Uncommon Descent Serving The Intelligent Design Community

Guns facing the wrong way: Journal Nature displays deadly weakness on “science and bigotry”

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Announcing from on high that it is Against Discrimination, Nature tells us: Science cannot and should not be used to justify prejudice.  No indeed. But is there any general wish that it did? Then,

Difference between groups may therefore provide sound scientific evidence. But it’s also a blunt instrument of pseudoscience, and one used to justify actions and policies that condense claimed group differences into tools of prejudice and discrimination against individuals — witness last weekend’s violence by white supremacists in Charlottesville, Virginia, and the controversy over a Google employee’s memo on biological differences in the tastes and abilities of the sexes.

A nice touch that, to equate hapless engineer Damore’s ejection from the Goolag with white supremacist violence.

The two situations are not remotely similar. Damore discovered that on a number of subjects, evidence thoughtfully considered does not matter, however respectfully  offered. So then is irrational rage becoming an essential virtue even in science and engineering, as it has now become in (what used to be) arts disciplines?

As we have noted before, the guns are facing the wrong way. The threat to science today is post-modernism: You know, objective fact is sexist, algebra is racist, science is about the personal bummers of scientists…

If  Nature cannot deal with this  problem, fine. Someone eventually must. But everyone will remember Nature’s failure.

See also: Nature: Stuck with a battle it dare not fight, even for the soul of science. Excuse me guys but, as in so many looming strategic disasters, the guns are facing the wrong way.

Comments
rvb8:
Now do you understand why ID is not taken even remotely seriously by those who demand evidence?
ID has the evidence whereas your position does not. If your position had the evidence then ID would be falsified and yet ID is stronger than ever.ET
August 17, 2017
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Good science follows the data, and there is nothing in any data anywhere that can excuse or justify policies that discriminate against the potential of individuals or that systematically reinforce different roles and status in society for people of any gender or ethnic group.
Survival of the fittest and competition for resources. In other words evolution by means of natural selection, drift and any other blind, mindless process. If that scenario is true then that conclusion (of the paper) is not warranted.ET
August 17, 2017
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JAD, Bob is so eager to virtue signal his pals, he has no conception of how he appears to normal people. Andrewasauber
August 17, 2017
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News @ 8 - goods, so we all agree on the main point of the editorial. So why attack it? You seem to be attacking the whole article because of one point (mentioning two issues in the same sentence). john_a_designer @ 10 - I have no idea why you would think I'm a moral absolutist. I provided a quote from someone else and asked if Denyse agreed with it. Where did I tell other people what to think?Bob O'H
August 17, 2017
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Bob provided us with this quote:
Good science follows the data, and there is nothing in any data anywhere that can excuse or justify policies that discriminate against the potential of individuals or that systematically reinforce different roles and status in society for people of any gender or ethnic group.
So Bob is now a moral absolutist? Where is his basis for that? Who is Bob to tell us or anyone else what to believe and think? “Honest”* atheists admit they have no basis for morality. See the comments I made yesterday: https://uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/why-dont-atheists-trust-each-other/#comment-637914 *Of course, how do we know an atheist is being honest when he is the one who sets the standards of honesty? It’s one thing if he sets standard for himself. It’s quite another when he tries to impose his personal standards on everyone else.john_a_designer
August 17, 2017
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I like to think that I am also on the side of reason, evidence and free enquiry
Bob O'h, Is that what the voices from HGTTG tell you? Andrewasauber
August 17, 2017
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Bob O'H at 8: No one could disagree with such a poisonously bland claim as "Good science follows the data, and there is nothing in any data anywhere that can excuse or justify policies that discriminate against the potential of individuals or that systematically reinforce different roles and status in society for people of any gender or ethnic group." But what surrounded it? Mentioning the Damore case at all was disgraceful and suggests that science institutions are preparing to cave. Come on, you can do better than this.News
August 17, 2017
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News - I like to think that I am also on the side of reason, evidence and free enquiry, as (I am sure) do the editors of Nature. I haven't seen anyone suggest that Damore had anything to do with Charlotteville either (and that includes the editors at Nature). You seem to be attacking the editors on the basis of your mis-reading of their piece. I wonder if you disagree with the conclusion of the editorial:
Good science follows the data, and there is nothing in any data anywhere that can excuse or justify policies that discriminate against the potential of individuals or that systematically reinforce different roles and status in society for people of any gender or ethnic group.
Bob O'H
August 17, 2017
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Bob O'H: We are on the side of reason, evidence and free enquiry. Damore had, so far as we know, nothing to do with the murder and mayhem in Charlotteville. Accident of timing in the month of hot weather stories. You do yourself no favour by joining the pack howl and will gain no respect for it here.News
August 17, 2017
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Announcing from on high that it is Against Discrimination, Nature tells us: Science cannot and should not be used to justify prejudice. No indeed. But is there any general wish that it did?
There's a long history of doing just that (look at eugenics, for example).
A nice touch that, to equate hapless engineer Damore’s ejection from the Goolag with white supremacist violence.
I didn't read this in the same way - the two issues have similar themes (as the editorial points out), and they are clear to say what went on in both cases ("...last weekend’s violence ...", "... the controversy over ..."). More generally, I trust you've thought hard about placing UD on the same side of an issue as racists and bigots.Bob O'H
August 17, 2017
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PaV @2, a woman was murdered in Charlotsville by a known neo-nazi. 'Trump tells the truth about what happened in Charlottesville..' Ah-Huh. Now do you understand why ID is not taken even remotely seriously by those who demand evidence? It is because even when the video, sound, onlookers, and protestors say the woman was mowed down, Trump (or ID, take your pick), comes along and says, 'it all went swimmingly, no problem here, physical evidence proves nothing, Heh:).' And PaV, you believe that? You are an apt supporter of an unevidenced psudo-science position, any evidence, especially no evidence, is proof ID is real. What next? No ark found on Arrarat, therefore Noah's journey actually happened? Wait, you believe that too, don't you?rvb8
August 17, 2017
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@PaV: We are descending into the depths of irrationality. It's heartbreaking. Humanity has been invaded by alien demonic spirits, evil mind snatchers obsessed with strife, hatred, war, bloodshed and misery.ichisan
August 16, 2017
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We are descending into the depths of irrationality. Passion now replaces reason. IOW, we're on our way to hell. Trump tells the truth about what happened in Charlotsville, and is denounced and seethed at. Terry McAuliffe lies about the crowds in Charlotsville, and not a peep is heard. The media have now become the Jacobins. And it is but a matter of time before the "guillotines" are set in place. God help you if you don't think in a PC way. The Devil delights.PaV
August 16, 2017
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"The threat to science today is post-modernism..." Bingo!Truth Will Set You Free
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