Uncommon Descent Serving The Intelligent Design Community

Philosopher exposes neo-Darwinian Daniel Dennett: Claims “so preposterous as to verge on the deranged”

Categories
Books of interest
Darwinism
Intelligent Design
Mind
Naturalism
Philosophy
Share
Facebook
Twitter/X
LinkedIn
Flipboard
Print
Email

David Bentley Hart at The New Atlantis. “The Illusionist” is a longish essay, reviewing Daniel Dennett’s Bacteria to Bach and Back. Read it all but here are some highlights:

In a sense, the entire logic of From Bacteria to Bach and Back (though not, of course, all the repetitious details) could be predicted simply from Dennett’s implicit admission on page 364 that no philosopher of mind before Descartes is of any consequence to his thinking. The whole pre-modern tradition of speculation on the matter — Aristotle, Plotinus, the Schoolmen, Ficino, and so on — scarcely qualifies as prologue. And this means that, no matter how many times he sets out, all his journeys can traverse only the same small stretch of intellectual territory. After all, Descartes was remarkable not because, as Dennett claims, his vision was especially “vivid and compelling” — in comparison to the subtleties of earlier theories, it was crude, bizarre, and banal — but simply because no one before him had attempted systematically to situate mental phenomena within a universe otherwise understood as a mindless machine. It was only thus that the “problem” of the mental was born.

In the end, Dennett’s approach has remained largely fixed. Rather than a sequence of careful logical arguments, his method remains, as ever, essentially fabulous: That is, he constructs a grand speculative narrative, comprising a disturbing number of sheer assertions, and an even more disturbing number of missing transitions between episodes. It is often quite a beguiling tale, but its power of persuasion lies in its sprawling relentlessness rather than its cogency. Then again, to be fair, it is at least consistent in its aims. No less than the ancient Aristotelian model of reality, Dennett’s picture is meant to be one in which nature and mind are perfectly congruent with one another, and in which, therefore, the post-Cartesian dilemma need never rear its misshapen head.

And that — though agonizingly protracted over several hundred pages — is the tale Dennett tells. Were it not for a half-dozen or so explanatory gaps, some of which are positively abyssal in size, it would no doubt amount to something more than just a ripping yarn. But, as it stands, it is nonsense.

Yes, nonsense. But we will not understand our times unless we grasp that this sort of nonsense sells! And little else does.

Daniel Dennett 2.jpg
Daniel Dennett/Dmitri Rozhkov, Creative Commons

Dennett is known for claiming that Darwinism is the single greatest idea anyone ever had. It made him a hit among talk show hosts, celebs, and science writers. Easy, agreeable nonsense, suited to their intellectual capacities and aspirations.

But, alas, his story does not hold together. Some of the problems posed by mental phenomena Dennett simply dismisses without adequate reason; others he ignores. Most, however, he attempts to prove are mere “user-illusions” generated by evolutionary history, even though this sometimes involves claims so preposterous as to verge on the deranged.

Not to worry, Big Pharma is bringing out a pill for those times when naturalists worry that nonsense might be a problem. Dennett is best known for claiming that consciousness is a user illusion, like the icons on a computer screen. Hart replies,

The entire notion of consciousness as an illusion is, of course, rather silly. Dennett has been making the argument for most of his career, and it is just abrasively counterintuitive enough to create the strong suspicion in many that it must be more philosophically cogent than it seems, because surely no one would say such a thing if there were not some subtle and penetrating truth hidden behind its apparent absurdity. But there is none. The simple truth of the matter is that Dennett is a fanatic: He believes so fiercely in the unique authority and absolutely comprehensive competency of the third-person scientific perspective that he is willing to deny not only the analytic authority, but also the actual existence, of the first-person vantage. At the very least, though, he is an intellectually consistent fanatic, inasmuch as he correctly grasps (as many other physical reductionists do not) that consciousness really is irreconcilable with a coherent metaphysical naturalism. Since, however, the position he champions is inherently ridiculous, the only way that he can argue on its behalf is by relentlessly, and in as many ways as possible, changing the subject whenever the obvious objections are raised.

For what it is worth, Dennett often exhibits considerable ingenuity in his evasions — so much ingenuity, in fact, that he sometimes seems to have succeeded in baffling even himself…

But ingenuity in evasions wouldn’t diminish Dennett’s popularity among those who Stand For Science, would it? They’re all evading the problem of the invasion of post-modernism in science, looking for irrelevant causes and parties to blame.

