 5, 2011
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Single_Malt: Well, there are certainly also many other alternatives: general philosophical reasoning, personal experience, other less shifting parts of science, such as physics, and so on. All considered, astrophysics and cosmology don't seem to the the best bet. But I certainly agree that they should be taken into consideration. With great caution.gpuccio
November 5, 2011
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Why Would Anyone Base Their Beliefs Regarding The Most Vitally Important Question Of All On The Ever Shifting Foundation of Modern Cosmology?
Well, it has as much validity as basing them on the word of a man who staggeres down a mountain, clutching a pair of stone tablets claiming to have just been chatting with God. Actually a bit more, I'd say.Single_Malt
November 4, 2011
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