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Epigenetic Inheritance: Can Evolution Adapt?

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Given how routinely evolution fails to explain biology, it is remarkable that scientists still believe in the nineteenth century idea. One of the many problems areas is adaptation. Evolution holds that populations adapt to environmental pressures via the natural selection of blind variations. If more fur is needed, and some individuals accidentally are endowed with mutations that confer a thicker coat of fur, then those individuals will have greater survival and reproduction rates. The thicker fur mutation will then become common in the population.

This is the evolutionary notion of change. It is not what we find in biology. Under the hood, biology reveals far more complex and intelligent mechanisms for change, collectively referred to as epigenetic inheritance. You can read more about the challenge that this form of inheritance poses for evolution here. The take home message is that adaptation is routinely found to be not blind, but rather responsive to environmental pressures. The fur becomes thicker not by accident, but via cellular mechanisms responding to a need.

There is still much to learn about this phenomenal built-in adaptation capability, but it now is clear, and has been for many years, that epigenetic inheritance is a dramatic departure from evolutionary expectations. Indeed, this sort of adaptation is closer to the ideas of the long disgraced French naturalist Jean-Baptiste Lamarck (1744-1829). Lamarck’s idea was that offspring inherit traits or characteristics that were acquired by the parents. Although epigenetic inheritance is far more complex than anything Lamarck imagined, he was remarkably close to what is now being discovered. You can see a recent review of what has been learned here. Only a few years ago positive references to Lamarck drew heated response. Such ideas were not tolerated. Now his name appears regularly in the epigenetics literature.

This leaves evolutionists in an awkward position, to say the least.

Continue reading here.

Comments
Hunter, good thread! This goes right to the heart of the Design Inference idea. Are well really to believe that an intelligence didn't play in a role in the development and origination of systems exhibiting this level of specified complexity? No way.Frost122585
June 12, 2009
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Khan:
you seem to not understand that the mode of inheritnce is not critical to whether evolution works or not.
The question isn't about "evolution".
Darwin himself thought that acquired traits were inherited.
Darwinism is not anti-Lamark. I believe that position "evolved" over time into the non-lamarkian neo-darwinian position. Not everything acquired is inherited- that seems fairly obvious by now. But does the premise of unguided processes predict that the SAME genetic ingredients can give rise to the diversity we observe it does? Absolutely not.Joseph
June 12, 2009
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herb, But if you take a series of tornados, each coming from a different direction...Joseph
June 12, 2009
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Maybe a more specific example would help: Every time Boeing assembles a 747, that is evidence that nature operating freely can’t do it. According to wikipedia, there have been 1,416 747’s built, so the chances of one arising through a “tornado in a junkyard” scenario must be less than 1/1,416, otherwise we would have observed one already. By independence, the probability that 747’s cannot arise through chance and necessity is 1 - (1/1,416)^1,416 which is 1 according to my calculator. I don’t think this is going to help anyone understand anything! You seem to be suggesting that you can somehow reduce the probability of something being created through natural causes simply by building more of them artificially. If this line of reasoning held the potential would be enormous. Worried about the chances of a pandemic virus? Quickly create an artificial harmless virus pandemic and reduce the odds – in fact do it multiples times to keep reducing the odds. You may think it is unlikely that event X will happen without intelligent intervention. However, making event X with intelligent intervention has no effect on that probability whatsoever.Mark Frank
June 12, 2009
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Scott,
The key word there is “acquired.” If RM+NS is the old explanation, what is the new one?
you seem to not understand that the mode of inheritnce is not critical to whether evolution works or not. Darwin himself thought that acquired traits were inherited. so random mutation and quasi-Lamarckism are not mutually exclusive. there's apparently a mix of both.Khan
June 12, 2009
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#81 Scott Andrews "See the headings under Frequently raised but weak arguments against Intelligent Design." There are 38 items - which particular ones did you have in mind?Mark Frank
June 12, 2009
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Joseph,
And yes when intelligent agencies construct something it is evidence for ID as nature, operating freely sure as heck didn’t do it.
I'm not sure why the evos don't understand the logic. Maybe a more specific example would help: Every time Boeing assembles a 747, that is evidence that nature operating freely can't do it. According to wikipedia, there have been 1,416 747's built, so the chances of one arising through a "tornado in a junkyard" scenario must be less than 1/1,416, otherwise we would have observed one already. By independence, the probability that 747's cannot arise through chance and necessity is 1 - (1/1,416)^1,416 which is 1 according to my calculator.herb
June 12, 2009
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Mark Frank:
The point was that it appears that sometimes organisms inherit acquired characteristics...This is different from regular RM+NS. We may or may not understand how it happens – does this justify the conclusion it was designed?