Simply enough, you cannot suffer the illusion that you are conscious because illusions are possible only for conscious minds. This is so incandescently obvious that it is almost embarrassing to have to state it. But this confusion is entirely typical of Dennett’s position. In this book, as he has done repeatedly in previous texts, he mistakes the question of the existence of subjective experience for the entirely irrelevant question of the objective accuracy of subjective perceptions, and whether we need to appeal to third-person observers to confirm our impressions. But, of course, all that matters for this discussion is that we have impressions at all.

David Bentley Hart
David Bentley Hart

Hart is right, of course, but the fact is, people with degrees think themselves clever for not grasping such an obvious fact. Maybe their ignorance is a rite of passage. It signals that they are truly In and can’t be attacked.

Certainly, if Dennett’s book encourages one to adopt any position at all, reason dictates that it be something like the exact reverse of the one he defends. The attempt to reduce the phenomena of mental existence to a purely physical history has been attempted before, and has so far always failed. But, after so many years of unremitting labor, and so many enormous books making wildly implausible claims, Dennett can at least be praised for having failed on an altogether majestic scale. More.

It’s hard to think of a more consummate takedown of the Darwinblather that infests public discussion of consciousness these days, frequently funded by skeptical but helpless taxpayers. But so? Dozens of elegant and worthless “consciousness is just a … ” essays are doubtless in the works, facing few objections.

Should we start by refusing to fund philosophy departments until they start addressing real issues instead of fronting lazy garbage for pop science writers at failing media?

See also: Thomas Nagel: Daniel Dennett “maintaining a thesis at all costs” in Bacteria to Bach and Back

Lots of elegant but futile essays about consciousness

Post-modern science: The illusion of consciousness sees through itself

Would we give up naturalism to solve the hard problem of consciousness?

