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Pass me a Corona!

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What is going on? I don’t understand the hysteria that is going on. What am I missing?

Let’s get some numbers out there. According to the CDC, from September of last year until the end of February this year, 180 days, 18,000 Americans died of the seasonal flu. Starting with March, we have been on high alert, we have been exercising greater hygiene, and, for the last week, we have been quarantining ourselves and spacing ourselves out (a new meaning to the words “being spaced out”). Yet, the CDC just released new numbers, and, over the last roughly 20 days, 4,000 Americans died of the seasonal flu, while only 140 Americans died of the corona virus. That’s a 30 to 1 ratio, roughly. Now, if “spacing out” helps, then why did the average death rate from the seasonal flu rise from 100/day to 200/day? Anyone have an answer?

Also, if the corona virus is so virulent and contagious, then why were there only 6,300 new cases of corona virus, while, using the yardstick of 0.1% mortality rate, 4 million new cases of the seasonal flu developed?

How about some more numbers?

The P&I (pneumonia and influenza-like-illness) mortality of the average flu is 0.1%. In 2009, the H1N1 “swine flu” was declared a “pandemic,” and a national medical emergency was called here in the U.S. What was the final P&I for the “swine flu”? 0.02% That is, 5 times LESS deadly than the seasonal flu. How many died of the “swine flu” in 2009? 12,469+_. How many died of the seasonal flu in the 2017-2018 flu season? 68,000!! Was there a national emergency? No. Did we “space out”? No. Were our hospitals overrun? No. Did we run out of toilet paper? No.

When is a disease an epidemic? When the CFR (case fatality ratio) is above 7.3% (1 in 14). What is the CFR, worldwide, for the corona virus? Well, roughly, there are 219,000 cases around the presently around the globe, with about 9,000 deaths in total so far. The CFR? 1 in 24. 4.1% So, why is it a pandemic?

Here in the United States, over the last three weeks, 4,000 people have died of the flu virus, while over the last two months, world-wide, only 9,000 have died. What’s going on? What is the CDC thinking? What are our government leaders thinking? How long will the current Draconian measures going to continue?

The CDC botched the “swine flu” contagion back in 2009. But nothing is ever learned. I remember following the numbers back then and thinking there was an overreaction to its virulence; and, there was an overreaction. Final statistics for the “swine flu”: 0.02% P&I!

Some numbers to end with. Yes, Italy’s and Iran’s numbers are at about the 10% P&I level. But, guess what, they have older populations and, as we know so well, the elderly are the most vulnerable. In fact, today I looked at a couple of abstracts on the flu and on epidemics. One abstract concluded that whether a virus is at the epidemic level or whether it is below that level, those over 65, and who have underlying health issues, die at the same percentage levels. That is, even if Italy and Iran are at 10% P&I–above the epidemic percentage (while the rest of the world is below the 7.3% epidemic criteria), this only tells us that we’re dealing with older populations; not that we are dealing with an epidemic or pandemic.

And, so, the final numbers.

During the 2017-2018 flu season, for 16 consecutive weeks, from the week ending on December 23, 2017 until April 7, 2018, the P&I of the seasonal flu was ABOVE epidemic levels! Now, listen to this. Nationally, for 4 consecutive weeks, the P&I of the seasonal flu exceeded 10.0%?, peaking during the week ending January 20, 2018 at a P&I of 10.8%.

Three weeks: 4,000 dead from the flu; 140 dead from the corona virus. And we’re talking trillion dollar stimuli.

Who’s running the country? So much for scientists being scientific.

Here’s the bottom line: If the corona virus was going to be so deadly, we would know by now. Instead, with more and more testing and reportin, the number of cases will skyrocket, while the number of deaths will increase linearly–in line with the number of test being conducted, and then fall.

My prediction: I suspect, from inspecting these numbers, that the CDC will once again end up with egg on its face, with a P&I at, or below, the seasonal flu, a la, the “Swine flu” fiasco. And what suffering in the meantime–psychological and and otherwise.

