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Can We Afford To Be Charitable To Darwinists?

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An earlier thread here wondered which group (presumably, Darwinists or IDists/Creationists) was more charitable. At TSZ,  a rhetorical post full of anti-ID venom popped up asking if IDists “deserved” charity (as in, charitable interaction & debate).  (Previously, I would have provided a link to the TSZ post, but I’m no longer interested in “fair play”.)

I used to be one that diligently attempted to provide Darwinists charitable interaction.  I tried not to ridicule, demean, or use terms that would cause hurt or defensive feelings.  My hope was that reason, politely offered, would win the day.  My theistic perspective is that returning the bad behavior I received at sites like TSZ would be wrong on my part.  I thought I should stick to politely producing logical and evidence-based exchanges, regardless of what Darwinists did. I note that several others here at UD do the same.  Lately, however, I’ve come to the conclusion that what I’m attempting to do is the equivalent of bringing a knife to a gun fight; polite reasoning with Darwinists, for the most part, is simply setting up our own failure.  It’s like entering a war zone with rules of engagement that effectively undermine a soldier’s capacity to adequately defend themselves, let alone win a war.  While pacifism is a laudable idea, it does not win wars. It simply gives the world to the barbarians.

And that’s the problem; a lot of us don’t realize we’re in a war, a war where reason, truth, religion and spirituality is under direct assault by the post-modern equivalent of barbarians.  They, for the most part, have no compunction about lying, misleading, dissembling, attacking, blacklisting, ridiculing, bullying and marginalizing; more than that, they have no problem using every resource at their means, legal or not, polite or not, reasonable or not, to destroy theism, and in particular Christianity (as wells as conservative/libertarian values in general).  They have infiltrated the media, academia and the entertainment industry and use their influence to generate narratives with complete disregard for the truth, and entirely ignore even the most egregious barbarism against those holding beliefs they disagree with.

Wars are what happen when there is no common ground between those that believe in something worth fighting for.  There is no common ground between the universal post-modern acid of materialist Darwinism and virtually any modern theism. There is no common ground between Orwellian statism-as-God and individual libertarianism with freedom of (not “from”) religion.   There is only war.  One of the unfortunate problems of war is that certain distasteful methods must be employed simply because they are the only way to win. In this war, in a society that is largely a low-information, media-controlled battleground, logic and reason are, for the most part, ineffective.  The truth is ineffective because it is drowned out by a concerted cacophony of lies, or simply ignored by the gatekeepers of low-information infotainment.  What has been shown effective is the Alinsky arsenal of rhetoric, emotional manipulation, and narrative control.

I would find it distasteful to pick up a gun in a ground war and have to shoot others to defend my family and way of life, but I would do so.  Should I not pick up Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals and employ the weapons of my adversaries, if it is the most effective way  – perhaps the only way – of winning the cultural war?  There comes a point in time where all the high ground offers is one’s back against the precipice as the barbarian horde advances.

Does it make one a barbarian if one employs the tactics of the barbarian to win the war?  I’ve seen that argument countless times in the media: we will become that which we are fighting against.  I used to identify with that – I wouldn’t lower myself to “their” level.  The war wasn’t worth winning if it meant using the tactics of the enemy.  Now, however, I see that sentiment as part of the cultural conditioning towards the failure of good, principled people while the post-modernists employ our principles, our sense of reason, of good, of fair play, against us.  They have no compunction using the principles of Christianity (or any rational theistic morality) as a bludgeon to coerce the religious/spiritual into giving up social ground.

I would never pick up a gun and use it on anyone other than in circumstances where myself or my loved ones or way of life was at risk; and, after protecting those things, I would set it aside.  I have realized that there are weapons that must be used in a cultural war like we now face that I would never employ otherwise.  Using them in such a case doesn’t make me like those who use them all the time, in every case and instance, for whatever they want. Using a club to beat the barbarians back doesn’t make me a barbarian; it keeps the barbarians from taking over. Politely reasoning with them to protect a politely reasoning society only serves to hand the city over to the horde.

