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UD Live Event from Nov 3, US Election cont’d: BBC — yes the BEEB — on BLM’s Marxist founders, “[We] fought to change history and we won”

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Okay, we are looking at the victory lap being taken (a bit prematurely, methinks) by the BLM trio of marxist founders. Here is BEEB:

Black Lives Matter founders: We fought to change history and we won

Published14 hours ago

The year 2020 will be remembered for a lot of things – not least the rise of the Black Lives Matter movement around the world.

The organisation has led huge street rallies and high-profile campaigns against racism and police brutality.

Now the three women who founded the movement have told the BBC they believe it has transformed politics.

“Black people alongside our allies stood up to change the course of history and we won,” said Alicia Garza.

Garza and her BLM co-founders, Patrisse Cullors and Opal Tometi, spoke as part of the BBC 100 Women Masterclass 2020, a digital live event of masterclasses, big interviews and guests on 30 November.

If you doubted that this is a Marxism-driven, colour-culture revolution push using Critical Race Theory as key ideological wedge, there you have it from the horses’ mouths.

In short, 4th Gen War:

. . . based on colour/cultural revolution insurgency, including dirty form McFaul programme election manipulation:

Okie, Dec 17, I clip from 1333 below, a focal point:

Just remember, given the realities of 4th gen war, there is now no hard border — no specific, momentous declaratory threshold — between

a: information and influence operations [including, too often “education”];

b: politics, law and power balances stratagems, and

c: full bore high kinetics war.

The intent of all three in ruthless hands, subjugation under a new lawless oligarchy, demands that we understand that tri-polar spectrum, and that we determine to stand for a civilisation of truth, right, honour and liberty in the face of its most insidious, treacherous enemies.

H’mm, Dec 15, let’s add in the Overton Window (with hints of Plato’s Parable of the Cave), to help us understand political/policy thinking in light of BATNA points:

Where, we need to ponder the change challenge:

. . . and the Mountains/pillars of influence mapping model:

Where are we drifting to, why and how?

Now, let us continue the already in progress [for four weeks!] live event . . . from here.

First U/D, the Arizona hearing when I can get it up.

Meanwhile, ponder just what is being said now, and what it implies beyond how they would wish it spun, given their admitted Marxism. BREAKING, CONTINUING (AFTER FOUR WEEKS) . . .

U/D1: Arizona hearings:

https://youtu.be/QfC2T7UpxkI

U/D2: Ms Powell with Mr Dobbs on state of play, a case in VA on the table. Also, even as a restraining order was being debated in a see-saw back-forth, in Fulton County, a Server was taken by a technician on excuse of software update and has disappeared from chain of custody. From CA, a tape has been forwarded to Ms Powell and reveals 550 votes from 270 people, an indication of algorithmic manipulation:

Ms Powell, the entire FBI and Dept of Justice need to be hosed out with Chlorox and firehoses.

F/N: Was the Electoral College simply a way to entrench slavery — merely ramshackle defence of slavery? A discussion on republic vs direct instant effect democracy:

[PREDICTABLY, SADLY, CENSORED]

U/D2, Dec 2, hearings in MI:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZXkAv7yKgw

U/D3, Dec 2: HT BA77, we now have chain of custody on ballots going into PA by the trailer-load. The ballots seen coming in at wee hours were in similar containers:

U/D4, Dec 2: Spykman’s framework of heartland, rimland and the outer crescent of maritime Islands and continents:

This is the framework for geostrategic analysis. Desperately compressed, c 1904 Mackinder identified that rail, telegraph, telephone etc allowed mobilisation of continental resources in the heart of the Eurasian landmass that would counterweight the maritime powers, i.e. Britain with the US coming up behind. C20 can be viewed as the history of two German grabs and one Russian one, failed. Rimlands are a belt between, coast and near hinterlands. The outer arc is where maritime power and sea trade dominate. Thus, the chief maritime power guarantees global stability.

I have argued as follows c April 2016, the current US 4th gen civil war with global entanglement is a playing out of this picture. Notice the Iranian push, vulture no. 3. No Ko is a wannabe:

U/D5, Dec 2, Ordinary people have their say (and often get smeared by the media dominant narrative — a comment):

Hannity shows ordinary witnesses.Twitter so no YT link.

U/D6, Dec 4: Here is the Oct 2016 video of independent body blackbox voting dot org:

Note, from commented screen captures:

U/D7, Mr Giuliani requests disciplinary action for defamation violation of parliamentary privilege, regarding dismissal of evidence and attacking his professional integrity:

In the course of this he corrects widespread talking points: 3 cases brought not the 39 being talked about. 2,000 affidavits under penalty of law, and we know now of the video of four suitcases of ballots counted after scrutineers were dismissed, being told that counting was over for the night, in GA.

The member signalling intent to dox and harass a witness by demanding even her maiden name should take due note.

U/D8, Dec 5: Smoking gun? (Video here.) The midnight, unsupervised ballot counting in GA — though strictly, the count from its outset with scrutineers corralled, was invalid:

U/D9, Dec 7, concerns that Dominion machines have flipped votes and on a test run a sequestered machine has continued to do so:

Cf. Expert testimony:

https://youtu.be/ijtaV5Twf6o

Cybersecurity expert, Russell Ramsland is speaking under the umbrella of his affidavit.

U/D, Dec 10, Lou Dobbs on the “Russian intelligence”/ “conspiracy theory” dismissive talking points on Mr Hunter Biden (with implications that his chief asset on offer was access) and Ms Powell’s unleashing of the Kracken:

https://youtu.be/IQjjjrR9QUY

[PREDICTABLY, CENSORED]

U/D11, Dec 11: Here is a framework for addressing media spin and gaslighting, agit-prop etc:

As it is such a glaring example on what was said in the “fine people” remarks, and as Sandy brought it up, let me add this correction from the record . . . yes, transcript, on Charlottesville:

U/D13, Dec 12, here is a backgrounder on Alcibiades which also gives a useful survey of the Peloponnesian war. One hopes, this will not be censored:

U/D14, Dec 12 HT BA77, Dominion demonstrations, part 1:

. . . and part 2:

5:04 on in this part 2 shows scanning in then voting a BLANK ballot, which the operator says “totally bothers me.”

She demonstrates also how adjudicated ballots can be voted.

We separately know that the scanner can mark ballots, sold as a feature for the visually impaired.

In short there is now no responsible doubt that the sort of manipulation discussed is a real capability — means. Frustration of scrutineering creates opportunity and decisively undermines integrity of the election vote counts. Motive is easy, power in the midst of a 4th Gen Civil war, in the form of a colour-culture revolution push, theme colour black. The testimony of many witnesses, statistical red flags etc point to actual occurrence, but recall, this is secondary. The primary issue is massive injection of effectively uncontrolled mail in ballots with 3rd party ballot harvesting and similar frustration of scrutineering implying dubious chain of custody.

All of this then points to the 26 years of history going back to the PA case of 1994 and through the exposure of election gadgetry since the early 2000’s, then rejections by CA and TX as well as links to Venezuela and more.

I strongly suggest, download the videos for yourself before they vanish into the censorship black hole.

U/D15: Hima’s testimony, something needs to be fixed here:

U/D16, Dec 13: I think it is profitable to look at a backgrounder on Mountains/pillars of influence, dominant worldviews and agendas, the change challenge and the crooked yardstick effect. First, the seven mountains, a mapping model for dealing with a corrupt culture as a remnant of soundness under God (originally, Schaeffer et al, 1970’s):

Linked, the Machiavelli change-timing challenge:

Underlying problem: crooked yardsticks vs plumb-lines:

Deeper background, a sounder view on political spectrum:

Further deeper understanding of an en-darkened civilisation, adapting Schaeffer’s vision:

Our civilisation is at obvious kairos, a hinge of history, with major dangers and opportunities. It is time to be good people of the remnant in the face of an Ac 27 storm.

