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Endogenous Retroviruses in the Case for Common Ancestry

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We often hear the argument that evidence for common ancestry can also be interpreted as evidence of common design. Some years ago I made the argument that there was no way to discriminate between the two. The argument was countered (successfully IMO) by endogenous retroviruses (ERVs).

A bit of background about ERVs. Retroviruses replicate themselves by invading a host cell and inserting a package of viral genes into the host DNA along with promoters that cause the cell to express (translate and manufacture into proteins) those genes. The expression of those genes makes new virus particles and can compromise or kill the host cell in the process. The active viral gene package, after insertion, is called a provirus. Proviruses can be deactivated by a number of means becoming inert and leaving just the mostly intact but non-functional genes still in the host cell genome. Occasionally a germ cell can become infected and if it survives to become a new organism the deactivated provirus becomes what’s called an endogenous retrovirus (ERV for short) and gets passed along from parent to offspring down the lineage. Because the ERV serves no function it is not conserved by natural selection and is slowly mutilated by random mutations over millions of years until it is no longer recognizable as the strain of provirus it once was. There may be preferred insertion points in the genome for the RV genes but if there are there are a great many potential insertion points.

The case for common ancestry is made by finding the same strain of ERV inserted at the same place (loci) in the genomes of closely related species such as different primate species. The argument is that the RV infected a germ cell in a common ancestor and the ERV was then inherited by all the descendents. When the species splits or spawns a new species that is reproductively isolated each species has the ERV but, and here’s the key, random mutation changes each ERV differently. By comparing the differences in ERV sequences at the same loci in different species one can establish a rough date for the original infection in a common ancestor given a more or less average background rate of random mutation.

ERVs in various levels of decomposition make up some 8% of the human genome. Occasionally however an ERV is conscripted for some useful purpose and is conserved. It should be noted that human designers use domesticated RVs as delivery vehicles to insert foreign genes into genomes to create so-called GM (genetically modified) organisms like tomatoes with longer shelf lives and whatnot. Theoretically this can be used to distribute vaccines for various diseases. A GM banana for instance could carry genes that cause it to manufacture a vaccine for malaria. Eat a GM banana and you’re immunized against malaria. More significant to the case for intelligent design is that this is a mechanism a designer could use to modify genomes – introduce a virus into the population which inserts genes that cause the spawning of a new species. So if anyone asks about possible mechanisms a hypothetical designer could use to intervene and direct evolution that’s a good answer. Human designers are already doing it so it’s a proven mechanism. Morever a highly infectious retrovirus inserting genes that cause modification and speciation could convert entire populations into a new species in just one or several generations and at the same time cause the original species to become extinct virtually overnight. That fits wonderfully with the indisputable testimony of the fossil record which paints a picture of abrupt speciation, millions of years of little if any change in the new species, followed by an abrupt extinction. A mechanism for causing saltation of new species is thus shown.

Anyhow, back to the case for common ancestry. Recently in a private forum where others are concerned with intelligent design I brought up the case of ERVs as evidence supporting common ancestry vs. common design. If common design instead of common ancestry the designer is evidently using existing species in situ as the template for new species. If that’s the case there’s effectively no difference whatsoever between common design and common ancestry.

An objection was raised about how it was possible for a germ cell to become infected by an RV in the first place and secondly how could it survive the infection and go on to grow into a reproducing adult. As it turns out it probably isn’t very likely at all for sperm cells to be either infected with a provirus or survive the infection. Sperm are created and grow quickly into mature cells with a lifetime measured in days. Once mature they are stored behind a blood barrier which inhibits viral infection. They are also very active cells and even if infected would likely be hobbled enough to not be successful at fertilizing an egg. Egg cells however are a whole different story. In mammals a female is born with a lifetime supply of primary oocytes (immature egg cells) already created. There is also no blood barrier where they are stored in ovarian follicles. They are stored in a state of suspended animation or dormancy. Upon their creation in the developing embryo meiosis is halted in the first of two meiotic divisions at anaphase (IIRC) while still diploid (full compliment of 46 chromosomes). DNA replication and segregation into haploid germ cells is not completed until, beginning with puberty, one or a few resume meiosis and become mature egg cells ready to be fertilized. Thus a primary oocyte can hang around in a dormant state for 50 or more years and ostensibly be infected by an RV at any time. Because they are dormant gene expression is suppressed and even after a provirus is inserted into their DNA it isn’t likely to be expressed. The provirus remains dormant as well in other words. Because meoisis hasn’t progressed very far there is still a lot of DNA replication and shuffling (segregation and crossover) that goes on before the egg is mature. My conjecture is that the provirus is deactivated or very likely to be deactivated during the completion of meiosis (possibly from either segregation or crossover) so it is converted at once from provirus to endogenous retrovirus without ever having an opportunity to be expressed into new virus particles. This would handily explain how so many ERVs have found their way into primate genomes.