It isn’t using a club, or Alinsky-style tactics, that makes one a barbarian; it’s what one uses those tools in service of that makes the difference.  Would you lie to, ridicule, blacklist, bully a Nazi, if it meant saving your civilization? Make no mistake: that’s how they see us – as neanderthal Nazis standing in the way of their utopian, statist, religion-free, morally relative, science-as-gospel society – and they are willing to do anything to win their goal.

So, the question isn’t, to paraphrase the TSZ heading, “do Darwinists deserve charity”; of course they deserve it. Everyone does. That’s part of our modern, moral, rational theistic morality.  But the sad fact is, we cannot afford to give them charity, because to give them charity, IMO, is to give aid and comfort to an enemy bent upon our destruction, and the destruction of our way of life.

Comments
I used to be one that diligently attempted to provide Darwinists charitable interaction.
When was this, William? Must have been before I became aware of Uncommon Descent, eight years ago. And seeing things in terms of a battle joined with arguments and reasoning all the while ignoring or miscomprehending simple facts is not likely to be persuasive.Alan Fox
September 15, 2013
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William I can assure you it feels almost exactly opposite to me. I try very hard to be polite and criticise the argument not the person (like you I sometimes fail). Yet whenever I get involved in any debate of length here I can almost count on receiving personal abuse - have you seen some of Joe or Chris Doyle's comments? It is true of internet debate in general - people type things they would never say face to face. But your warlike words worry me slightly. There is nothing like fear for creating hatred. Who are these terrible Darwinists? Most of the population of Europe and virtually all scientists accept a broadly Darwinian account of life. A large proportion are atheist/materialists and lead happy, peaceful and fufilled lives. Darwinians include economically and socially conservative people and also many theists. Could you identify the enemy? Thanks and peace! MarkMark Frank
September 15, 2013
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Attention Phil and anyone else interested: Nick Matzke is now officially Nick Matzke, Ph.D. with a dissertation explicitly on evolutionary biology from the University of California at Berkeley. H/T Wesley ElsberryAlan Fox
September 15, 2013
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From my perspective, what this thread strongly indicates is that "the intelligent design movement" (as distinct from the "theory" of intelligent design) relies on a series of conflations between a number of quite different concepts and positions. The key terms that enable this conflation are "materialism" and "Darwinism". Without these vague (and, I think, utterly useless) terms, there would be much less (if anything) to tie together evolutionary theory with secularism and humanism. The conflation functions by allowing a string of associations between the scientific-empirical issues (evolutionary theory and design theory), the epistemological issues (pragmatism and rationalism), the metaphysical issues (naturalism and theism), the religious-political issues (secularized humanism and political theology), the cultural-political issues (liberalism/progressivism and social conservativism). The intelligent design movement is sustained by the perception of linkages between these quite different (and wholly separable) domains. At work is a very stark, black-and-white, with-us-or-against-us, Manichean mentality. Of course, it doesn't help that there are people, such as myself, who both accept evolutionary theory and line up on the pragmatist, naturalistic, secularistic, humanistic, and liberal-progressivist side of the issues. But there are also lots of people who stake out all sorts of different combinations, and who are given short shrift by the Manichean mentality.Kantian Naturalist
September 15, 2013
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WJM:
I’m not a Christian, Neil.
You don't have to be a Christian to respect and be charitable toward those with whom you disagree.Neil Rickert
September 15, 2013
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Give honor to whom honor is due. We should be as charitable to Darwinists as we would be to any citizen. Many of my professors and mentors were Darwinists. An ex-girlfriend was a Darwinist, but her being a democrat was more of a disqualifier. As far as charity goes, we dispense it independent of one's level Darwinism, but on other factors. If the Darwinists is someone like laser-inventor and Christian Charles Townes, we honor them as they are due. If the Darwinists are Jeffrey Dahmer or Amy Bishop we throw them in jail.scordova
September 15, 2013
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Deuce:
It doesn’t matter whether those actually are your principles, or that Neil doesn’t believe those principles himself.