U/D17, Dec 14, Ms Powell on the state of the American Courts and Republic on a date that most likely will live in infamy:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKfK8jkSwPA

(Has this ALREADY been censored?)

Lou Dobbs with Ms Powell:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGEmSMLgVeY

U/D18, Dec 16: A summary of the lesson of 1876/77, on the price paid for a devil’s bargain that swallowed electoral fraud:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HbSgCpPors

Yes, the Democrats refused to acknowledge fraud and a devil’s bargain was struck over 20 electors that stopped Reconstruction in a way that opened up the abuses that lingered to the 1960’s.

U/D19, Dec 19: a summary of red flags from the Navarro Report, so we can see in the context of being an evidence summary:

U/D20: The “Solar Winds” Cyber attack, apparently in progress for 6 months, with direct entanglement with the tainted election (cf. 17:00 on):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=869&v=3T9VDichLPM&feature=youtu.be

[predictably, poof!]

China is named, along with Iran and North Korea. As well as, of course, Russia having been widely deemed suspect no. 1. This is an obvious example of an information-influence operation as act of 4G war, connecting the local civil conflict in the US to the global conflict, de facto WW4. Forbes comments:

The recently discovered cyber attacks against numerous U.S. government departments and  thousands of public and private sector entities around the world, via a compromise of SolarWinds software, underscore the risks associated with third party vendors and raise questions about liability. The attacks were allegedly perpetrated by Russia and were highly sophisticated . . . .

The attackers compromised the software “signature” of SolarWinds’s Orion network monitoring software and distributed malware as a software update. Public and private encryption keys are used to “sign” software. A software update is “signed” using an encryption algorithm and the developer’s private key, which creates a hash “signature.”  This “signature” is validated by the receiver of the software update by using the sender’s public key. The signature process assures the integrity of the update and instills trust in users of the software. 

In a December 14 SEC filing, SolarWinds said that of its more than 300,000 customers, they believed that less than 18,000 entities may have downloaded the Orion update during the March-June 2020 timeframe [–> the 6 months timeline], which likely included the malware. The malware operated stealthily and exfiltrated valuable intellectual property, confidential and proprietary data, emails, and other valuable information from victims’ systems. It was unknown until prominent cybersecurity firm FireEye, also a victim of the attacks, discovered the malware and reported on the attacks on December 13, 2020.

According to FireEye, once installed in a system, the malware remained quiet for a couple of weeks and then masqueraded as the Orion Improvement Program protocol. It stored data from its internal activities within actual SolarWinds files on the system, thereby making its detection all the more difficult.  The malware had highly credentialed access to the system and could disable system services, reboot machines, exfiltrate data, execute files, change system configurations, and perform actions usually taken by a highly privileged system administrator.

That sounds rather familiar, and illustrates what happens if a trusted supplier is compromised. Gen Flynn’s remarks at 16:05 on are worth transcribing:

When we talk about our election security . . . I think this is all part of it, because there is a relationship between this solar winds attack; which has basically penetrated our entire critical infrastructure as well as our election security. So we have to look at everything we’re doing . . . okay with all of the egregious behaviour that we’ve seen on our election security we cannot stand for foreign influence, which we have direct evidence of foreign influence. We also have direct evidence now from other countries, from other foreign partners who have evidence.

In fact they were watching the attacks on our election system, on our election process on the 3rd of November and they are willing to provide that directly to the President.

So we now have that evidence and have received that today. It’s very important.

So there are foreign partners and allies that are willing to help us with our election security and this Solar Winds system is really really dangerous and more has to be done.

The likely allies obviously include Israel, likely Japan, South Korea, Taiwan and possibly Australia given the focus on China.

Again, we are back to whose report do you believe, why.

U/D21, Dec 23: It was not possible to find the 1984 Movie through a Google search (yes, they are that unconscious of the irony) but DDG showed it, here is a colour version at YT, this may be pretty important holiday viewing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl4kt4kUE88

If that gets purged, here is Web Archive.

U/D22, Dec 28: Understand the anger of the perpetually manipulated:

One does not have to endorse the above across the board to see that it has a telling point or two about the “Uniparty” and the issue of fundamentally unaccountable elites, leading a manipulated march of folly. Here, the lesson of Ac 27 is again all too relevant.

U/D23: A Canadian Lawyer and an American Lawyer discuss — as an example — the dismissal of the Wisconsin care; an example of how the election fraud concerns are being sidelined:

U/D24, Jan 3, what the Ukrainians have to say about corruption and investigation, through an Interfax press conference. Such needs to be soberly addressed in detail:

Comments
Except from this blog, and "Town hall. com" who actually believes the 81 million majority lost to the 73 million sheep?marquez8
December 26, 2020
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JVL, someone in a wheelchair is canvassed and coerced by someone else to vote as told, with remarks as to how many are already in the bag. This being phone cam footage, it looks like. Such is an example, live, of the 3rd party ballot-harvesting problem as was also noted by Carter and Baker, etc. The second tweet links illustration on what looks like the result of a stage of such harvesting in a neighbourhood, likely at ballot application stage. The issue is not on trial, our ability and/or willingness to acknowledge evidence and issue alike, are. KFkairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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THERE IS AMPLE EVIDENCE OF FRAUD AND YOU ONLY NEED TO LOOK IN THREE STATES–GEORGIA, PENNSYLVANIA AND ARIZONA (in order to swing the election to Trump). Presently, Biden lays claim to 306 electors, while Trump lags with 232. Georgia, Pennsylvania and Arizona account for 47 electoral votes. If those votes are properly assigned to Donald Trump and taken away from Joe Biden, Trump wins 279 to Biden’s 259. The total of 103,896 votes separate Trump and Biden in these three states. There is indisputable, tangible evidence of a massive fraud that, once exposed, ensures Donald Trump’s re-election. The plot was simple. Millions of illegal ballots were pre-printed and shipped directly to counting centers in Pennsylvania, Georgia and Arizona (also happened in Wisconsin, Michigan and Nevada). These ballots were presented as “mail in ballots” but were never actually mailed and never handled by living voter. These fraudulent ballots were fed into the Dominion voting machines and recorded votes for Joe Biden. Most of the pre-printed ballots excluded down ballot candidates, which is why the Republicans won more than 12 additional seats in the U.S. Congress. Proving the fraud is even simpler. We only need to compare the physical ballots with the images that are recorded on the Dominion machines. We do not need to worry, at this point, about computer forensics. (That could be relevant later when we go after those foreign entities responsible for the interference). We only need to focus on the ballot images. For example, if a mailed in ballot had actually been mailed, it would have been folded and unfolded several times. Those fold marks show up on the digital image that the Dominion machine made in recording the ballot. If you have a mailed in ballot that has no fold marks then you have clear, empirical evidence of fraud. A mail in ballot will have fold marks. But there also are other markings embedded in the ballots that will reveal whether or not a person or a machine filled out the ballot. If you want to understand this type of analysis, please watch this video featuring Jovan Hutton Pulitzer. (Kudos to Joe Hoft who spotted the importance of Mr. Pulitzer early on.) Mr. Pulitzer is a true genius. He knows how to make the complex quite simple: Technology Expert Can Determine If Ballots are Legitimate or Fake in Seconds https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgeqGmvQXKs&feature=emb_logo The evidence of fraud in Georgia, Pennsylvania, Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and Michigan is substantial and consequential. GEORGIA: Biden supposedly won by 11,779 votes over Trump, but the documentary and video evidence show that thousands of votes were illegally counted in Fulton County, Georgia. Fulton County Georgia elections officials told the media and GOP observers that they were shutting down the tabulation center at State Farm Arena at 10:30 p.m. on election night because of an alleged water main rupture. But there was no break in the water line. The Democrat workers continued counting ballots in secret until 1:00 a.m. Ruby Freeman and her daughter–elections supervisor Wandrea “Shaye” Moss–are clearly visible on video pulling out suitcases full of ballots and began counting those ballots without election monitors in the room. (Ruby Freeman video) https://rumble.com/embed/v8ynrx/?pub=5azz7#?secret=Opf6qg66WZ A closer look at voter fraud in Georgia - video https://rumble.com/embed/v9jhdj/?pub=5azz7#?secret=jy6Xbg8LL6 16 Electoral votes. Biden–2,473,633 Trump–2,461,854 Ruby and her daughter pulled out more than 11,779 ballots and can be seen entering those ballots multiple times into the Dominion machine. PENNSYLVANIA: The evidence does not stop there. Pennsylvania’s votes, specifically those from the Philadelphia area, were corrupt. The ballots counted in Philadelphia were printed in New York and transported to Pennsylvania. We are talking more than 350,000 ballots. The evidence about the movement of these ballots is fully backed up by eye witness testimony under oath and documents. Here is one witness, truck driver Jesse Morgan: Jesse Morgan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAB2NVJtVVg 20 Electoral votes. Biden–3,459,923 Trump–3,378,263 350,000 ballots is more than enough to swing the election in Pennsylvania from Biden to Trump. WISCONSIN: Wisconsin’s fraud starts with the introduction of 170,000 mail-in ballots entering the tabulation process under the guise of absentee ballots in clear violation of state law. That’s more than eight times the number of ballots of the alleged Biden victory margin of 20,608 votes. This large-scale abuse was facilitated by expansive definition of “indefinitely confined voters,” which the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled was illegal. But there also is clear evidence that fraudulent “mailed” ballots were put through the Dominion machines. For example, more than 2000 absentee votes in Wisconsin all had the same initials “MLW”. Then there were thousands of pristine “mailed” ballots with no sign of ever being folded. 10 Electoral votes Biden–1,630,673 Trump–1,610,065 The fraud in Wisconsin is centered in Dane and Milwaukee counties. But so far the FBI has declined to investigate. The difference of 20,608 swings the state to Trump. ARIZONA: The evidence of voter fraud from the ballots allegedly mailed is clear and stunning, as the following video explains. A closer look at voter fraud in Arizona - video https://rumble.com/embed/v980qt/?pub=5azz7#?secret=tIbnnA0Cjh 11 Electoral votes Biden–1,672,143 Trump–1,661,686 In light of the emerging evidence, it appears the Republican legislature is going to certify the Republican slate of electors. With only 10,457 separating Biden and Trump and with the evidence that more than 100,000 mail in votes do not show evidence of actually being mailed, this should give President Trump another key win. - per Gateway Pundit - December 26, 2020bornagain77
December 26, 2020
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kf @ 1629 -
BA77 is right that there is decisive evidence.
I'm sorry, but I disagree. For there to be enough fraud to have changed the outcome of the election, there should be evidence of a widespread plot. So far there have been bits and pieces.: (1) statistical analysis that shows that the votes didn't behave as some would have expected. But some of this was predicted beforehand (e.g. move towards Biden from mail-in votes in states where mail-in votes were counted later). At best, this evidence would suggest that there might be something worth invesitigating, but can't prove fraud (it shows that the votes and counts don't behave as the models expect, but doesn't show why). (2) claims about what happened when votes were counted. But there is a lot of interpretation going on. Now, this might be fraud, or it might not be. If it is fraud on a scale large enough to be over several states, where is the evidence of collusion between actors in the different states? The only time any evidence of this sort was assessed in court, the judge concluded that the witnesses were mis-interpreting what they saw. How can we be sure this isn't the case in the other suggested cases of fraud? (3) The stuff about Dominion/Smartmatic/whoever gets pretty loopy at times. If it is to make any sense, it needs to be show that some votes were definitely moved from one candidate to another by the machines. The 68% error rate claim is not persuasive, because it was only in one precinct where human error was already acknowledged as the problem. It makes no sense - an error that large would be easy to spot, and it hasn't been seen anywhere else. So if there has been large-scale fraud, a better case needs to be made. And also, why it was only carried out for the presidential election, and not to swing a couple of senate seats too. Or (for example) to swing Florida, which was seen a a swing state before the election.Bob O'H
December 26, 2020
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Kairosfocus: F/N: Vid, showing 3rd party ballot harvesting by activists in action. There is no way you can assert that ballot harvesting is going on in that video! All you can see is one person talking to a second person and noting somethings down on a piece of paper. It might be an office of some kind but . . . . I understand you believe there was widespread and planned fraud but that video shows nothing. And if you think it does then that is just motivated reasoning on your part.JVL
December 26, 2020
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kf @ 1626 - thanks. I hope we can reduce the heat. I assume that ba77's comment @ 1627 was written before he read your appeal.Bob O'H
December 26, 2020