Comments
Bfast wrote, there are also around a hundred defined disease producing point mutations that are common between the human and the chimp. The evidence suggests that humans and chimps have a common ancestor. Now this is extremely interesting, you claim common ancestor from similarities. Yet you have no knowledge as to what actually caused the mutations (could it be some type of calculated response of the genome to stress). Yet despite mountains of evidence indicating that information cannot be generated in the genome by natural means you claim proof of evolution because of similarity of the genome, and ignore the fact that you have no mechanism for generating information in the genome in the first place, You should instead be looking for a more probable cause for the similarities. (My guess, is that they are not random mutations at all but most likely are "calculated" mutations to stress from some type of prexisting biological feedback loop that scientists have not yet fully defined.)bornagain77
May 11, 2007
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[quote]Your scenario indeed removes the burden of a single new gene having to spread throughout the population...[/quote] An unnecessary concession. DS stated talking apples and oranges. Go back and examine the originally porposed scenario, and the problem persists. [quote]2b - God specially created humans to appear as if we have a common ancestor. Ie: he’s just foolin’ — lying.[/quote] This fails as an argument against design, for obvious reasons.Mung
May 11, 2007
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"There is an instance of convergence of retroviral sequences which perform the same function between mice and primates." Oh, that's just great. Now we're back to explaining these with our old standby, ad-hoc explanation of convergent evolution? So it is evidence for a common relationship . . . except when it is not . . . Forgive my skepticism.Eric Anderson
May 11, 2007
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I found my old comment. I'll reproduce the comment since I forget the details: There is an instance of convergence of retroviral sequences which perform the same function between mice and primates. Since there isn’t common ancestary between those two, that retroviral instance would lend us more towards design. http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/abstract/0406509102v1geoffrobinson
May 11, 2007
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bFast wrote: "Let the evidence speak for itself." Absolutely agree. We should be willing to let that evidence challenge our personal religious and philosophical convictions. ". . . there are also around a hundred defined disease producing point mutations that are common between the human and the chimp." Ah, yes, but how many are there that are different? Further, is there an explanation for the similarities that does not rely on common descent? To use a crude example, how many common points of failure exist between a car and a 747? Probably several dozen at least. Does that mean they descended from each other? I have no particular philosophical issue with the idea of common descent. I am, however, skeptical of looking at a set of existing comparisons and assuming that this gives a historical narrative. Comparative genomics is a useful exercise, but it is, in principle, an undertaking eerily similar to comparative anatomy. One may find comparative genomics more compelling, but the undertaking is the same. I can easily come up with several dozen similarities between a lion and an elephant. Does that mean one is descended from the other? Comparative analyses are interesting, but they must be kept in context, and their inherent and significant limitations must be respected. I have no issue with common descent. Nevertheless, I remain highly skeptical, based on my, admittedly limited, review of the evidence that is cited. Similarities between species are noteworthy and interesting. It is also interesting to think about how similarities might be preserved from one species to the next. Yet what is conspicuous by its very absence is any compelling mechanism that can explain the origin of the differences.Eric Anderson
May 11, 2007
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Jehu, "Or the virus inserted itself at the same loci in different species." This is a nice hypothetical solution. It would seem to hold merit if there were some cause why the ERV was inserted at that particular location, and would hold merit if there were very few such events. However, not only do ERVs show this phenomenon, but as discussed on Brainstorms recently, there are also around a hundred defined disease producing point mutations that are common between the human and the chimp. The evidence suggests that humans and chimps have a common ancestor. The best reason I can find to conclude that that is not so is a religious conviction. I, for one, do not want science bridled by religious conviction whether that be the conviction that some text is divine, or the conviction that there is no divine. Let the evidence speak for itself.bFast
May 11, 2007
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Dave Scot wrote: A significant fraction of the population getting infected by the same retrovirus over a small number of generations would be my guess. If this were the case one would not expect to see insertion points at identical locci if this were truly a random process. But I am aware that there is excellent evidence for preferential insertion points. The significance of this lies in the use of ERVs by Darwinists to argue for common descent. If insertion points occur at preferred locations and a retroviral outbreak occurs, one would expect to see the evidence for this not only in the same genomic locations within a species, but also perhaps for different species, as would be the case for primates who have very similar genomes. Identical preferred insertion points would explain the presence of ERVs at the same locations in two species having very similar genomes. This still would not explain why genomic junk would be preserved over geologic time periods and indicates a natural selection anomaly. If mortality rate is low, tranmission rate is high, and