I do try to live up to those principles myself, though I often fall short.
Again, materialists (and particularly eliminativist materialists) don’t really believe in objective truth, or in rational argument.
I am not a materialist nor an eliminativist.Neil Rickert
September 15, 2013
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Yes, Deuce, I was just taunting Neil. Great to see your input on this thread, though. They have this weird way of wanting to quote scripture and its usually suicidal. And look at that Panda's Thumb blog (not literally). First they got the business about the Panda's thumb wrong. Then, in order to give force to what they would like to co-opt as their rallying cry, they quote from a particularly sonorous and declamatory speech by Oliver Cromwell, beseeching whoever he was addressing, 'in the bowels of Christ.' Why? Why, to add force to their insipid, moral-relativist tosh, of course. I don't think Cromwell's invocation of Christ would convince the Irish of his piety, any more than that of Panda's Thumb's finest.Axel
September 15, 2013
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I'm not a Christian, Neil.William J Murray
September 15, 2013
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johnp, I respect your attitude, but for the most part those whom we are in battle with are beyond reason and civil discourse, and only employ such inasmuch as it will further their agenda, using any means necessary to get their way. That being rude loses an argument otherwise based on logic and evidence only demonstrates my position about the low-information public; if rudeness will sway them away from reason, their fealty is up for grabs via rhetoric and emotional pleading anyway. They are not devotees of logic and reason, but owe allegiance only to emotion.William J Murray
September 15, 2013
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As well Mr. Matzke, as a Christian who was saved by the grace of Christ at a low point in my life, i.e. personal experience, and seeing as how you fight tooth and nail against the truth, it would be very uncharitable of me not to warn you about what awaits those who purposely set themselves against God in this life, i.e. hell! Here is a former militant atheist's NDE account of hell
video - Howard Storm continues to share his gripping story of his own near death experience. Today, he picks up just as Jesus was rescuing him from the horrors of Hell and carrying him into the glories of Heaven. http://www.daystar.com/ondemand/joni-heaven-howard-storm-j924/#.UKvFrYYsE31 "I knew for certain there was no such thing as life after death. Only simple minded people believed in that sort of thing. I didn't believe in God, Heaven, or Hell, or any other fairy tales. I drifted into darkness. Drifting asleep into anihilation.,,(Chapter 2 - The Descent),, I was standing up. I opened my eyes to see why I was standing up. I was between two hospital beds in the hospital room.,,, Everything that was me, my consciousness and my physical being, was standing next to the bed. No, it wasn't me lying in the bed. It was just a thing that didn't have any importance to me. It might as well have been a slab of meat in the supermarket",,, Howard Storm - former hard-core atheist - Excerpt from his book, 'My Descent Into Death' (Page 12-14) http://books.google.com/books?id=kd4gxtQAeq8C&pg=PA12#v=onepage&q&f=false Why Hell is so Horrible - Bill Wiese - video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hd_so3wPw8
Also of note, 'eternity' is not something that is made up by Christians but is actually now found to be a very real part of reality:
Albert Einstein - Special Relativity - Insight Into Eternity - 'thought experiment' video http://www.metacafe.com/w/6545941/ "The laws of relativity have changed timeless existence from a theological claim to a physical reality. Light, you see, is outside of time, a fact of nature proven in thousands of experiments at hundreds of universities. I don’t pretend to know how tomorrow can exist simultaneously with today and yesterday. But at the speed of light they actually and rigorously do. Time does not pass." Richard Swenson - More Than Meets The Eye, Chpt. 12
It is also very interesting to note that this strange higher dimensional, eternal, framework for time, found in both special relativity and in general relativity at the event horizon of black holes, finds corroboration in Near Death Experience testimonies:
'In the 'spirit world,,, instantly, there was no sense of time. See, everything on earth is related to time. You got up this morning, you are going to go to bed tonight. Something is new, it will get old. Something is born, it's going to die. Everything on the physical plane is relative to time, but everything in the spiritual plane is relative to eternity. Instantly I was in total consciousness and awareness of eternity, and you and I as we live in this earth cannot even comprehend it, because everything that we have here is filled within the veil of the temporal life. In the spirit life that is more real than anything else and it is awesome. Eternity as a concept is awesome. There is no such thing as time. I knew that whatever happened was going to go on and on.' Mickey Robinson - Near Death Experience testimony - video http://www.metacafe.com/watch/4045544