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BO'H: BA77 is right that there is decisive evidence. First, of intent to manipulate the system, undermining integrity of the US election system; it is NOT an accident that it would fail a benchmark against how a run of the mill coop bank handles cash and customer accounts. Further to this, the injection of effectively uncontrolled mail-in ballots, linked ballot harvesting and frustration of scrutineers, together with other features of a dirty McFaul colour revolution push point to a serious operational phase engaged over the past year or so. Then, there are direct observations, videotapes, statistical far-fluctuations etc. Those are issues of responsiveness to evidence; for sure, the "no evidence" gambit is a breach of duties of reason. As for resenting interloping furriners, I point out that the geostrategic significance of the US makes all of us into stakeholders -- many of us with potentially a lot to lose. On my part, I have also lived through a 4g civil war, part of the wider cold war. That means there are things I have seen before which are relevant and which are not obvious to one and all. So, there is a place for a discussion of stakeholders here in this little corner of the Internet. KFkairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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Bob, again I completely stand behind my statement,
Again, the Ruby Freemen video is unambiguous in showing that rampant voter fraud was taking place, and for you to try to deny the validity of this overt, in your face, voter fraud that was taking place is simply an insult to our intelligence and moral sensibilities. Yet you, apparently oblivious to this, continue to act like there is ‘nothing to see here’. You are not an idiot and therefore have no valid excuse for this. Save for your intentional trying to deceive and mislead people about the rampant voter fraud that took place. i.e. You must have a ‘malicious intent’ rather than a good intent! And although you are apparently blind to your own repeated moral failings in this matter, I hope you can, at least, see why I, as an American military veteran, would be very displeased with any foreigner lying about the fact that our election was stolen. Military members, and Veterans, tend to get very upset about such things.
FYI, to be intentionally misleading about something, as you are currently trying to be misleading with the overt voter fraud sitting right in front of you, (particularly with the Ruby Freeman video staring you right in the face,) , is to be, in effect, a liar. The two words, i.e. “lying” and “misleading”, are synonyms, but "to mislead" is broader and includes "to lie" in its range. One can however mislead without telling an outright lie, such as by omitting and/or ignoring pertinent details. Since you are being, as is characteristic of your behavior on UD, 'misleading', I stand by my claim that you are, in fact, 'lying' in the broader sense of being 'misleading' towards the facts in hand. And again, if you disagree, and if you want to persist in this matter, the admin will simply have to arbitrate the matter between us. Since I stand 100% behind my assessment of you, I don't see it ending well for you. Your choice.bornagain77
December 26, 2020
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KF @1624, But remember, it's not evidence unless a judge says so, even if it is obvious to any rational person with a pair of functioning eyes and even if some expert at handwriting signs an affidavit that it's the same handwriting. Until a judge says otherwise, it's all just unsubstantiated tinfoil hat conspiracies.William J Murray
December 26, 2020
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BA77 & BO'H: It's Christmas. I know, we are forced to handle a pretty nasty topic because of what has been happening, but could we do so with a minimum of personalities? It's bad enough that things are nasty. KFkairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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ba77 @ 1616 - if you're going to lay out why someone is lying, it helps to start with what they actually wrote.
If you do not like what I said, we can take it to the administrator and see what he thinks. Do you want to go that route?
Try backing up your assertions. If I'm a liar, then you should be able to find where I have lied, quote what you believe to be a lie, show that what I wrote was false, and then show that I knew it was false. I appreciate that it's easier to hide behind kf and try to get me banned (either from this thread or from UD), but it does make you look like a snowflake.Bob O'H
December 26, 2020
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F/N: Likewise, multiple Ballots (or applications) from a neighbourhood, in the same "hand." KFkairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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F/N: Vid, showing 3rd party ballot harvesting by activists in action. KFkairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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M8, could you kindly recognise that the purpose of this thread is in key part archival, to provide a reference with substantial argument and warrant*? Where, in the case just above you have committed a classic turnabout accusation to belittle and dismiss. Perhaps, it has escaped you that the WaPo is a major newspaper based in Washington DC, which just published a defamatory oped that directly suggests by invidious association, that Mr Trump is equivalent to a holocaust denying neo-nazi and anti-black racist, with the clear declaration that the further association is to be made to Hitler and his holocaust. So, you hit back first fails. As does your patent concern trollery. Similarly, holocaust denial is often projected by those who are in denial of the worst, ongoing, holocaust in history: the mass killing of living posterity in the womb. The response on substantial facts is warranted, as is the further examination of roots of the ideology behind the colour-culture revolution push. It is clear that Mr Zinn's toxic agit prop under colours of history textbook -- fair comment -- needs to be exposed and countered. KF PS: U/D12 to OP corrects the key slander by distortion of Mr Trump's remarks on Charlottesville. This is by simply citing the actual transcript. It has been noted that Mr Biden has cited the twisted report as part motive for his campaign. That is then material to evaluating him, his party which has continued to promote the slander and many media houses. *F/N: I think it best to confine commentary on this live event of pivotal geostrategic significance to a few threads of discussion, rather than cluttering up UD with a large number of such threads.kairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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Kairos/Born, can you please reduce the length of your posts and try to not deviate on every occasion into NAZISM and abortion? It would help science and, dare I say rationality. Ever your friend. Gabriel?.marquez8
December 26, 2020
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PPS: Let me clip from Howard Zinn's A People's History, to give a key context behind what is going on:
if the entrance of the United States into World War II was (as so many Americans believed at the time, observing the Nazi invasions) to defend the principle of nonintervention in the affairs of other countries, the nation’s record cast doubt on its ability to uphold that principle. What seemed clear at the time was that the United States was a democracy with certain liberties, while Germany was a dictatorship persecuting its Jewish minority, imprisoning dissidents, whatever their religion, while proclaiming the supremacy of the Nordic “race.” However, blacks, looking at anti-Semitism in Germany, might not see their own situation in the U.S. as much different. And the United States had done little about Hitler’s policies of persecution . . . . [T]he war then ended quickly [after the Atomic Bombings]. Italy had been defeated a year earlier. Germany had recently surrendered, crushed primarily by the armies of the Soviet Union on the Eastern Front, aided by the Allied armies on the West. Now Japan surrendered. The Fascist powers were destroyed. But what about fascism—as idea, as reality? Were its essential elements—militarism, racism, imperialism—now gone? Or were they absorbed into the already poisoned bones of the victors? A. J. Muste, the revolutionary pacifist, had predicted in 1941: “The problem after a war is with the victor. He thinks he has just proved that war and violence pay. Who will now teach him a lesson?” The victors were the Soviet Union and the United States (also England, France and Nationalist China, but they were weak). Both these countries now went to work—without swastikas, goose-stepping, or officially declared racism, but under the cover of “socialism” on one side, and “democracy” on the other, to carve out their own empires of influence. They proceeded to share and contest with one another the domination of the world, to build military machines far greater than the Fascist countries had built, to control the destinies of more countries than Hitler, Mussolini, and Japan had been able to do. They also acted to control their own populations, each country with its own techniques—crude in the Soviet Union, sophisticated in the United States—to make their rule secure . . .
This is an outrage, a cynical manipulation and poisoning of the ill-informed presented as history. That this obviously tendentious agit prop work has been widely celebrated and used as a history textbook is in itself a sobering sign of our times. A key point of correction is to start with the founding of the UN in October 1945, where the UN Charter signed in June that year set out to reframe international law and the international order precisely in acknowledgement of need for major reforms. Yes, I am now going to cite a primary, contemporary source document of unquestionable authenticity. One that is but a web click or two away. I emphasise the Preamble and Articles 1, 2 & 73 for the Charter, "[which was] signed on 26 June 1945, in San Francisco, at the conclusion of the United Nations Conference on International Organization, and came into force [as new foundation of international law, order and relations] on 24 October 1945":