The key word there is "acquired." If RM+NS is the old explanation, what is the new one? I'm not arguing against any new model of inheritance. But this only shifts the question from "How do undirected natural forces produce these adaptations?" to "How do undirected natural forces produce organisms that produce these adaptations?" Take your pick - there's no explanation for either.
But Cornelius has reminded us there are other models for inheritance which we only partially understand.
Perhaps our understanding of inheritance will change. This has nothing to do with explaining the origin of the inherited traits.
Please point me to the part of the site that gives evidence for ID other than by trying to show the improbability of RM+NS
See the headings under Frequently raised but weak arguments against Intelligent Design.ScottAndrews
June 12, 2009
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Alan, I read what you posted on Telic Thoughts and you are a real PoS. I say that because I qualified my statement about non-functional ribosomes by saying they will not function until someone learns how to program them. It looks like they figured that out in their synthesizing process- most likely an accidental byproduct. However the synthesized ribosome can only make one product. Do you really think that helps your position? (I am sure you do but then again any and everything supports your position in your mind)Joseph
June 12, 2009
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Alan Fox:
Atheistic Darwinian evolutionists suggest that, because many (if not all) organisms from the very simple to the more complex, demonstrate fixed patterns of behaviour that are not taught or learned, these patterns must exist in the organism in some form which is heritable. You seem not to accept this.
As I said earlier this morning I say it is the PROGRAMMING not the genes nor the DNA. That is an ID hypothesis. And I doubt behavior is fixed. The croc changed his behavior.
BTW did you see someone has managed to synthesize functional ribosomes. This, according to the poster at Telic Thoughs, is evidence for ID.
Yes Alan we have been over this already. And yes when intelligent agencies construct something it is evidence for ID as nature, operating freely sure as heck didn't do it. THAT is the point behind ID that some things are NOT reducible to matter, energy, chance and necessity. And to refdute the design inference all you have to do is demonstrate it is.Joseph
June 12, 2009
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I must be a mutant. I am the only gym-rat in my family even though my brothers were also atheletes. I changed my behavior- I mean my genes changed my behavior such that I was able to change my phenotype! And here I am thinking I was controlling what I do but Nakashima has demonstrated it is all in the genes. No more murderers- it's all in the genes so we can't blame the person. No more criminals at all- just think of the money we could save by not having all those prisons. We just need to work harder of gene therapy.Joseph
June 12, 2009
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Joe, Atheistic Darwinian evolutionists suggest that, because many (if not all) organisms from the very simple to the more complex, demonstrate fixed patterns of behaviour that are not taught or learned, these patterns must exist in the organism in some form which is heritable. You seem not to accept this. Does ID have an alternative hypothesis? BTW did you see someone has managed to synthesize functional ribosomes. This, according to the poster at Telic Thoughs, is evidence for ID. Go figure!Alan Fox
June 12, 2009
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So the first birds with this genetic trait or traits just started flying in some direction? And the birds who flew in the right direction were lucky enough to survive and produce offspring with the same genes? Did they get the genes that allowed them to return at the same time they got the genes that told them to leave and where to go? Or did the first bird with these genes just fly off and never came back? Has anyone isolated these migration genes? My money is on the programming- the same programming that tells the genes what to do, when to do it and where the products go.Joseph
June 12, 2009
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Mr Joseph, My claim is as bogus as this: The genetics of bird migration: stimulus, timing, and direction PETER BERTHOLD 1 ANDREAS J. HELBIG 1 1 Max-Planck-Institut fürVerhaltensphysiologie, Vogelwarte, Scftloss Moeggingen, D(W)-776o Radolfzell, Germany Copyright 1992 British Ornithologists Union ABSTRACT The extent to which genetic factors are directly involved in the control of bird migration and the mode of inheritance involved has been studied systematically over the past 15 years in the Blackcap Sylvia atricapilla by cross-breeding and selective breeding. Results have also been obtained from a few experimental and field studies on Robins Eritfiacus rubecula, Blackbirds Turdus merula and Song Sparrows Melospiza melodia. Cross-breeding of migrants with nonmigrants has resulted in the partial transmission of migratory activity into the F, generation indicating that the urge to migrate is inherited and is based on a multilocus system with a threshold for expression. Migratoriness and sedentariness in obligate partial migrants is probably inherited in a similar way, suggesting that the decision to migrate also has a strong genetic basis. Both traits can be selected to phenotypic uniformity within 3–6 generations indicating an extremely high evolutionary potential. Orientation behaviour can also be transmitted to the offspring of a nonmigratory population by cross-breeding. Cross-breeding individuals with different migratory directions produced offspring with phenotypically intermediate directional preferences, suggesting that the migratory direction is also a predominantly heritable character. In the current development of novel migratory habits in those Central European Blackcaps that now winter in the British Isles, the inheritance of the novel migratory direction may be crucial. Genetic variation in migratory events seems to be sufficient to allow for many microevolutionary processes. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- DIGITAL OBJECT IDENTIFIER (DOI) 10.1111/j.1474-919X.1992.tb04731.x About DOI Nakashima
June 12, 2009
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Nakashima:
No, spiders are not taught by their mothers. The behavior is encoded in their genes. Similarly with bird migration.