bornagain77
September 15, 2013
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Mr. Matzke, I read with great interest and enjoyment Dr. Berlinski's thorough rebuttals of your review of "Darwin's Doubt":
A Graduate Student (Nick Matzke) Writes - David Berlinski July 9, 2013 http://www.evolutionnews.org/2013/07/a_graduate_stud074221.html A One-Man Clade - David Berlinski - July 18, 2013 http://www.evolutionnews.org/2013/07/a_one_man_clade074601.html Hopeless Matzke -David Berlinski & Tyler Hampton August 18, 2013 http://www.evolutionnews.org/2013/08/hopeless_matzke075631.html
I actually felt a little bad for you after such a intellectual beating by Berlinski. Moreover I found that, just as I had thought, that you did not really understand the science behind Darwin's Doubt after reading it in only one day and posting your review on Amazon. Have you had a chance to re-read Darwin's Doubt, this time for 'scientific' understanding, so as to offer a coherent scientific response to these crushing critiques against your arguments against Darwin's Doubt? If so please list them so that your lies may be taken apart once again! I saw that you referenced 'NAZI's' in your post. Funny you should bring that up, for Dr. Weikart has made a very compelling case that 'evolutionary ethics' deeply influenced NAZI ideology:
From Darwin To Hitler - Richard Weikart - video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_5EwYpLD6A How Darwin's Theory Changed the World Rejection of Judeo-Christian values Excerpt: Weikart explains how accepting Darwinist dogma shifted society’s thinking on human life: “Before Darwinism burst onto the scene in the mid-nineteenth century, the idea of the sanctity of human life was dominant in European thought and law (though, as with all ethical principles, not always followed in practice). Judeo-Christian ethics proscribed the killing of innocent human life, and the Christian churches explicitly forbade murder, infanticide, abortion, and even suicide. “The sanctity of human life became enshrined in classical liberal human rights ideology as ‘the right to life,’ which according to John Locke and the United States Declaration of Independence, was one of the supreme rights of every individual” (p. 75). Only in the late nineteenth and especially the early twentieth century did significant debate erupt over issues relating to the sanctity of human life, especially infanticide, euthanasia, abortion, and suicide. It was no mere coincidence that these contentious issues emerged at the same time that Darwinism was gaining in influence. Darwinism played an important role in this debate, for it altered many people’s conceptions of the importance and value of human life, as well as the significance of death” (ibid.). http://www.gnmagazine.org/issues/gn85/darwin-theory-changed-world.htm The Moral Impact Of Darwinism On Society - Dr. Phil Fernandes - video http://www.nwcreation.net/videos/Impact_Of_Darwinism_On_Society.html At some future period … the civilized races of man will almost certainly exterminate and replace throughout the world the savage races. At the same time the anthropomorphous [Having or suggesting human form and appearance] apes … will no doubt be exterminated. The break will then be rendered wider, for it will intervene between man in a more civilized state, as we may hope … the Caucasian, and some ape as low as a baboon, instead of as at present between the negro or Australian and the gorilla” Charles Darwin,The Descent of Man pg. 201, published in 1871:
bornagain77
September 15, 2013
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Did you not notice that those injunctions/commandments of Jesus addressed personal slights and transgressions against a person, made by another individual? Of course. Neil was just attempting another Aliskyite tactic: "Make your opponent live up to his principles." It doesn't matter whether those actually are your principles, or that Neil doesn't believe those principles himself. Again, materialists (and particularly eliminativist materialists) don't really believe in objective truth, or in rational argument. The point is just to hamstring you and make you play on the materialist's terms.Deuce
September 15, 2013
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Given the unremitting burden of the text, I'm astonished that you could have fancied WM had made a typo in his title. Exegesis is definitely not your strong point, Neil. Back to the drawing board.Axel
September 15, 2013