Please, someone, tell me where I’m going wrong. Or else, pass me a Corona, because I’m old enough to have to stay off the streets.

Comments
I sincerely apologize to the entire world for understating the threat of COVID by a multiple of more than three.Barry Arrington
November 18, 2020
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This thread began on March 18th. Total number dead on that date: 150. Twelve days later--almost two weeks, the number is 2613. So, 2,470 people died in an almost two week period. And how many have died of seasonal flu since Feb 28th? 4,000--as of March 19th. We're being had.PaV
March 30, 2020
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Today the paywall for a Spectator USA article has been lifted. The article is by a retired pathologist who worked as a pathologist for the NHS in the UK, Dr. John Lee. I mentioned his article yesterday. Every point he makes parallels arguments I've made here, though not so much the time period of death--though this, too, parallels a concern over "excess deaths." Here are some relevant comments:
The distinction between dying ‘with’ COVID-19 and dying ‘due to’ COVID-19 is not just splitting hairs. Consider some examples: an 87-year-old woman with dementia in a nursing home; a 79-year-old man with metastatic bladder cancer; a 29-year-old man with leukemia treated with chemotherapy; a 46-year-old woman with motor neurone disease for two years. All develop chest infections and die. All test positive for COVID-19. Yet all were vulnerable to death by chest infection from any infective cause (including the flu). COVID-19 might have been the final straw, but it has not caused their deaths.
Here's a comment that might well be directed at the deaths we see coming out of Italy and Spain. Are these deaths due to a variety of causes but simply attributed, blindly, to the SARS-CoV-2 virus?
Next, what about the deaths? Many UK health spokespersons have been careful to repeatedly say that the numbers quoted in the UK indicate death with the virus, not death due to the virus — this matters. When giving evidence in parliament a few days ago, Prof. Neil Ferguson of Imperial College London said that he now expects fewer than 20,000 COVID-19 deaths in the UK but, importantly, two-thirds of these people would have died anyway. In other words, he suggests that the crude figure for ‘COVID deaths’ is three times higher than the number who have actually been killed by COVID-19. (Even the two-thirds figure is an estimate — it would not surprise me if the real proportion is higher.)
If we take Ferguson literally, does this mean that the actual number of deaths worldwide due to SARS-CoV-2 is not 35,000, but around 12,000? Will we ever know? The people responsible for finding this out are the same people who might have been gigantically wrong about their numbers. What would be their motivation to prove how incompetent they were?
It should be noted that there is no international standard method for attributing or recording causes of death. Also, normally, most respiratory deaths never have a specific infective cause recorded, whereas at the moment we can expect all positive COVID-19 results associated with a death to be recorded. Again, this is not splitting hairs. Imagine a population where more and more of us have already had COVID-19, and where every ill and dying patient is tested for the virus. The deaths apparently due to COVID-19, the COVID trajectory, will approach the overall death rate. It would appear that all deaths were caused by COVID-19 — would this be true? No. The severity of the epidemic would be indicated by how many extra deaths (above normal) there were overall.
Let me point out that this very problem is what has been going on now for over thirty years in the case of HIV. This is exactly how HIV/AIDS is defined. And Dr. John Lee says this is wrong. He's a pathologist. So, Dr. Fauci, in charge of HIV/AIDS for over thirty years has been employing a definition for HIV/AIDS that is wrong, not true. Is it any wonder, then, that we are in this quandry? Today, Fauci is quoted as saying that the number of deaths he expects from CoVid-19 is between 100,000 and 200,000. No way that is going to happen. Are the blind leading the blind? Here's a fresh perspective on numbers:
Let me finish with a couple of examples. Colleagues in Germany feel sure that their numbers are nearer the truth than most, because they had plenty of testing capacity ready when the pandemic struck. Currently the death rate is 0.8 percent in Germany. If we assume that about one-third of the recorded deaths are due to COVID-19 and that they have managed to test a third of all cases in the country who actually have the disease (a generous assumption), then the death rate for COVID-19 would be 0.08 percent. That might go up slightly, as a result of death lag. If we assume at present that this effect might be 25 percent (which seems generous), that would give an overall, and probably upper limit, of death rate of 0.1 percent, which is similar to seasonal flu.</blockquote. Let's note that 0.08% is less than the mortality of seasonal flu. That's how this entire thread started. Is the Deep State at work again?