Comments
KF, You and I have literally no disagreement here, and thus there is nothing to argue about.daveS
November 12, 2017
November
11
Nov
12
12
2017
06:27 PM
6
06
27
PM
PDT
DS, I suggest you stop repeating dismissive media talking points. My point just now is not if there are equivalents of speakeasies, but WHERE are they and why is it that we are not hearing of them being busted and closed down regularly, with arrests made and victims sent to counselling to try to patch together some semblance of a sane life. Why is it we pick up signs of the most demonically destructive being enabled and shielded for decades, in what looks like several countries. We are obviously seeing just the tip of a very dirty iceberg, and we need to ask why. I fear the answers are sinister indeed and that if the "Pizzagate" allegations prove false as to the particular case, they will prove to be only hints of a reality that will shake our civilisation when it is fully revealed, as we know how bad it can get -- read Suetonius' lives of the twelve Caesars on Nero, but make sure you are several hours after one meal and several more before the next. KFkairosfocus
November 12, 2017
November
11
Nov
12
12
2017
06:23 PM
6
06
23
PM
PDT
KF, Yes, these crimes exist. But PizzaGate is absurd. Just as organized terrorism exists, but the idea that the GWB administration conspired to bring about the Sept 11 attacks is absurd. That's really all I'm saying.daveS
November 12, 2017
November
11
Nov
12
12
2017
04:41 PM
4
04
41
PM
PDT
DS, I have reason to believe elite classes and major institutions in many countries have been penetrated and tainted by significant numbers of people implicated in all sorts of sexually tinged perversities. In many of these cases illegal behaviour is implicated, too often including abuse of minors. This has been underscored by too many cases over the years, never mind that there will also be false accusations -- something that goes back to Potiphar's wife. Too many legislative assemblies are implicated. In the US case, Epstein should give pause. And, I have come to see that this includes the entertainment media going back a very long way, e.g. Augustine's rebuke to how the theatre of classical times taught the people the techniques of vice, also his stinging rebuke to the circuses of that time. In more modern times, Hollywood and similar centres have been riddled for generations. The porn-perversion anti-industry is little more than licenced prostitution, likely pervaded by various organised crime syndicates. A lot of human trafficking and modern slavery are implicated, and Rotherham warns us on what can happen with police and social work agencies. Do not forget the ongoing abortion holocaust mounting up at a million victims per week on a baseline of well over 800 million since the '70's, which is supported by the corruption of major institutions -- directly implying serious consequences for our civilisation . . . media, education, health care professions, parliaments and cabinets, the courts and more. Education and the church have not escaped the taint of what is going on. So, my question is not if a modern much worse version of the speakeasies of the 1920's in the US exists, my question is just where they are and why we are not seeing them regularly exposed . . . which itself has potentially extremely sinister implications for the major relevant institutions. KFkairosfocus
November 12, 2017
November
11
Nov
12
12
2017
03:27 PM
3
03
27
PM
PDT
KF,
DS, it seems pretty clear that pizza and hot dogs are fairly transparent code words used by abusers; whatever may or may not be so about certain particular places of business.
I take it that means you do not subscribe to the PizzaGate theory. It will be interesting to see if WJM responds.daveS
November 12, 2017
November
11
Nov
12
12
2017
12:44 PM
12
12
44
PM
PDT
RVB8, 32:
‘Consciousness’ my friend, is merely the religious person’s last desperate effort at self importance, at significance in a universe that really, doesn’t care.
On the utter contrary, conscious self awareness and linked reflexivity are at the heart of being self-moved agents that have responsible, rational freedom. Without which -- and recall here, consciousness is our first fact of existence and the means by which we access any and all other facts -- our whole rationality collapses. In short you have done little more than distract yourself from the self-referential incoherence and utter amorality of evolutionary materialist scientism by taking a few cheap internet atheist style rhetorical shots. You have again made yourself a poster-boy. (Had we cast you or your ilk in such a mould, you would have doubtless accused us of strawman caricatures. Sorry, the mould came out of your own mouth.) I suggest that you think again. KFkairosfocus
November 12, 2017
November
11
Nov
12
12
2017
10:42 AM
10
10
42
AM
PDT
Origines, spot on: self referential incoherence of evolutionary materialism and fellow travellers that enable its dominance. KFkairosfocus
November 12, 2017
November
11
Nov
12
12
2017
10:34 AM
10
10
34
AM
PDT
DS, it seems pretty clear that pizza and hot dogs are fairly transparent code words used by abusers; whatever may or may not be so about certain particular places of business. Spirit cooking is also a sad, documented reality reflective of what has to be reckoned a damaged mindset. Frankly, in my worse days, I fear half of several houses of legislative assembly and maybe at least that fraction of entertainers are caught up in much the same. Royals too, from what WJM is saying about the crackdown in Arabia. A terrible cleansing of the elites is going to be needed and it is not going to be pretty. WJM is engaged in that thankless work and more power to him. KFkairosfocus
November 12, 2017
November
11
Nov
12
12
2017
10:31 AM
10
10
31
AM
PDT