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Neil Rickert, Did you not notice that those injunctions/commandments of Jesus addressed personal slights and transgressions against a person, made by another individual? And how virulently unforgiving and vehemently condemnatory Jesus' tone and even his actions were, (as Brent pointed out with his reference to the moneylenders in the Temple), when addressing the wickedness of organised, oppressive, exploitatory groups, such as the religious Establishment who eventually had him judicially murdered. Note how they couldn't effect his murder with sufficient cruelty, without bending the rules by getting the Romans to crucify him. Always the way of the most despotic politicians - we make the laws, we don't have to abide by them. It's not safe to quote scripture, unless you cherish it; and even then it's easy to miss the true import. It is a sacramental object as full of mystery as the Ark of the Covenant.Axel
September 15, 2013
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Here is the link that William declined to give in his opening post: Do ID proponents deserve charity? I think there may be a typo in the thread title. William surely intended to ask "Can we afford not to be charitable to Darwinists?" And some words from Matthew 5:38-44 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also. And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away. Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; Neil Rickert
September 15, 2013
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"Nothing is as powerful as an idea whose time has come." That was the atheist, Victor Hugo. IDism is far from being a 'revolution' in the making. The rhetoric-frantic, PR project at the Disco Institute isn't convincing natural scientists to adopt their ideology. Why should you? And theists, who Bruce David mostly ignores out of myopia for his IDist activism, are defending good and responsible science too, including limited evolutionary theories. If the world was created by God, then 'strictly [natural] science' can neither prove nor disprove that. It requires philosophy and theology, something IDists have shown themselves mostly incapable of adding fruitfully to the discourse. And now we see they want to act uncharitably against atheists, whom they already discriminate against by the logic of their 'Transcendent Designer' theory. There's no need to be afraid of IDism because it is self-disqualifying from the outset.Gregory
September 15, 2013
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Some of this I agree with, some of this I disagree with. First, I agree that you shouldn't try to be "nice" in dealing with materialists. You shouldn't attempt good faith debate with individuals who don't, and can't, argue in good faith. Darwinian materialism implies the nonexistence of objective truth, of objective rules of logic, and of our ability to grasp objective rules of logic to find and know objective truth. For the materialists, establishing the "truth" is all about winning the "narrative" by any means necessary rather than reason, so it's foolish to enter a debate with them expecting anything other than ridicule, lies, appeals to consensus, threats, violence where they have the power to get away with it, and so forth. However, the whole reason for combating them is to bring people to the Truth, to reestablish truth and reason as supreme, and to dispel lies and false narratives. That's where I can't agree with the full use of the Alinskyite arsenal: too many of Alinsky's tactics revolve around dishonesty and the promulgation of lies. We should all be unrelentingly truthful - with an emphasis on the "unrelenting". That does not preclude going after opponents with both barrels, mocking them for their logical perversity and subjectivism, and using other high-pressure tactics to cow them and undermine their credibility. While this means you will lack one of their weapons - the use of convenient lies - it also means that they will lack a weapon that you have, that being the fact that peoples' natural common sense and capacity for reason will be on your side. And remember: every lie you expose is a lie you can mock.Deuce
September 15, 2013
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Gregory, You seem intelligent enough to make some very good points, but your lack of either ability (doubtful) or willingness (more likely) to parse the actuality of the situation and circumstances only guarantees you to be wizzing in the wind. There are many posts by those advocating, or at least not unwilling to consider using, what are considered (kindly note and think about those italics) uncharitable means to shame (that is at least what I hope to achieve, because shame is exactly the medicine required) those who are being shameless, that are quite charitable. Hopefully that last (long) sentence can help you step back and consider the actual situation, that perhaps the "uncharitableness" we are speaking of here is only a very subsequent tool used in a much broader battle; yes, of actual science. Perhaps you can then allow yourself to consider that the foot that the shoe fits on --- the shoe of ideology leading the way --- belongs to the naturalist, materialist, atheists. If it didn't, then it seems rather strange that it is well documented of how such ruthlessly try to silence the rigorous dissenting voices.Brent