germ cell infection is common it could become fixed in a single generation. I’m a little surprised no one thought about the difference between a viral gene and a new allele. Viruses spread horizontally and with great rapidity through a population. The same gene finding its way into many individuals or even an entire population requires no reproduction of the host at all. This is fascinating to contemplate. However retroviruses leave a genomic signature behind by which they are identifed. In addition for an ERV to become a functional part of a eukaryotic genome we would expect to find promotor regions, an initiation site and required transcription factors enabling gene expression. I'm not a believer in accidental causality and before one invokes selection to explain how an accident becomes deterministic I'd like a clearer indication that selection is not an ad hoc concept, that can explain both the retention of junk over geologic time, as well as slightly beneficial theoretical changes. A related interesting question lies in accounting for the origin of viruses themselves. From a Darwinian perspective they are problematic being host dependent.pk4_paul
May 11, 2007
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bornagain77 wrote: "Theism postulates that the DNA of man is complete and ANY mutations to it will be detrimental in some nature, This is exactly what the evidence of exhaustive experimentation is pointing too." I'm not sure which theism this would be. I doubt this is the position of most official mainstream religious views. You do have an excellent point, however, that the great weight of the evidence points toward a system well designed from the outset, and with respect to which deviations are generally detrimental. One can, of course, scour the landscape of biology and come up with a handful of examples of (i) on the one hand, "poor" function or design, and (ii) on the other hand, deviations/mutations that are helpful in some limited sense to the organism. We ought to frankly acknowledge these observations when they are made, but we ought also to see them in the broader biological context -- which context clearly demonstrates that such examples are the very exceptions that prove the rule.Eric Anderson
May 11, 2007
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Again the options are: 1 - ERVs prove that humans and chimps had a common ancestor or 2 - The desiger (God) put the ERV code into a special creation because: 2a - It actually plays a meaningful role or 2b - God specially created humans to appear as if we have a common ancestor. Ie: he’s just foolin’ — lying
Or the virus inserted itself at the same loci in different species.Jehu
May 11, 2007
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DaveScot wrote: ". . . this is a mechanism a designer could use to modify genomes - introduce a virus into the population which inserts genes that cause the spawning of a new species . . ." Let's see, a virus "inserts genes." Which genes and what do they do? Can they really "cause the spawning of a new species?" What about epigenetic information, which is increasingly understood to be significant and extensive -- all the way from the cellular structure to the level of organs and the entire organism. Seems like we are talking about another just-so story at this stage, based on the inaccurate, or at least incomplete, central dogma that information travels in only one direction from the DNA. The problem of getting information into the DNA is of course horrendous (from a naturalistic perspective). Yet it is hardly the only problem to be overcome in getting from one species to the next. Might it be sufficient to account for all the differences between species within a single genus? Questionable, but possible. Does it account for all the differences at higher levels? Exceedingly unlikely. An interesting topic worthy of further consideration, to be sure, but not terribly convincing as of yet.Eric Anderson
May 11, 2007
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IF you are very selective in your evidence then yes some have made a good case for common ancestor. But in my view it totally falls apart when you look at the overall big picture. This is the same with fossils, they really don't support common ancestor unless you are very selective (sometime to the extreme) in what is considered evidence. To me not very convincing.Smidlee
May 11, 2007
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Mike 1962, All the "Suggestive evidence" you allude too, but do not name specifically, for common ancestry (my guess is similarities of some type), has a irreconcilable flaw with reality. You have no method or process whatsoever to account for the generation of meaningful information in the genome, as the following quotes illustrate. “But in all the reading I’ve done in the life-sciences literature, I’ve never found a mutation that added information… All point mutations that have been studied on the molecular level turn out to reduce the genetic information and not increase it.” Lee Spetner (Ph.D. Physics – MIT) “There is no known law of nature, no known process and no known sequence of events which can cause information to originate by itself in matter.” Werner Gitt, “In the Beginning was Information”, 1997, p. 106. (Dr. Gitt was the Director at the German Federal Institute of Physics and Technology) You base your conclusions on faulty suggestive evidence that has no basis in the evidence we have established for the integrity of the DNA. Theism postulates that the DNA of man is complete and ANY mutations to it will be detrimental in some nature, This is exactly what the evidence of exhaustive experimentation is pointing too. Evolution is left wanting for a mechanism of novelty and all presumptions to arise from the evolutionary scenario are meaningless until evolutionists can clearly demonstrate a gain in genetic information that would violate the entropy of information! This is not some minor point I point out, this one point is the very crux of the battle between ID and evolution!bornagain77
May 11, 2007
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bornagain77:
I’m still not buying the reasoning that the viruses were somehow responsible for totally new species.