Dennet denies the possibility of rational understanding. "I understand X" is not possible, according to Dennett's reasoning, because "I" is a mere 'illusion' or 'inner theater'. IOWs there is no one there who understands. According to Dennet, there is no rational understanding on the level of "I", because there is no "I". So, is there perhaps rational understanding on the underlying level of “uncomprehending competences” in the machinery of our brains? Given that they are “uncomprehending” ... res ipsa loquitur.
... those who claim that all beliefs, acts of reasoning, etc., are nonveracious are positing a closed circle in which no beliefs are produced by the proper methods by which beliefs can be said to be veracious or rational. ... Since the raison d’être of their thesis is that there is no outside of the circle, they do not have the epistemic right to assume a position independent of it, and so their beliefs about the nonveracity of beliefs or reasoning are just as nonveracious as those they criticize. If all of the beliefs inside the circle are suspect, we cannot judge between truth and falsity, since any such judgment would be just as suspect as what it seeks to adjudicate. ... At no point can they step out of the circle to a transcendent standpoint that would allow them to reject some beliefs as tainted while remaining untainted themselves. [Jim Slagle]
Origenes
November 11, 2017
November
11
Nov
11
11
2017
05:03 PM
5
05
03
PM
PDT
What's the spirit FourFaces? I think you are on to something...let's see...J-Mac
November 11, 2017
November
11
Nov
11
11
2017
06:17 AM
6
06
17
AM
PDT
rvb8, My point, and one that was clearly lost on you, was that science has a tendency to reduce the sphere in which god works. Science knows how God works? ‘Consciousness’ my friend, is merely the religious person’s last desperate effort at self importance, at significance in a universe that really, doesn’t care. You have no idea what consciousness is, how life came about or even what causes something as simple as motion and yet you somehow know what the universe cares about? Man, this is pathetic.FourFaces
November 10, 2017
November
11
Nov
10
10
2017
07:54 PM
7
07
54
PM
PDT
FourFaces, I don't, 'jump up and down and foam at the mouth', about anything, least of all prepostorous ancient myth; I leave that to Ken Ham and crew. My point, and one that was clearly lost on you, was that science has a tendency to reduce the sphere in which god works. You know? How god would be used to explain absolutely everything in humanity's past; everything! Then as time and evidence improved, we removed god to the sideline. Then as we became even more aware of our utter insignificance, and the absolute stupendous universe in which we, inconceivably exist, we said, "This god chap, quite small isn't he?" 'Consciousness' my friend, is merely the religious person's last desperate effort at self importance, at significance in a universe that really, doesn't care. Enjoy your life and your friends, you won't get another; and that is just fine by me! :)rvb8
November 10, 2017
November
11
Nov
10
10
2017
07:50 PM
7
07
50
PM
PDT
rbb8, ‘Consciousness’, the latest thing materialists can not explain. The simple fact, that upon death, consciousness appears to likewise die, rings no bells in the creationist’s heart? As a dualist Christian, I believe that consciousness requires both a physical brain and a spirit. Why should it surprise me that consciousness ceases with death? Heck, consciousness ceases with sleep or anesthesia. Jesus himself compared death to a type of sleep, i.e., a condition whereby the spirit is no longer interacting with the brain. [snip human religious claims] Wrestling against strawmen is not particularly brave. [AIDS and sinners, etc...] Are you a homosexual and you have a bone to pick with certain Christians for judging you? You want to produce evidence for the, ‘unnatural’, hence proving the, ‘supernatural’? Be very careful, because when your latest effort, ‘consciousness’, is given a perfectly understandable, ‘natural’ answer, your oogity boogity, will once again be shown for what it truly is; manmade myth! Well, it is impossible to give consciousness a perfectly understandable, ‘natural’ answer (you don't have one) because it is easy to show that we experience the supernatural (the non-physical) all the time. The visual cortex receives a stream of neuronal pulses from the retina. They are just pulses but we are not conscious of pulses flowing through our synapses, axons and dendrites. Instead we see a fabulous, colorful 3D vista that exists neither in the brain not in the world. We can even easily trick the mind into creating this non-physical 3D vista using a mirror or virtual reality goggles and a computer program. The supernatural is right in front of you but you are too blind and cowardly to see it. You can jump up and down and foam at the mouth if you want to, but you are the one who is preaching your "oogity boogity" with the claim that the non-physical somehow emerges from the physical. Give it a rest already. It's a sign of a cretinous mind.FourFaces
November 10, 2017
November
11
Nov
10
10
2017
07:15 PM
7
07
15
PM
PDT
'Consciousness', the latest thing materialists can not explain. The simple fact, that upon death, consciousness appears to likewise die, rings no bells in the creationist's heart? Okay, I'l play your silly game. Earthquakes were a long time favourite of the religious as clear displeasure of god with humanity, until we discovered plate tectonics. Disease was a bug-bear of the religious, showing god was unhappy with his human crew. We then discovered bacteria, and god was put down. Hell! even in the 1980s, some religious believed AIDS was god's wrath upon the homosexual community, whom it seemed to focus upon. They were morbidly joyous at god's judgement upon these unnatural sinners. Sadly, we now know AIDS is a human affliction, treatable, though not curable; yet! God is marched behind the wall again! You want to produce evidence for the, 'unnatural', hence proving the, 'supernatural'? Be very careful, because when your latest effort, 'consciousness', is given a perfectly understandable, 'natural' answer, your oogity boogity, will once again be shown for what it truly is; manmade myth!rvb8