Do you have ANY evidence for that? I seriously doubt it. I say your claim is about as bogus as they come.Joseph
June 12, 2009
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Mark Frank, You want evidence for ID- Read the floowing: Intelligent Design in biology textbooks ID in biology textbooks cont That's just a small tip of a very large iceberg. I look forward to your evidence that nature, operating freely produced what I posted.Joseph
June 12, 2009
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ScottAndrews: I don’t think there’s any argument that organisms inherit characteristics. But this explanation seems to gloss over the part where they develop them. What explains how they develop what their offspring inherit? The point was that it appears that sometimes organisms inherit acquired characteristics (I don’t believe spines on water fleas fall into this category – see Nakashima #63). This is different from regular RM+NS. We may or may not understand how it happens – does this justify the conclusion it was designed? The point is that the whole case for ID is built on attacking one specific model of how inheritance takes place – random mutation of DNA with all mutations equally probable. I don’t believe this attack works. But Cornelius has reminded us there are other models for inheritance which we only partially understand. So we cannot deduce that if RM+NS fails, it must have been designed by a designer with undefined powers and motives. There’s some helpful information on this site to acquaint yourself with ID. I have been following this debate for several years now. Please point me to the part of the site that gives evidence for ID other than by trying to show the improbability of RM+NS (bearing in mind that “information” is just another way of talking about the improbability of RM+NS).Mark Frank
June 12, 2009
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Prof Kellogg, First Old Yeller, now Charlotte's Web. Don't anybody get the idea to recommend I read White Fang, Call of the Wild, Shane, or Captain's Courageous, because I did those already.Nakashima
June 11, 2009
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Cornelius, what you list on that site are a series of hypotheses within the theory of evolution. just say some of them out loud and you'll see what I mean. for example, would you ever say "I predict that eukaryotes evolved from prokaryotes"? sounds pretty awkward, yes? you would say "I hypothesize that eukaryotes evolved from prokaryotes." then your prediction would be that, for example, a phylogenetic tree would show proks as basal to euks. if your prediction is not supported, then oh well.. maybe some data you picked up along the way points to a better answer. as a scientist, i'm sure you know the difference between a theory, hypothesis and prediction.. you should really apply it to your website.Khan
June 11, 2009
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Khan:
no more of a stretch than it is to call anything on your website a prediction of evolution. or a prediction of Darwin.
Anything on my website a prediction of evolution?? This is an example of the kind of denial I mentioned in the blog. Evolutionists just dismiss falsified predictions as though they don't exist. It is not difficult to find falsified predictions of evolution. Each of the thirteen predictions on www.DarwinsPredictions.com is straight out of the literature and unequivocal. Citations are given and each one is prediction is from mainstream evolutionary thought.Cornelius Hunter
June 11, 2009
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no more of a stretch than it is to call anything on your website a prediction of evolution. or a prediction of Darwin. words mean something, Cornelius, particularly when, in the absence of data or even hypotheses, it is all you have.Khan
June 11, 2009
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Khan:
that’s the problem, it is not an uncontroversial failed prediction- Darwin himself predicted it.
That would be quite a rewrite of history. It would be a stretch to cast pangenesis as (i) intelligently responding to environmental pressures and (ii) a prediction of evolution. Darwin was struggling to formulate a mechanism of heredity. He certainly needed the mechanism not to contradict evolution, but it wasn't any sort of an important prediction of evolution. Mark Frank:
Let’s be clear - Epigenetics is not the same thing as Lamarckism. This has been touched on above but not I think made clear. Epigenetics is simple inheritance by methods other than DNA. Lamarckism is inheritance of acquired characteristics by any method - including DNA. Cornelius web site and post seem to muddle the two.