I don't see ERVs as playing any significant role at all in the development of new species, ERVs are a marker. However, there are only two explanations I can find for why chimps and humans would have this same virus-caused marker. The first is that the marker landed in the genome of the common ancestor prior to the chimp/human split. The other expanation is that the designer intentionally placed the marker in his new human creation. Why did he do that? Two possible explanations, the DNA that we see as the product of ERVs plays a valuable role in the DNA of the human, or the designer did so in order to make a unique creation appear to be the product of common ancestry. Ie, he's foolin' us -- lying. Again the options are: 1 - ERVs prove that humans and chimps had a common ancestor or 2 - The desiger (God) put the ERV code into a special creation because: 2a - It actually plays a meaningful role or 2b - God specially created humans to appear as if we have a common ancestor. Ie: he's just foolin' -- lying. As 2b is anathema, either 1 or 2a must be the case. My vote, my very strong vote based up on the evidence is for common ancestry. That said, I am not so convinced that all of life stemmed from a single common ancestor. It is well reasonable that there were three, one for each domain. However, the cambrian explosion may also have been a special creation event. Were the reptiles a special creation event? Mammals? It seems rather likely to me that all mammals share a common ancestor.bFast
May 11, 2007
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scordova, "Even as someone who rejects common ancestry, I readily concede the arguments for common ancestry are formidable." Just curious, but why do you reject common ancestry if the arguments for it are formidable?mike1962
May 11, 2007
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DS, "Viruses spread horizontally and with great rapidity through a population. The same gene finding its way into many individuals or even an entire population requires no reproduction of the host at all." This reminds me of Spetner's hypothesis of species-wide spontaneous mutations in response to environmental queues. A similar pattern of spreading is seen. But back to ERVs. Indeed, a viral event would have to overtake a majority of the population each time we find one of these, injecting itself into gametic cells, not harming the reproductive aspects of the host, then remain in the genome without being removed by random effects and recombination, happening several times in different species. I don't know the probability of your scenario for species-wide gametic infection, but unless you have independent evidence that this most likely happened, it would seem that the ERV case isn't super strong. Your scenario indeed removes the burden of a single new gene having to spread throughout the population, but it itself seems like it may require more than one unlikely event. So at the moment, I'd say it is better to be cautious when using ERVs as evidence of anything, since we are just beginning to understand their function and guess at their history.Atom
May 11, 2007
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I disagree with Sal (apologies) in that the evidence for common ancestry is very weak. I say that because we still don't have any data which demonstrates what caused (causes) the physiological and anatomical differences observed between allegedly closely related populations- like chimps and humans. To this day we don't even know if such a transformation is even possible. But anyway- ERVs: In order for an ERV to be in the same location in differing populations via Common Descent, either many individuals in the originally infected had to be infected at the same locus or there was a survivable bottle-neck. IOW only one got infected and that one passed on the genetic material that all subsequent populations received. And if multiple individuals got infected at the same locus/ loci then that would mean a common mechanism is at play. Next comes meiosis with its chromosomal recombinations being the norm. So not only does the ERV have to survive that bottle-neck it has to stay in place all the while rearrangements are taking place all around it. And in the end it could be that these sequences just look like ERVs- convergence could explain that. They also could be part of a common design that we just don't understand- yet. (one common design scenario could be that these are ERV decoys that won't allow new viral insertions)Joseph
May 11, 2007
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Thank You Geoff Robinson, To refute the Evolutionists ERV scenario it is necessary to find deeper purpose for the ERV information in the genome. at this site which Mr. Robinson points to in his post; http://www.pnas.org/cgi/conten.....03836103v1 I found this statement: This work supports the hypothesis that ERVs play fundamental roles in placental morphogenesis and mammalian reproduction. So the ERV code does have specific purpose communicating between the cells. This is Much like the communication viruses enable in the bacterial community. According to evolutionary Dogma the majority of ERV in the genome have no function. Yet when tested for function they are shown to have specific function in the development of fetuses. As I stated before, Evolutionists have always blatantly underestimated the complexity they are dealing with in the genome. From their terrrible track record in the past we are justified to remain highly sceptical of anything the evolutionists choose to say about the information in the Genome.bornagain77
May 11, 2007
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Let’s say an organism gets infected, and thus gets this new gene. We can think of it as a new “allele”. What causes this new allele to become fixed in the population so that every member of the species eventually has the same gene? Does it provide a selection value to take over a population? If not, then won’t random effects cause the one copy of the gene (from the infected organism) to probably not become fixed?