PaV
March 30, 2020
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This caught my eye: Feb 23, 2020 Commentator Ed George: #2
What I don’t understand is that the death rate associated with the flu is much greater than the caronavirus, yet we don’t close the borders because of it.
https://uncommondescent.com/design-inference/the-spreading-of-corona-virus/Truthfreedom
March 30, 2020
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EG Trump met with CEOs in the Cabinet room that was probably what you got the tail end of. Then about an hour later he held an hour and a half news conference with the press and Fauci was there and took questions, made comments, etc. Fauci comments about models was interesting it’s basically “who knows”? At least that’s my take. Scary that we have tanked the economy on “who knows” models. I am well aware of models, Wall Street is full of them that have failed disastrously because as someone pointed out in a book I read a few years ago, “ The map is not the territory “ Vividvividbleau
March 29, 2020
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daves- Perhaps if he wasn't CONSTANTLY attacked by the loser left he wouldn't do that. It's a cause-and-effect situation.ET
March 29, 2020
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VB
Fauci is speaking now . What are you talking about?
Sorry. As I mentioned, I only watched the tail end of the briefing and then it cut off. There was no Q&A on the feed I was watching.Ed George
March 29, 2020
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Dude was talking about how great his TV ratings are.Jim Thibodeau
March 29, 2020
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Dave “I think it’s more that his behavior is sometimes completely inappropriate to the situation. We’re in an emergency and he seemingly can’t stop praising himself. It grates on people.” That I can understand and frankly it grates on me. Trump is IMO is a narcissist but after all he ran for President and is not the only narcissist to do so. Vividvividbleau
March 29, 2020
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ET, I think it's more that his behavior is sometimes completely inappropriate to the situation. We're in an emergency and he seemingly can't stop praising himself. It grates on people.daveS
March 29, 2020
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ET Yeh when he halted travel to China he was a racist and xenophobe , ditto for closing travel with Europe, now he did not close them soon enough. Everyone seems to forget what the top officials in NY, De Blasio ( two weeks ago)and the head of the health commission encouraging people to not distance themselves, let me repeat the health commissioner of N.Y. said people should not worry but heh it’s Trumps fault. Mardi Gras is Trumps fault. Optimism is wrong pessimism is wrong, everything is Trumps fault, whatever he does is wrong so yes we can make this stuff up!, But not Fauci so we have to and we will move on to the next thing to hate him for. I’m thinking his proposal to allow corporations to write off lunch and dinner expenses for their employees to support restaurants , how dare he allow those dirty rotten corporations to write off these expenses to help the restuarants. Or his announcement that the US is not going to pay for Harry and Meghans security they have to pay for it themselves, RACIST Vividvividbleau
March 29, 2020
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Massachusetts has a back-to-school date of May 4, 2020ET
March 29, 2020
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The President remains HOPEFUL and OPTIMISTIC. And for that the lefties are giving him crap. You can't make this stuff up...ET
March 29, 2020
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A vaccine is: - 'natural' selection? - or 'artificial' selection?Truthfreedom
March 29, 2020
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The curve for Italy has been more or less flat for the last 8 days. This is a great sign. Spain is inching towards this same kind of leveling off. The pattern I see in both Italy and Spain is: 1.) linear rise for two weeks in both cases and deaths, then, 2.) leveling off for a week. This all starts once there's an appreciable, but low, number of deaths recorded. For the United States, it looks like our pattern started around March 17th, St. Patrick's Day! That means Monday or Tuesday should be the high mark, with the leveling off beginning next week. It, of course, remains to be seen what happens after this "leveling off" in Spain and Italy ends. For Italy, it seems like the cases have started to fall. I've heard this same thing anecdotally from the press. As a ballpark figure, using this preliminary pattern, this should mean the US will suffer about 7,950 deaths. I'd say that a week from next Wednesday, the President could make the decision to start ramping things up, or, as a palliative, allowing Easter Sunday services to be conducted.PaV