September 15, 2013
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I don't know who said it, but I am certain it's true: "There is nothing more powerful than an idea whose time has come." The demise of Darwinism and its replacement with ID is such an idea. The reason that Darwinists are fighting so ferociously and desperately is because they can see the writing on the wall, and they are deeply afraid, afraid for their worldview and with it how they identify themselves. I agree with John, adopting their rudeness and venom will only impede the process. Darwinism's demise will usher in a new birth of spirituality. But although I know a lot of you on this blog will object, it will not be a renewal of Christianity, or indeed any currently recognized religion. There are millions of people in this country and around the world who accept the existence of a Creator but who reject all the old forms of worship, who are open to a new understanding of God and our relationship with Him/Her/It. The result of the demise of Darwinism and with it the materialist view of the world will be a flowering of this new and deeper understanding of the true nature of God, ourselves, and the creation.Bruce David
September 15, 2013
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timaeus, take my advice - whatever you do in your time participating at UD, just don't make a comment in this thread about being uncharitable to ghosts. Ignore that this actually *is* part of 'IDism' and the movement that IDT has spawned among neo-creationists. It would tar you with association to the IDM. You're an anti-atheist warrior just as much as WJM is and Brent is, after all, right? ;)
"It’s total war."
This thread is both wonderful and pitiful! :P WJM probably doesn't realise how badly this OP and his attitude reflects on IDism to most people, i.e. to non- and anti-IDists. And the comments so far from Alex and Brent especially are a perfect example of what IDism is actually mainly about. It's not really about 'science'; it's first and foremost part of a culture war...by intention, by activism, by choice. Ah, those war-mongering American 'movements'! Why not just fight your way out of all your problems? Of course, not all atheists are uncharitable, nor are all IDists. Nevertheless, imo, the level of thought and scientific competence is substantially higher at TSZ than here at UD, with its many YECists, aka 'backwards folks.' But then again, as this thread shows, IDism isn't really about ideas, it's mainly about attempts at 'cultural renewal' and employs 'resistance' to the rising secularism in the USA, just as the original name of the "Centre for the Renewal of Science and Culture" displayed. It makes one wonder if UDers realise why the Disco changed the title, dropping "the Renewal" - was it just too obvious and counter-productive to the 'strictly [natural] scientific' aims of IDism? And yet here's WJM with more Renewal talk as if he doesn't understand. Perhaps a Nigerian-Brit can provide some hope - "Even in War": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SDTXpC7ytQ Calls for peace and reconciliation will probably slip by many UDers as you continue to angrily attack pretty much anyone for disagreeing logically, coherently, rationally and effectively against IDism. That's partly why most scientists, philosophers and theologians who are theists that gave IDT an initial opportunity to be relevant and meaningful have given up on IDism. They/we realise that all you folks want to do is complain and argue, yet with very little of any serious science to offer moving forward. Iac, for the record, I proposed charity on the TSZ thread in question. You Christian-IDist 'warriors' who don't actually do serious scholarship that could eventually change what is problematic in the current situation employ such strange tactics, especially in the USA with its amazingly distorted views of 'evolution.' The Roman Catholic Church is so far above Americanistic ideas about 'evolution' it is not even fair to compare these 'institutions' of thought, mind and life. Bomb Syria to h#ll any *anyone* who disagrees with IDism. Such is the sad attitude of spirit displayed in this thread so far.Gregory
September 15, 2013
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Impressive how you can convert under-informed people ranting against science that they don't understand, on a blog, into a war against Nazis in defense of all that is good and true in the world.NickMatzke_UD
September 15, 2013
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Brent: [snip] 'If a good man strikes or reproves me it is kindness; but let not the oil of the wicked not anoint my head. Let my prayer be ever against their malice. Their princes were overthrown by the side of the rock; then they understood that my words were kind. [snip] ... from Psalm 141Axel
September 15, 2013