Yes, you're right. If a new allele is neutral, then it probably won't become fixed. However, a lot of new alleles are being produced over time, so even if most disappear, a few will become fixed. Fixation can be facilitated by a small population size, and in particular things like population crashes, or migration into a new area by a small number of individuals can have a large effect on fixation. So, a selective advantage isn't necessary for fixation, but it does help! BobBob O'H
May 11, 2007
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atom & pk4_paul What causes this new allele to become fixed in the population so that every member of the species eventually has the same gene? A significant fraction of the population getting infected by the same retrovirus over a small number of generations would be my guess. If mortality rate is low, tranmission rate is high, and germ cell infection is common it could become fixed in a single generation. I'm a little surprised no one thought about the difference between a viral gene and a new allele. Viruses spread horizontally and with great rapidity through a population. The same gene finding its way into many individuals or even an entire population requires no reproduction of the host at all. A single sneeze can put the viral genes into everyone in your cave all at once. Alleles can't spread that way - unless of course they happen to get picked up as an accidental tourist by a retrovirus which is also well within the realm of physical possibility. Horizontal gene flow via prophages and plasmids is common in prokaryotes, at least significant in protists, and at least suspected of being significant in complex multicellular organisms. ba77 I’m still not buying the reasoning that the viruses were somehow responsible for totally new species. The novel information required for jumps between species is measured in millions of base pairs of DNA. I must have missed the research that determined how many genetic modifications were required to change one primate into another. I was under the impression that all we know is how many differences there are and we have no clue how many of them are actually required. I do know that modification of a single existing gene, or just the regulatory region for a gene that causes more or less of the protein to be manufactured at different times, has been shown to cause cascade effects throughout the entire organism in totally unexpected ways. A quick look around for number of base pairs in a retrovirus found a couple of hits in the neighborhood of 10,000. The theoretical upper limit is something I didn't see (but I didn't look very hard). Keep in mind genes can do really weird things like make copies of itself all over the place (retrotransposons). The copies can have different effects depending on where they land. There's no reason to presume a designer would be limited to one virus nor does any single virus have to have an immediate effect. A long series of ERVs that lie dormant until a final one activates the whole lot into action is possible. This is so speculative (but quite possible) the best reading I can recommend on speciation via ERV mobilization is Greg Bear's highly acclaimed hard science fiction book "Darwin's Radio". Read this article I wrote https://uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/biologys-next-revolution/ in January that mentions Darwin's Radio and links to a review of it published in Nature. DaveScot
May 10, 2007
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Atom raises a very good point: I have a question (forgive me if this betrays ignorance on my part). Let’s say an organism gets infected, and thus gets this new gene. We can think of it as a new “allele”. What causes this new allele to become fixed in the population so that every member of the species eventually has the same gene? Does it provide a selection value to take over a population? If not, then won’t random effects cause the one copy of the gene (from the infected organism) to probably not become fixed? Why should a genomic change become fixed in a population unless it provides a benefit to an organism? Even if a benefit can be described we cannot be certain of it spreading throughout the population. All primate populations carry a genetic load. More to the point, when two recessive alleles are present and the related phenotypic trait is expressed reproductive fitness is in no way perceptibly lessened by it when its effects are slight. All of us carry some slight genetic defects that explain some of our physical traits. This post is an interesting one, as is the analysis contained in it, but until Atom's question is resolved it appears that those touting retroviral evidence for common descent need to explain how the allged events are consistent with their depiction of natural selection's role in evolution.pk4_paul
May 10, 2007
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In that thread, I pointed to a study which a virus appeared in mice as well as humans(?). Maybe someone could find the link in the comments. I did find this: http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/abstract/0603836103v1 So retrovirus's could have design characteristics.geoffrobinson
May 10, 2007