[PREAMBLE:] WE THE PEOPLES OF THE UNITED NATIONS DETERMINED to save succeeding generations from the scourge of war, which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and to reaffirm faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person, in the equal rights of men and women and of nations large and small, and to establish conditions under which justice and respect for the obligations arising from treaties and other sources of international law can be maintained, and to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom, AND FOR THESE ENDS to practice tolerance and live together in peace with one another as good neighbours, and to unite our strength to maintain international peace and security, and to ensure, by the acceptance of principles and the institution of methods, that armed force shall not be used, save in the common interest, and to employ international machinery for the promotion of the economic and social advancement of all peoples, HAVE RESOLVED TO COMBINE OUR EFFORTS TO ACCOMPLISH THESE AIMS Accordingly, our respective Governments, through representatives assembled in the city of San Francisco, who have exhibited their full powers found to be in good and due form, have agreed to the present Charter of the United Nations and do hereby establish an international organization to be known as the United Nations. Article 1 The Purposes of the United Nations are: To maintain international peace and security, and to that end: to take effective collective measures for the prevention and removal of threats to the peace, and for the suppression of acts of aggression or other breaches of the peace, and to bring about by peaceful means, and in conformity with the principles of justice and international law, adjustment or settlement of international disputes or situations which might lead to a breach of the peace; To develop friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples, and to take other appropriate measures to strengthen universal peace; To achieve international co-operation in solving international problems of an economic, social, cultural, or humanitarian character, and in promoting and encouraging respect for human rights and for fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language, or religion; and To be a centre for harmonizing the actions of nations in the attainment of these common ends. Article 2 The Organization and its Members, in pursuit of the Purposes stated in Article 1, shall act in accordance with the following Principles. The Organization is based on the principle of the sovereign equality of all its Members. All Members, in order to ensure to all of them the rights and benefits resulting from membership, shall fulfill in good faith the obligations assumed by them in accordance with the present Charter. All Members shall settle their international disputes by peaceful means in such a manner that international peace and security, and justice, are not endangered. All Members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state, or in any other manner inconsistent with the Purposes of the United Nations. All Members shall give the United Nations every assistance in any action it takes in accordance with the present Charter, and shall refrain from giving assistance to any state against which the United Nations is taking preventive or enforcement action. The Organization shall ensure that states which are not Members of the United Nations act in accordance with these Principles so far as may be necessary for the maintenance of international peace and security. Nothing contained in the present Charter shall authorize the United Nations to intervene in matters which are essentially within the domestic jurisdiction of any state or shall require the Members to submit such matters to settlement under the present Charter; but this principle shall not prejudice the application of enforcement measures under Chapter Vll. [ . . . . ] [Art 73:] Members of the United Nations which have or assume responsibilities for the administration of territories whose peoples have not yet attained a full measure of self-government recognize the principle that the interests of the inhabitants of these territories are paramount, and accept as a sacred trust the obligation to promote to the utmost, within the system of international peace and security established by the present Charter, the well-being of the inhabitants of these territories, and, to this end: a. to ensure, with due respect for the culture of the peoples concerned, their political, economic, social, and educational advancement, their just treatment, and their protection against abuses; b. to develop self-government, to take due account of the political aspirations of the peoples, and to assist them in the progressive development of their free political institutions, according to the particular circumstances of each territory and its peoples and their varying stages of advancement; c. to further international peace and security; d. to promote constructive measures of development, to encourage research, and to co-operate with one another and, when and where appropriate, with specialized international bodies with a view to the practical achievement of the social, economic, and scientific purposes set forth in this Article; and e. to transmit regularly to the Secretary-General for information purposes, subject to such limitation as security and constitutional considerations may require, statistical and other information of a technical nature relating to economic, social, and educational conditions in the territories for which they are respectively responsible other than those territories to which Chapters XII and XIII apply. Article 74 Members of the United Nations also agree that their policy in respect of the territories to which this Chapter applies, no less than in respect of their metropolitan areas, must be based on the general principle of good-neighbourliness, due account being taken of the interests and well-being of the rest of the world, in social, economic, and commercial matters.
No reasonable person can but notice that there is clear acknowledgement of how the world at large not just the Fascists, were tainted by an old order that led to two world wars, and needed to be drastically reformed. In that context, major commitments were made to advance such reforms, with Art 73 being particularly important in dismantling empires and necessarily undermining racist and imperialistic or hegemonic domination also. Of course, the UN has not fully lived up to such lofty goals and aspirations. That is inevitable, given our finite, fallible, morally struggling, too often ill-willed nature. However, we see here in what is effectively a global charter of confederate, constitutional character and which was set up as the refounding of international law, a framework that expresses the aspiration of the Allies known as the United Nations, which then became the framework for international relations ever since. The contrast between Mr Zinn's cynical innuendos and suggestions and the charter is sufficient to show that something has gone very wrong with history education. Where, the linear connexion between Mr Zinn's themes and the sorts of notions now being advanced by those pushing Colour-Culture revolution is patent. What is really needed is sound reassessment and reformation, not radicalism pivoting on toxic ideology such as we see here revealed in a key microcosm. KFkairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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F/N: Right on time to add, here comes the Nazism projection: https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/12/23/democracy-denial-holocaust-denial/
Denying the Holocaust threatens democracy. So does denying the election results. We know how to fight big lies. Now it’s time to start fighting democracy denial. By Deborah E. Lipstadt and Norman Eisen Dec. 23, 2020 at 7:00 a.m. GMT-4 Scoff. That’s what we did years ago when we each first heard about Holocaust denial, as a Holocaust historian and the child of a survivor, respectively. Dismissing it as the historical equivalent of flat-Earth theory, we reassured ourselves that the Holocaust has the painful distinction of being the best-documented genocide in the world. Who could claim it did not happen? But we soon discovered we were wrong to laugh at it, as the falsehood crept into classrooms, books and even international relations. We have learned — the hard way — to take it seriously. That is why in recent weeks we have watched with alarm the birth of another powerful disinformation mythology: the false conviction pushed by President Trump and his enablers that the 2020 U.S. presidential election was stolen. We had wondered whether the definitive vote of the electoral college and the declaration by Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) that Joe Biden was the president-elect might provide a final end to Trump’s electoral fraud fantasies. But he has instead redoubled his dangerous disinformation crusade, reportedly even probing the use of the military to further his bizarre theory that the election was stolen . . . . Like Holocaust denial, there is an unmistakable racial tinge to Trump’s democracy denial. He and his cohort are openly targeting strongly minority jurisdictions with their false claims, in particular cities with large Black populations — Philadelphia, Detroit, Milwaukee, Atlanta. Here’s how Trump’s personal attorney, Rudolph W. Giuliani, put it: “You knew if you lived in Philadelphia. Unless you’re stunod — that’s an Italian expression for stupid — unless you’re stupid, you knew that a lot of people were coming over from Camden to vote,” he said. “And it’s allowed to happen because it’s a Democrat, corrupt city, and has been for years.” As Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel (D) has noted, “Really the themes that we see [from Trump] … are this: Black people are corrupt, Black people are incompetent and Black people can’t be trusted.” . . .
First, contrast the failed moral duty challenge, on public evidence that has built up for decades, so we can be clear that we are in fact seeing a turnabout accusatory projection in the teeth of compelling warrant that something has gone seriously wrong, tracing to knowing wrongful conduct and a campaign to carry forward such:
The Failed Moral Duty Challenge: First, all relevant officials and connected persons have a main duty to ensure integrity of elections, and know or should acknowledge the potential for fraud and what it can mean. [–> almost self-evident] Therefore, neglect on a systemic basis is only partly negligence, it becomes in material part a strong sign of wrongful intent. [–> refusal to do due diligence and known duty are signs of tort] In the case of the US and a relevant party, in Feb 1994, the NYT published a front page, just below fold article [see, 1273 previous thread] on a judge’s reversal of an election outcome and of majority in a legislature in PA, due to fraud connected to a known vulnerable type of ballot and to harvesting, intimidation etc. [–> public fact 1] Ten years later in 2004, The US congress received testimony on fraud in the Ukraine [see, U/D 17, previous thread] that further amplified such techniques. [ –> public fact 2] So, systemic ignorance cannot be responsibly pleaded and indeed is discredited. [–> public duty, the media have a duty of reporting such to the public and of giving a true and fair view of the circumstances] Accordingly there were just on these cases sixteen to twenty six years to purge the said party of such a taint [–> direct implication of the duty and necessarily known fact, with some Arithmetic], but instead this year excuse of a pandemic was taken [–> public fact 3] to multiply opportunity and means for similar fraud. [–> the injection of the destabilising element, here judged on its known likely consequence: [1] effectively uncontrolled mail-in ballots on an industrial scale, [2] 3rd party ballot harvesting, [3] deliberate frustration of effective scrutineering, breaking chains of transparency and control on validity, joined to [4] fraud-conducive election gadgetry as has been demonstrated on videos shown in the OP and recorded based on tests cand competent witness] This is a moral duty demonstration of wrongful intent [–> refusal to do duty, to one’s advantage] and shifts or should shift our common sense evaluation [–> in short, decisive on best explanation] of evidence [affidavits, anomalous patterns, disturbances to counts, frustration of proper scrutineering (ponder barriers erected to block even distant observation as has been circulated by images, not just reports of witnesses), surge in vulnerable ballots, single candidate ballots etc][–> list of evidence] to recognise these as consistent with [–> inferred best explanation] carrying out a morally demonstrated intent. [–> duty failure implies intent in such a case] This obtains whether or not sufficient weight can be amassed to lead courts to vacate suspect ballots [–> anticipates failure of the court system], or whether criminal charges can be brought against leading individuals. [–> given cases as the 30k emails on a server willfully set up outside the government] That common sense issue is also implicated in Federalist 68 [–> historical analysis, to which there has been little or no cogent response], etc so state legislatures may have a duty to act in face of a tainted election. [–> the US Constitutional assignment of responsibility] The implication, no you do not get a second round to try again, but responsible bodies take up from [and remedy] your failure can be taken as a built in deterrent effect. [–> inference, on the nature of the backstops] However moral fibre in our civilisation has long been progressively undermined for generations. [-> I here point to the impacts of the currents of thought over the past 300 or so years, including the rise of amoral, nihilistic philosophies and ideologies, leading to the ongoing holocaust of living posterity in the womb and the utterly corrosive implications of linked mass blood guilt]
Where, let us note, the Pezarro summary of the build up campaign, as has been on the table for the past few days:
During the months leading up to this year’s presidential race, the Biden campaign assembled a team of some 600 lawyers and more than 10,000 volunteers to “[go] into every single state” in order to “call out local rules that don’t adequately ensure access to vote.”[6] Beginning more than a year ago, Democrats filed nearly 300 lawsuits in dozens of states[7] – most notably all of the key battleground states – in an effort to change election laws and regulations in ways that would benefit Democrat candidates. For example, they sought to: (a) extend the statutory deadlines by which mail-in ballots could be submitted, postmarked, or received by election authorities; (b) permit people to vote earlier than ever before, in some cases as many as 50 days prior to Election Day; (c) eliminate signature, signature-verification, and witness requirements for mail-in ballots; (d) void state laws that disallowed ballot harvesting by third parties; (e) terminate photo-ID requirements for in-person voting; (f) introduce provisions that would allow for the “curing” of mail-in ballots that contained errors or omissions; and (g) require state election officials to send unsolicited mail-in ballots to every person listed as a registered voter, even though such lists have long been notoriously inaccurate.[8] Though the Democrats did not get everything that they wanted, they got most of it.
The authors of the WaPo piece (and even moreso, the newspaper's editors) were and are responsible to know and acknowledge this. But instead of acknowledging legitimacy of concern, they have tried to brand those who raise such as neo-nazi racists (with implication that those who deny holocaust are a danger of new holocaust). That gives us the right to apply the mirror principle and cognitive dissonance inference. First, they know that industrial scale election fraud and linked manipulation are an existential threat, one that points to a state of unacknowledged, 4th gen civil war, complete with agit prop and lawfare. Just, they are trying to project blame to the despised other, in further enabling what has been done. They do not hesitate to make invidious comparison to nazis and their heirs, in haste to marginalise and demonise the despised other. Notice, the explicit accusation of racism resorted to instead of facing the fact that dirty, fraud riddled machine politics has been a challenge in key urban areas with roots to Tammany Hall and kin, starting in the year the Constitution came into effect, 1789. Tammany Hall only went out of business in living memory, the 1960's. That simple fact immediately renders moot the incendiary slander that this is about hatred of black people. (Note, it is reported that Mr Trump has had the highest degree of support of Blacks and other minorities won by a Republican for six decades.) As for holocaust, what do you think the mass slaughter of 63+ million of living posterity in the womb and rising at 400K per year in the US [disproportionately black BTW] is? The global toll of 800+ millions, rising at 40 million per year? This too cries out for a cognitive dissonance inference given the role of abortion politics in all of this. Next, they know that there has been a ruthless agit -prop campaign, using techniques from the era of WW2. Only, they are doing exactly what Hitler did with his turnspeech-big lie tactic, blame the despised other. In Hitler's case, it was the British did this. The key to that technique, is that the ordinary, ill informed person is familiar with little lies, but cannot imagine that responsible statesmen could lie outrageously, especially in situations where narrative dominance and censorship will marginalise correction. That is why I began my response by pointing out what is warranted on public facts. Those who deny or studiously ignore such show themselves to be enablers, not people with a simple difference of opinion. We need to be willing to acknowledge that for decades, the US election system has been grossly sub-standard, that for a very long time it has faced corrupt machine politics (especially in cities), and that it would fail a benchmark against how a run of the mill coop bank handles cash and customer accounts. This comparative is a commonplace, familiar, routine institution, one where there are hundreds of thousands of people -- pervading every community: bankers, managers, even tellers, accountants, serious business people -- who know what doing the right thing looks like from the inside. Further to this, let us note the Carter-Baker proposals, as summarised:
Fifteen years ago, a landmark report by the bipartisan Commission on Federal Election Reform, known informally as the Carter-Baker Commission, advised all U.S. states that in order to guarantee free and fair elections, they should: [1] increase voter ID requirements; [2] minimize the use of mail-in ballots, which “remain the largest source of potential voter fraud”; [3] disallow ballot harvesting by third parties; [4] purge voter rolls of all ineligible or fraudulent names; [5] allow election observers to monitor ballot-counting processes without restraint or obstruction; [6] ensure that voting machines are accurate in their tabulations; and [7] encourage news organizations to “delay the release of any exit-poll data until the election has been decided.” All of these recommendations were widely ignored in the elections of November 2020.[5]
So, we know what should have been done but was deliberately undermined through an organised lawfare and agit prop 4G shadow civil war operation towards decisively undermining election integrity through a dirty form McFaul colour revolution by election manipulation, cf. OP. We have all been bombarded with the marxist critical theory agit prop talking points, where the Marxist framework has been suppressed; that is what led to red guards in the streets, a wave of riots, arson, looting and mayhem, with direct attacks on key foundational principles, monuments, institutions and personalities of not just Constitutional democracy but Western Civilisation. That's the year zero reset, culture revolution aspect. Note, the theme colour of the push, black; with all that is bound up in such i/l/o critical race theory and tendentious claims such as those promoted by NYT et al through their 1619 initiative. And for 1600+ comments, objectors have never been able to cogently address the victory laps being run by marxist agitators about how they have won. Hence, BTW, the pivotal importance of re-establishing the first duties of reason as inescapable, self-evident start-points for how we operate as a civilisation:
We can readily identify at least seven inescapable first duties of reason. "Inescapable," as they are so antecedent to reasoning that even the objector implicitly appeals to them; i.e. they are self-evident. Namely, duties, to truth, to right reason, to prudence, to sound conscience, to neighbour; so also, to fairness and justice etc. Such built-in . . . thus, universal . . . law is not invented by parliaments, kings or courts, nor can these principles and duties be abolished by such; they are recognised, often implicitly as an indelible part of our evident nature. Hence, "natural law," coeval with our humanity, famously phrased in terms of "self-evident . . . rights . . . endowed by our Creator" in the US Declaration of Independence, 1776. (Cf. Cicero in De Legibus, c. 50 BC.) Indeed, it is on this framework that we can set out to soundly understand and duly balance rights, freedoms and duties; which is justice, the pivot of law. The legitimate main task of government, then, is to uphold and defend the civil peace of justice through sound community order reflecting the built in, intelligible law of our nature. Where, as my right implies your duty a true right is a binding moral claim to be respected in life, liberty, honestly aquired property, innocent reputation etc. To so justly claim a right, one must therefore demonstrably be in the right. Likewise, Aristotle long since anticipated Pilate's cynical "what is truth?": truth says of what is, that it is; and of what is not, that it is not. [Metaphysics, 1011b, C4 BC.] Simple in concept, but hard to establish on the ground; hence -- in key part -- the duties to right reason, prudence, fairness etc. Thus, too, we may compose sound civil law informed by that built-in law of our responsibly, rationally free morally governed nature; from such, we may identify what is unsound or false thus to be reformed or replaced even though enacted under the colour and solemn ceremonies of law. The first duties, also, are a framework for understanding and articulating the corpus of built-in law of our morally governed nature, antecedent to civil laws and manifest our roots in the Supreme Law-giver, the inherently good, utterly wise and just creator-God, the necessary (so, eternal), maximally great being at the root of reality.
Then, we could do a lot worse than going back to the US DoI, to go forward in the face of attempt to impose lawless ideologically driven oligarchy:
When . . . it becomes necessary for one people . . . to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation. We hold these truths to be self-evident, [cf Rom 1:18 - 21, 2:14 - 15; note, law as "the highest reason," per Cicero on received consensus], that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security . . . . We, therefore, the Representatives of the united States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions [Cf. Judges 11:27], do, in the Name, and by the Authority of the good People of these Colonies, solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States; that they are Absolved from all Allegiance to the British Crown, and that all political connection between them and the State of Great Britain, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as Free and Independent States, they have full Power to levy War, conclude Peace, contract Alliances, establish Commerce, and to do all other Acts and Things which Independent States may of right do. And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor.
This WaPo article is a further manifest sign of a growing train of abuses and usurpations. KF PS: By interesting coincidence, this is comment 1619.kairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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M8, you clearly don't understand what the defrauding of an election is [and, the evidence is sufficient to say that], and particularly, what institutionalising such fraud is. Of course, the underlying breakdown of moral fibre is even more powerfully reflected in the ongoing holocaust of living posterity in the womb under false colour of law and rights or even of health, for just the US, 63+ millions and growing at 400k per year. The linked context is that it is clear that a 4th gen civil war has been growing in the shadows for several years and across this summer moved up to the level of a colour-culture revolution push. Business as usual is over and the problem is now not the mere decline of the US into something like the gradual decay of ever so many European countries (which is more than bad enough); it is a push to lawless ideologically motivated oligarchy driven by marxist critical theories and linked radicals, and that is an existential threat. The simple way to put what is going on and is coming is this: it is one thing to try to take a ride on a tiger's back; it is a totally different proposition to try to climb off without at minimum a severe mauling. KFkairosfocus
December 26, 2020
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Mike I think I could be described as a "globalist lefty", simply because I don't see the insult, merely the way things are. Your and your friends kicking and screaming efforts to try and stop this is both entertaining and a little frightening; it won't work of course. America is the country I look to, to lead the 'Free World' and under Trump it was a much diminished sick child. Biden will be better (how could he be worse!?) but the real hope is with a two term Harris. The world may be looking at 12 years of sensible America:)marquez8
December 25, 2020
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Whatever Bob. I clearly laid out why I find you to be quote unquote 'lying'.
Well Bob, I guess I have a far bigger problem with your lying about the election, i.e. your continual ‘nothing to see here’ mantra,
Shoot, I went into great detail as to exactly why your position to be dishonest,
Again, the Ruby Freemen video is unambiguous in showing that rampant voter fraud was taking place, and for you to try to deny the validity of this overt, in your face, voter fraud that was taking place is simply an insult to our intelligence and moral sensibilities. Yet you, apparently oblivious to this, continue to act like there is ‘nothing to see here’. You are not an idiot and therefore have no valid excuse for this. Save for your intentional trying to deceive and mislead people about the rampant voter fraud that took place. i.e. You must have a ‘malicious intent’ rather than a good intent! And although you are apparently blind to your own repeated moral failings in this matter, I hope you can, at least, see why I, as an American military veteran, would be very displeased with any foreigner lying about the fact that our election was stolen. Military members, and Veterans, tend to get very upset about such things.
I completely stand behind my assessment of you! If you do not like what I said, we can take it to the administrator and see what he thinks. Do you want to go that route?bornagain77
December 25, 2020
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Seversky, You don't seem to realize that 1/2 of the USA has very very strong ideas about individual liberty. Well, at least a substantial portion. Doesn't matter what Congress does in the end, people will do what they feel emboldened to do. Globalist lefties like you should not expect any sort of smooth transition to globalist/leftist tyranny. It's gonna get interesting, Bob. It really will. The world is a strange place.mike1962
December 25, 2020
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Well, Bob O'hara, It's going to be an interesting couple of years, won't it? Hehe. Hehehe. And the world goes round and round. It. Will. Be. Interesting. No?mike1962
December 25, 2020
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ba77 @ 1605 -
Well Bob, I guess I have a far bigger problem with your lying about the election,
Thank you for acknowledging your hypocrisy. As for lies, please point to one statement I have made on this thread or its predecessor where I have knowingly made a false statement. If you can't, then your acusation of lying is, to say the least, dodgy.Bob O'H
December 25, 2020
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An extensive discussion of how the fraud originally and took place by the former attorney general of Kansas. It may be a repeat of someone else. If so I apologize. Says it was from yesterday. Off to Christmas dinner with relatives. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vic4LpJKFNg&feature=youtu.bejerry
December 25, 2020
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So much for the claim from the elites that only ignorant rubes believe the election was stolen, The Smartest Man In The World – IQ 200 – Is Convinced The U.S. Election Was Stolen. DECEMBER 24, 2020 https://thenationalpulse.com/news/the-smartest-man-in-the-world-iq-200-is-convinced-the-u-s-election-was-stolen/bornagain77
December 25, 2020
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WJM, I find the article's observation on the TX + 17 lockout, interesting:
The only reason given by the Supreme Court [for the lockout] was: “Texas has not demonstrated a judicially cognizable interest in the manner in which another State conducts its election.” In truth, Texas did make such a showing. When Pennsylvania violated the exclusive authority bestowed on state legislators in the Constitution’s Electors Clause, it opened the door to corruption and foreign intrigue to corrupt the electoral votes of Pennsylvania, and as Alexander Hamilton explained in Federalist 68, that is exactly why the Framers created the Electoral College. During the 2020 election cycle, changes to the election process in Pennsylvania were made by judges, state office holders and election officials which would never have been made by its state legislature. If the process by which Presidential Electors are chosen is corrupted in a few key states, like Pennsylvania, Georgia, Michigan and Wisconsin by rigging the system in favor of one candidate, it becomes wholly irrelevant who the People of Texas support. That political reality presents a real “judicially cognizable interest” no matter what the Supreme Court decided. What happens in Pennsylvania does not stay in Pennsylvania, as electors from all States acting together select the President of the United States.