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We musn't forget, Jesus was being completely charitable while overturning the money changers tables, or calling the Pharisees a brood of vipers. Let's read the whole Bible please, and not interpret it in light of our tradition, but only in light of what it really is saying. Harder said than done, but we'd better try our darndest if we are going to even think about living as Christ. I decided quite some time ago that being charitable to new atheists was telling them how stupid they are. And so I do.Brent
September 15, 2013
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Ephesians 6:10-18 Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. Put on the full armor of God, so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand. Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace. In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God. And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests. With this in mind, be alert and always keep on praying for all the Lord’s people. Music: Skillet - Awake and Alive http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aJUnltwsqs Kingdom Of God Vs. Kingdom Of Darkness http://www.metacafe.com/watch/4060606 Creed - Bullet http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtCHFLMRX78 Flyleaf - Chasm (Living Water) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-BvOuE7wfw Red - Feed The Machine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zj2uZO7xnus Then again: Lit - My Own Worst Enemy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sc5iTNVEOAg :) Addison Road - Fight Another Day- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_6aJr2yZW8bornagain77
September 15, 2013
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WJ: I hear you, you are right about the total nature of a culture struggle we face. But, today is Battle of Britain day. That reminds us that a force in being strategy can block a ruthless agenda. Long run, so long as we are a viable force that stands and makes our case, exposing and correcting the opposition, we win. When you are up against abundant, credible signs in the world that point to design of cosmos and life, up to and including us, then you have a really uphill struggle,a s you have to ideologically warp ability to see what is there. You cannot warp the vision of all the people all the time, and when you face a force in being you cannot do as you please. Cf here KFkairosfocus
September 15, 2013
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A good example of employing the tactics of the barbarian is Discovery Institute's demand for Ball State University to investigate the "Dangerous Ideas" course whose sole textbook is an anthology edited by a prominent atheist that includes articles arguing (among other things) that "Science Must Destroy Religion." Arguing against academic freedom is barbaric but I believe Discovery Institute is right in doing so:
“If BSU is serious about its new neutrality standard for professors on religious questions, then the standard needs to be applied to atheist professors just as much as theistic ones.”
http://www.evolutionnews.org/2013/09/clarifying_the_076591.htmlBox
September 15, 2013
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It's total war. The raucous, anti-ID, materialist polemicists tend not to be the ones who are in good faith. Like the homosexual activists, who will stop at nothing to achieve their ends, including closing down Catholic adoption agencies throughout the UK, quite different from many of their confreres, often quiet, gentle souls, who just want to carry on with their lives as best they can with the cards they feel they've been dealt, in peace and quiet.Axel
September 15, 2013
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Incidentally, deeply ironical mockery was a part of Jesus' and his Apostles' own armoury, in their defence against a lethal, religious Establishment. 'I have cured many people of illnesses and performed many acts of kindness. For which of these are you reproaching me.' Not verbatim, but close enough. I think with Peter, it was the cure of a crippled man. And his imputation that the true status of the rich man, who didn't care tuppence about the indigent Lazarus, was lower than that of the street dogs, who, in their hapless, stumbling compassion licked Lazarus' sores, was pretty 'strong meat', indeed, could scarcely have been more withering.Axel
September 15, 2013
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One more thought: The battle will NEVER be won by arguing on internet discussion forums (he said while arguing on an internet discussion forum). Do your best to CHARITABLY educate your family, your friends, your co-workers, and those you come into contact with in the "real world" and use the internet to sharpen your skills and educate yourself. You can be 100% right and lose an argument because you were rude. I know this because I've done it. If you lose the person you were having a discussion with because you could not (or would not) control your temper, the substance of your argument doesn't matter. 'nuff said and God bless-johnp
September 15, 2013
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