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Similarities is evolutionists strongest point of contention, yet you forget a few things. Scientists are to the point of declaring ALL mutations to DNA detrimental to the organism. This keeps in line with the second law of thermodynamics. As well The seemingly beneficial mutations, which still keep in line with the entropy of information by the way, are on the verge of being declared "calculated" mutations. This will prove a higher level of design in the cell and further alienate the evolutionists fallacy. I'm not scared of the similarities at all. The virus myth is just another blind alley for evolutionists. Hopefully breakthroughs will be forthcoming that will reveal purpose for the "virus" information. As a sidelight to this, I find the fact that viruses allow communication to the enviroment for populations of bacteria to be interesting to our topic. Could it be some comunicative type code that allows cells to "talk" to each other. I know it is just a guess, but when you really think about it, that is all evolutionists are really doing with the similarities anyway! They totally ignore all other lines of evidence that doesn't support there narrow view. I also remind you that evolutionists have always severely underestimated the level of complexity that they are dealing with.bornagain77
May 10, 2007
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Even as someone who rejects common ancestry, I readily concede the arguments for common ancestry are formidable. I would like to point my creationist brethren to an excellent article by creationist biologist Dr. Todd Wood who highlights the arguments in favor of common ancestry. He and I do not accept common ancestry, however, we both recognize common ancestry is not an unreasonable position (unlike unreasonable positions such as a belief in mindles OOL). The Chimpanzee Genome and the Problem of Biological Similarity Wood offers the difficulty creationists face:
THE FUTURE OF CREATIONIST GENOMICS The genome revolution, exciting though it is, is not an obvious victory for creationism. Although more data allows for better testing of ideas, the data that we have present significant challenges to creationist theory, particularly in the realm of biological similarity. I am confident that a solution to most of the problems in this article will be forthcoming. How quickly these issues are resolved, however, will depend entirely on our research priorities and how we choose to pursue those priorities. If we wish to be good stewards of our very limited resources, we should avoid projects that are unlikely to be productive (e.g. overemphasizing potentially insignificant differences or trivializing the striking similarities) and focus instead on one of the most pressing problems in biology, biological similarity.
scordova
May 10, 2007
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Dave, I'm still not buying the reasoning that the viruses were somehow responsible for totally new species. The novel information required for jumps between species is measured in millions of base pairs of DNA. I don't know how much information a virus can insert into DNA at one time, but I believe whatever information it inserts is sequential in nature. I think the problems of your scenario are obvious because of the required numerous specific and beneficial modifications that have to be made in different regions of the genome, not to mention the changes that have to be made to the cell itself. Unless a virus can make specific modifications to many different sites without embedding itself into the DNA, and then disappearing and leaving no trace in the cell. Your scenario is unconvincing at first glance. I also remind you that is still "Just" an educated guess on the evolutionists part that says the information of the ERV is an inherited characteristic of a common ancestor. Indeed we are still mearly infants in our understanding of the Genome. The Genome is so complex man may never be able to fully decipher it. I think it is very premature to put stock in anything the evolutionists have to say about how information got into the genome... VERY PREMATURE INDEED!!bornagain77
May 10, 2007
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PS Sorry if I was loose in my terminology, interchanging "gene" and "allele"...I understand the difference. I think my post is sufficiently clear on what I meant, but I'm sorry for being sloppy in that regard.Atom
May 10, 2007
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Hey Dave, thanks for this post and the info on ERVs. I have a question (forgive me if this betrays ignorance on my part). Let's say an organism gets infected, and thus gets this new gene. We can think of it as a new "allele". What causes this new allele to become fixed in the population so that every member of the species eventually has the same gene? Does it provide a selection value to take over a population? If not, then won't random effects cause the one copy of the gene (from the infected organism) to probably not become fixed? The way I see it, there are two chance events: 1) the egg cell becoming infected (don't know the odds here, but they would be relevant), and 2) the new gene becoming fixed in the population (we have a rough estimate on this). Am I looking at this the wrong way? To me it would seem that any claim that a copy of a gene spread to all members of a population has the same difficulties whether we're dealing with a random-mutation caused gene or a virally inserted gene.Atom
May 10, 2007
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