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Turkish Education Minister Supports ID


Mustafa Akyol is some one you should know. Check out his blog, where he describes this latest development in Turkey: http://www.thewhitepath.com/archives/2006/10/turkish_minister_supports_intelligent_design.php.

Qualifications! Schmalifications! It’s the clarity and logic, not the brain washing, that counts. Mustafa Akyol is important for many reasons. For one he’s on our side, not only in the crusade to roll back the darkness of Darwin but also in the war on Islamic radicalism. As Mark Steyn observes in his latest (America Alone: The End of the World as We Know It), the Muslim Middle East has more potential for moderation than the disaffected hordes of Eurabia. It’s a brave man who will not only stand up to the god of the secular West but also has the courage to risk the wrath of the fanatical East. Let’s give such brave souls the credit and support they deserve! Rude
I was refuting Ms. O'leary. She said "...his interests and qualifications are highly relevant." I asked how his qualifications (a history degree) are relevant in the fields of biology and evolution. mike1962: That's a tired argument. I, for one, started out in the field of biology seeking to prove the evil "Darwinistas" wrong... as I was a fundamentalist Christian. Once in college and away from those who brainwashed me, I was able to let go of my preconceptions and accept the fact of evolution. So, if you wanna call me a "typical Darwinista," have fun. You can twist virtually anything to support your personal views. It happens all the time in religion. This is why there are so many divisions in the church. Church members who are raised to believe a particular ideology are going to hold to that belief. Look at the differing views among Christians on tongues, rapture, entire sancitification, eternal security, KJV-only, women preachers, the list goes on and on. If a Southern Baptist, Pentecostal, and Methodist all read a given chapter of the bible, they will interpret it to mean quite different things due to there preconceptions. It is, however, possible to overcome this and seek objective truth. It is the goal of science to do this. People on all sides do, however, fail. I just feel that the ID movement fails horribly. cfrench
cfrench: "He’s not seeking objective scientific truth, he’s seeking to make science support his own beliefs." Doesn't sound any different from the typical Darwinista to me from where I sit. An ideologue is an ideologue. mike1962
Of course he’s going to support ID. He’s not seeking objective scientific truth, he’s seeking to make science support his own beliefs.
Oops. Charlie
cfrench, I agree, every time someone speaks or writes, we should conduct an audit or investigation of their background and determine if the have any particular worldview, religion or anti-religion, or personal philosophy that could be coloring their views. And once we find anything, we should toss out everything they have to say. So, at the end of the day, who will be left standing? Ekstasis
"In his environment, his interests and qualifications are highly relevant." What does that mean? What are his qualifications, his history degree? "Since the mid 1990s he has been working with several modernist Islamic foundations of Turkey, especially with those FOCUSED ON explaining modern science from a THEISTIC POINT OF VIEW." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mustafa_Akyol So basically, he's focused on explaining science from a theistic point of view... sounds real OBJECTIVE to me! Of course he's going to support ID. He's not seeking objective scientific truth, he's seeking to make science support his own beliefs. cfrench
JGuy, Great question, which only time will tell. And of course it raises the question of causation. On one hand, scientists and engineers exposed to ID concepts will study and analyze living organisms with the mindset that they can and will discover awesome feats of technology and design contained within these living entities. Sort of like other nations that are behind the U.S. and grab an F-15 that goes down over their territory, eager to learn every advanced nuance they possibly can, and reverse engineer it. And this is certainly already happening. Or perhaps we should reverse the order -- maybe ID is more of a result of coming face to face with the fact that living organisms have awesome and amazing macro and micro features exhibiting design and engineering, and then drawing the natural conclusion that ID is true. No matter, it is probably a combination of the two. Now, while NDE does not preclude design and engineering attributes and systems within living organisms, it does not naturally flow from the model, nor does it naturally focus attention on the integrated design aspect. In other words, NDE must be retooled (no pun intended) to accommodate complex design, while ID is sitting pretty in place to capitalize on the engineering and technology aspects of living organisms. For example, the effort to pursue nanotechnology will not even touch on NDE, but it is all about intelligently designed systems. So, which do you pick for the wave of the future? Ekstasis
Frm moderator Denyse: Suricou, watch it! Mustafa Akyol is NOT in any sense a "fundamentalist." In his environment, his interests and qualifications are highly relevant. Not for you, but for anyone who cares: Unfortunately, all that an extremist imam need do in many Muslim environments today is quote Western materialists in full flight. How about Dawkins going soft on crime and child abuse because - according to him - people do not have free will anyway, and besides raising a child as a religious believer is worse than sexual abuse? The imam might well sum up, "See! That's what inevitably comes of failing to buy into my extremism!" I am glad that Mustafa Akyol and others are seeking a responsible approach to science. Now, if Dawkins would just resume the career in zoology from which he has been absent for decades .... O'Leary
Could we make a prediction, that regions where educational systems incorporate ID, will see a marked increase in technological & scientific productivity and/or increased output of measurably more productive scientists & engineers. JGuy
What an uncomfortable ally :> But something that will very likely happen. Muslim fundamentalists are just as opposed to evolution as Christian fundamentalists. And there is a higher proportion of fundies amoung Muslims than Christians. Besides, he has no qualifications in biology - do a quick google on his name. His interests and qualifications are all in history, politics or sociology. SuricouRaven
Very interesting! The following may not be a welcome comparison to all (certainly not to me per se); but as Islam gains an increasing foothold in Europe, perhaps we will see ID will gain leverage against Darwinism through this avenue to some degree. [[OFF TOPIC]] Check out the following article at Popular Science ( http://www.popsci.com ) - Better Than Blood? (front page article) Shouldn't this be attributed to Design - or will the Darweenies try and hijack it to their credit? lucID

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