November 10, 2017
November
11
Nov
10
10
2017
06:39 PM
6
06
39
PM
PDT
KF,
hot dogs and spirit cooking etc
Hm, I must have missed that part. But, don't tell me you've fallen for the PizzaGate meme as well? To coin a phrase, it's "so preposterous as to verge on the deranged".daveS
November 10, 2017
November
11
Nov
10
10
2017
03:02 PM
3
03
02
PM
PDT
DS, don't forget the hot dogs and spirit cooking etc etc too. This stuff is really disgusting. KFkairosfocus
November 10, 2017
November
11
Nov
10
10
2017
11:21 AM
11
11
21
AM
PDT
WJM, Is this all related to PizzaGate, by any chance?daveS
November 10, 2017
November
11
Nov
10
10
2017
07:34 AM
7
07
34
AM
PDT
KF In case you didn't know, the recent Saudi arrests of so many of the royal family is part of the global human trafficking take-down Trump is spearheading. Much more to follow as the attack on the globalist cartels ramps up and big names like Weinstein, Podesta and Sheen start going down. There's a reason Donna Brazille is jumping off the DNC boat.William J Murray
November 10, 2017
November
11
Nov
10
10
2017
07:22 AM
7
07
22
AM
PDT
Axel @ 20: Got it. Thanks.Truth Will Set You Free
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
10:25 AM
10
10
25
AM
PDT
WJM, I see moves on the abusers have been hitting headlines. KFkairosfocus
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
09:17 AM
9
09
17
AM
PDT
kairosfocus at 18: Did anyone notice Fox News enter the building? Where did they park the crew trucks? We didn't invite them because we didn't think this philosophy stuff was really their thing... ;) Seriously, I think Dennett is *overrated even a poseur* and way out of date. And that the big question re Hart's takedown is, why didn't it happen a decade ago?News
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
08:54 AM
8
08
54
AM
PDT
rvb8 said:
Dennet is easy to read, and his ideas logical.
Perhaps you mean his ideas have the illusion of being logical?William J Murray
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
08:08 AM
8
08
08
AM
PDT
rvb8 @ 7. I notice you have absolutely nothing of substance to say. When you have no substance I suppose an attack on style is all you've got. Very telling.Barry Arrington
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
07:29 AM
7
07
29
AM
PDT
I suppose you mean that my post, #1, was convoluted and opaque, TTWSYF, so I'll try and make it more succinct and intelligible. Some people with very sharp minds, such as a number of Catholic prelates and theologians, notably, the Pope, write with such consummate, mastery of language that they often write a devastating critique of a treatise of some sort, written by a colleague, which seems all the more brutal for being expressed without any rancour but, on the contrary, in the most gracious, urbane and anodyne-seeming terms. It's probably still too prolix and convoluted, but I did my best! But while I'm still in full obsequious mode - what a contrast to Mike's analysis, which expressed what I suspect we all felt, but wouldn't care to have tried to express.Axel
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
07:16 AM
7
07
16
AM
PDT
Mike1962 @ 15: Brilliant.Truth Will Set You Free
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
07:08 AM
7
07
08
AM
PDT
GP, I suggest THAT we are conscious is self evident. That we may err and even be stubborn in clinging thereto is notorious. That's why we need to look to plumbline self evident truths to help us correct. KF PS: Those taking cheap dismissive shots at Fox News and "Religion" should note the scapegoating and blanket dismissiveness implied are telltales. Extremes provoke mirror-image extremes but the point of balance is the true opposite to all extremes. Hence the need to deal with the straight vs spin challenge in our time.kairosfocus
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
06:39 AM
6
06
39
AM
PDT
But again, what can you expect from one of the main supporters of compatibilism? :)gpuccio
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
06:16 AM
6
06
16
AM
PDT
"Simply enough, you cannot suffer the illusion that you are conscious because illusions are possible only for conscious minds. This is so incandescently obvious that it is almost embarrassing to have to state it." Great statement! :) It is embarrassing, indeed! And having to state it anyway tells nothing good about our recent culture.gpuccio
November 9, 2017
November
11
Nov
9
09
2017
12:49 AM
12
12
49
AM
PDT
Materialist: Consciousness is an illusion. Skeptic: An illusion of what? Materialist: (Crickets) A mirage is an illusion. A stage magician performs illusions. But a mirage is actually something that appears to be something that is actually real, namely water. When a stage magician appears to saw a woman in half, he doesn't really do it, but sawing a woman in half is a real possible thing. Calling consciousness an illusion has no analogy to this. Illusions are not primary facts. Consciousness is the primary fact of our existence, more fundamental than any product of intellectual reasoning. And so far nobody can provide any justifiable gap-free reason to think that mere matter in a certain configuration is the source of it, or how it possibly could be in principle.mike1962
November 8, 2017
November
11
Nov
8
08
2017
08:44 PM
8
08
44
PM
PDT
If there's no consciousness who's reading his books? Hmm on second thought...es58
November 8, 2017
November
11
Nov
8
08
2017
08:41 PM
8
08
41
PM
PDT
1 2 3

Leave a Reply