Thanks for emphasizing that distinction, but no, I do not muddle the two.Cornelius Hunter
June 11, 2009
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Nakashima-san, you may be interested in a book of children's literature called Charlotte's Web by E.B. White. The baby spiders at the end of the story have no mother to teach them. So sad. :-( Thank goodness for spider genes!David Kellogg
June 11, 2009
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Mr Joseph, No, spiders are not taught by their mothers. The behavior is encoded in their genes. Similarly with bird migration.Nakashima
June 11, 2009
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How can one test the premise that a bacterial flagellum can evolve from a population that never had one via an accumulation of genetic accidents? By trying to answer that question you will see the hopelessness of your position. Nakashima:
Take populations of sessile bacteria, devise a protocol that rewards motility. Run experiment. No guarantee you will get the same flagellar structure of course!
That is what Dr Behe has said and evolutionists have balked at the very suggestion. He even provided a similar caveat. But anyway if no flagellum or similarly complex structure arises is the premise falsified?Joseph
June 11, 2009
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Mr ScottAndrews, Mark Frank: “Result X is wildly improbable based on random permutations of DNA therefore X was designed” is even not valid even if the premise were true. Inheritance is not just DNA, and inheritance may not be entirely random. And it all happen without design. If it’s not random, and also happened without design, then where did this system of innovative and inherited self-improvement come from? From some unknown natural law that wants threatened water fleas to have spikes? Between chance, design, and natural laws, what am I leaving out? The water flea spines are an epigenetic response to stress. Some chemical, a hormone perhaps, modifies the state of the eggs formed in the female after exposure to the stress. What you are 'leaving out' is a leap from how the adaptation is used to how the adaptation is formed. The ability to develop spines in the presence of predators was adaptive for some fleas. Away from the predators, it was maladaptive and turned off. An epigenetic switch evolved that could turn the expression back on, again a positive adaptation.Nakashima
June 11, 2009
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Nakashima:
Behavior is part of the phenotype built by the genotype.
I guess evolutionists will say anything.
Are you saying that you do not believe that animal behavior has a genetically determined component?
A crew was observing an albino croc from birth. They thought no way this thing could survive. Not only did it survive it did as well as all the other crocs around. It changed its attack habit from surface skimming to coming up from the bottom.
Spiders are taught to spin webs by their mothers, or by small angels whispering in their ears?
Do we have evidence of spider moms teaching their young?Joseph
June 11, 2009
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Reading over these comments reminds me of my youtube evolution arguments. Neodarwinism explains everything and it's opposite. It doesn't matter that some part of Larmarck's work might be legitimate, Neodarwinians knew that already. Because they never believed Neodarwinism anyways, they were always in Darwins camp, and he was a Lamarckian. Nevermind the fact that epigenetics has no solid foundation, nor does Lamarck, nor does Darwin. The Neodarwinist will point to whatever new issue comes up and retroactively adapt to the change. They won't just adapt, they RETROACTIVELY adapt, they were always right. When ID has firmer footing, which is as sure as the sun will rise, they will have "never been sold on Darwin". Darwin was not "right" necessarily, as has been trumpeted above. He MIGHT be right in the future if it's found that his lamentations about not stressing epigenetics in his OOS amount to something. Those above who claim darwin was "right" with his later in life hybrid emphasis, are you saying you already know the answers?lamarck
June 11, 2009
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Mark Frank:
if an organism develops a characteristic in the course of its life then that characteristic might be inherited.
I don't think there's any argument that organisms inherit characteristics. But this explanation seems to gloss over the part where they develop them. What explains how they develop what their offspring inherit?
If design wants to put itself forward as a theory of evolution it needs to find evidence other than the supposed improbability of one specific natural theory
There's some helpful information on this site to acquaint yourself with ID. I said that water fleas without spikes get spikes. That's neither Lamarckism nor epigenetics - it's just what water fleas do.ScottAndrews
June 11, 2009
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ScottAndrews - I guess you are talking Lamarckism not epigenetics. AS I am sure you know, Lamarck's proposal is that if an organism develops a characteristic in the course of its life then that characteristic might be inherited. If true, this could greatly accelerate the speed with which an organism can acquire useful characteristics when the environment changes. There is no requirement for design if this process works - although we may not currently understand the mechanism. More generally it shows that there are potentially different ways in which evolution can happen through natural mechanisms (and possibly others we have not even thought of). If design wants to put itself forward as a theory of evolution it needs to find evidence other than the supposed improbability of one specific natural theory - let's call it RM+NS (and do remember in the ID world "information" is defined as the improbability of the result given RM+NS - so using the presence of "information" as evidence is the same as using the improbability of RM+NS as evidence)Mark Frank
June 11, 2009
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