March 29, 2020
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I provide links so that you can read/scan the papers. You'll find the 5,700 number in the Hitchen's article.PaV
March 29, 2020
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@569 Vividbleau
Fauci is speaking now . What are you talking about?
Darwinian 'reasoning'. They are awfully bad at logic. Maybe in their alternate 'reality' Dr. Fauci does not exist.Truthfreedom
March 29, 2020
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ET So to all the Trump haters Fauci is at the press conference, he spoke at the conference, he said that (gasps) that Trump made the decision to follow his advice and other medical pros advice to go out another 30 days. So to all you Trump haters time to move on to something else you hate about him and quit all the incessant hand wringing about Fauci, and that Trump does not listen to his medical team. Vividvividbleau
March 29, 2020
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And then there's that...ET
March 29, 2020
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ET Fauci is at the news conference!! he just spoke Vividvividbleau
March 29, 2020
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Dr. Fauci has better things to do then be @ press conferencesET
March 29, 2020
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Jim, no one said they were going to try to open anything in April. Stop lying.
33,597 deaths as of right now. And that’s going to go way up.
Yes, because as a whole, humans are stupid.ET
March 29, 2020
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Fauci is speaking now . What are you talking about? Vividvividbleau
March 29, 2020
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@EdGeorge that’s a bad sign. A good sign though is that they’re starting to take this more seriously, and now they say they’re not going to try to re-open everything by April 15, the new date is April 30.Jim Thibodeau
March 29, 2020
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Just caught the tail end of Trump’s briefing. Did I miss him earlier or was Dr. Fauci not there?Ed George
March 29, 2020
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33,597 deaths as of right now. And that’s going to go way up.Jim Thibodeau
March 29, 2020
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Every single McDonald’s in my state is technically open, but the seating area is not. You’re allowed to walk in order get your food and leave. Same with Panera, same with Burger King, same with Red Ginger, same with Moe’s, same with Firehouse. And the federal government has no ability whatsoever to change that.Jim Thibodeau
March 29, 2020
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That goddess science of yours is not very straightforward. More like a bit convoluted lady. Maybe the Guru will help you to interpret her commandments more clearly. Pray Darw.Truthfreedom
March 29, 2020
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As to Ferguson, he has now backtracked again, saying that deaths in UK should not be higher than 5,700, or so
You'll have to show me the citation, but sounds unlikely. We'll see what comes of the Gupta study when seroprevelance can be assessed, but those extrapolations are very hard to reconcile with the course of the disease. There is no HIV vaccine because our immune system doesn't mount much of a response to HIV (keeps in check by never ellimnates it), so "artificial" immunity from a vaccine can't do much. HIV-denialism has killed (at least) thousands of people across the world and has been so thoroughly debunked I'm not even going to spend a mother second talking about it.
Again, for perspective: since Feb 28th, there have benn 2,362 deaths due to SARS-CoV-2 virus; in that same time period, there have been 4,000+ deaths due to the seasonal flu.
The epidemic has hardly started. There were 500 deaths yesterday and there will probably be more than that today. The measures already enacted haven't hard time to effect the death rate (due to the lag between infection and death) so thousands more deaths are already guaranteed. It's worth looking back when you started this thread. Did you really think the epidemic would have go so much worse since then? If not, what does that tell you about your instincts for the severity of this disease?orthomyxo
March 29, 2020
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McDonalds is already open. A front-line doctor on CNN yesterday said that the way to get the virus is by not washing your hands and touching your face- ie mouth, nose, ears and eyes. He said that to get it by inhaling it you would need to be in a room with infected people breathing that air for at least 15 minutes. So the front-line people are in that group. Everyone else is in the first.ET
March 29, 2020
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