That suggests, something has gone very wrong with the Court. Their suggested answer is interesting, though it may get a similar one liner:
A strategy exists to re-submit the Texas challenge under the Electors Clause to the Supreme Court in a way that even that Court could not dare refuse to consider. Just because Texas did not persuade the Justices that what happens in Pennsylvania hurts Texas does not mean that the United States of America could not persuade the justices that when Pennsylvania violates the U.S. Constitution, it harms the nation. Article III, § 2, cl. 2 confers original jurisdiction on the Supreme Court in any case suit brought by the United States against a state. Thus, the United States can and should file suit against Pennsylvania, Georgia, Michigan and Wisconsin. Like the Texas suit, that new suit would seek an order invalidating the appointment of the electors appointed by those four defendant States that refused to abide by the terms of the Presidential Electors Clause. That would leave it to the state legislatures in those four states to “appoint” electors — which is what the Constitution requires. When those four States violated the Constitution by allowing electors who had not been appointed in the manner prescribed by the state legislature, the United States suffered an injury. Indeed, there could hardly have been a more significant injury to the nation than that which corrupted its Presidential election. The United States has a vital interest and a responsibility to preserve the constitutional framework of the Republic, which was formed by a voluntary compact among the States. As with any contractual relationship of participants in an ongoing enterprise, no party is entitled to ignore or alter the essential terms of the contract by its unilateral action. The President who has sworn to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution has the right and the duty to order the U.S. Department of Justice bring such an action in the Supreme Court — and should do so quickly.
KFkairosfocus
December 25, 2020
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Sev, yes, WHEN there are effective controls, the risk of mail-in ballots is reduced; because of how hard that is to do, they are still always problematic as the cases given since the 1990's show, or with Guyana in the mix, since the 60's to 70's. That is the problem, effective lack of control, third party harvesters and frustration of scrutineers. Unfortunately, in this election, the problems were strongly manifest, tainting the election. And, worse, that was no accident. KF PS: Relevant citation is not misrepresentation.kairosfocus
December 25, 2020
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Seversky, you do realize that all the avenues of fraud, that were warned about for mail-in voting, were 'exponentially' realized in the last election do you not?
Democrats Know Mail-In Voting Means Mass Fraud, And Pushed It Anyway How Democrats continue to purposefully destroy public trust in fair, free elections, and the Union itself. https://thefederalist.com/2020/11/11/democrats-know-mail-in-voting-means-mass-fraud-and-pushed-it-anyway/ Yes, It Was a Stolen Election - You’d have to be blind not to see it. - Dec 23, 2020 - John Perazzo Excerpt: Before the Election: How We Got Here Fifteen years ago, a landmark report by the bipartisan Commission on Federal Election Reform, known informally as the Carter-Baker Commission, advised all U.S. states that in order to guarantee free and fair elections, they should: increase voter ID requirements; minimize the use of mail-in ballots, which “remain the largest source of potential voter fraud”; disallow ballot harvesting by third parties; purge voter rolls of all ineligible or fraudulent names; allow election observers to monitor ballot-counting processes without restraint or obstruction; ensure that voting machines are accurate in their tabulations; and encourage news organizations to “delay the release of any exit-poll data until the election has been decided.” All of these recommendations were widely ignored in the elections of November 2020.[5] During the months leading up to this year’s presidential race, the Biden campaign assembled a team of some 600 lawyers and more than 10,000 volunteers to “[go] into every single state” in order to “call out local rules that don’t adequately ensure access to vote.”[6] Beginning more than a year ago, Democrats filed nearly 300 lawsuits in dozens of states[7] – most notably all of the key battleground states – in an effort to change election laws and regulations in ways that would benefit Democrat candidates. For example, they sought to: (a) extend the statutory deadlines by which mail-in ballots could be submitted, postmarked, or received by election authorities; (b) permit people to vote earlier than ever before, in some cases as many as 50 days prior to Election Day; (c) eliminate signature, signature-verification, and witness requirements for mail-in ballots; (d) void state laws that disallowed ballot harvesting by third parties; (e) terminate photo-ID requirements for in-person voting; (f) introduce provisions that would allow for the “curing” of mail-in ballots that contained errors or omissions; and (g) require state election officials to send unsolicited mail-in ballots to every person listed as a registered voter, even though such lists have long been notoriously inaccurate.[8] Though the Democrats did not get everything that they wanted, they got most of it. Broadcaster and bestselling author Mark Levin, citing the cases of Pennsylvania, Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, and Arizona -- and their combined 73 Electoral College votes – explains what happened: “Every one of these states [and others as well] were targeted by Democrats. Every one of these states violated the United States Constitution, Article II, Section 1, Clause 2 [which empowers the state legislatures alone to make election law for each state]. Every one of them, because changes were made to their election systems not by the state legislature, but by other public officials.… That’s 73 Electoral College votes. This is why Donald Trump won the election…. [I]f the federal Constitution had not been violated, yes, Donald Trump would be … president of the United States today. Putting all fraud aside. All fraud aside. This is why you should be furious with the United States Supreme Court, that had as its duty, as its sworn responsibility … to insist that the states comply with the federal Constitution under Article II, Section 1, Clause 2, and that any changes made outside that clause, by governors, secretaries of states, by courts, federal or state, by election boards or other bureaucrats, will be deemed unconstitutional. [The Supreme Court] had a case [in Pennsylvania] … before a single vote was counted, they had a case [alleging unconstitutional changes to election laws] and they didn’t take it up…. [The Democrats] made these changes, they plotted, they planned, they litigated, they pressured, they lobbied, and now we have, if he’s sworn in, Joe Biden, who will be an illegitimate president of the United States in every meaning of that word, ‘illegitimate.’”[9] https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/2020/12/yes-it-was-stolen-election-john-perazzo/
bornagain77
December 25, 2020
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Kairosfocus/1599
PS: I here clip Carter-Baker on Absentee, mail-in balloting which . . . BEFORE safeguards were broken down . . . was long since highlighted as a key source of fraud:
5.2 ABSENTEE BALLOT AND VOTER REGISTRATION FRAUD Fraud occurs in several ways. Absentee ballots remain the largest source of potential voter fraud.“ A notorious recent case of absentee ballot fraud was Miami’s mayoral election of 1998, and in that case, the judge declared the election fraudulent and called for a new election. Absentee balloting is vulnerable to abuse in several ways: Blank ballots mailed to the wrong address or to large residential buildings might get intercepted. Citizens who vote at home, at nursing homes, at the workplace, or in church are more susceptible to pressure, overt and subtle, or to intimidation. Vote buying schemes are far more difficult to detect when citizens vote by mail. States therefore should reduce the risks of fraud and abuse in absentee voting by prohibiting “third-party” organizations, candidates, and political party activists from handling absentee ballots. States also should make sure that absentee ballots received by election officials before Election Day are kept secure until they are opened and counted. [p. 46]
Except that is not all the Carter/Baker Commission said,
The nonpartisan 2005 Commission on Federal Election Reform, co-chaired by former U.S. President Jimmy Carter and former Secretary of State James A. Baker III, noted among its many findings and recommendations that because it takes place outside the regulated environment of local polling locations, voting by mail creates increased logistical challenges and the potential for vote fraud, especially if safeguards are lacking or when candidates or political party activists are allowed to handle mail-in or absentee ballots. However, the Carter-Baker Commission found that where safeguards for ballot integrity are in place – for example in Oregon, where the entire state has voted by mail since 1998 – there was little evidence of voter fraud. The commission’s main recommendations on vote-by-mail and absentee voting were to increase research on vote-by-mail (and early voting) and to eliminate the practice of allowing candidates or party workers to pick up and deliver absentee ballots. Fortunately, since 2005, many states have gained substantial experience in vote-by-mail and have shown how key concerns can be effectively addressed through appropriate planning, resources, training, and messaging. [My emphasis]
In other words, by quoting only a part of that Commission's findings which you believe support your case, you are misrepresenting them, an example of confirmation bias or quote-mining.Seversky
December 25, 2020
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Marquez8- Your ignorance is not an argument.ET
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