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Why Does It Matter? Because Some Calculations Must Be Literally Unthinkable

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I despise Henry Kissinger. He is an evil man. I am currently reading his On China (2011), and I was reminded of just how evil he is when I read his apology for Zhou Enlai (pp. 241-43). For those who do not remember, as premier of the PPR during the tumultuous 60s and 70s, Zhou was Mao’s chief henchman. The world will never know how many people Mao killed. Estimates range from 40 to 80 million, and Zhou was at his side implementing his policies every step of the way. Of this henchman to a genocidal maniac Kissinger writes:

Surely Zhou’s methods of political survival involved lending his administrative skill to the execution of policies that he may well have found personally distasteful . . .

This makes me want to puke. What kind of sociopath uses the word “distasteful” to describe someone’s response to participation in genocide? It will come as no surprise that Kissinger reveres Machiavelli above all other theorists, and nowhere is this more plain than when he continues[in this passage Zhou is the advisor and Mao is the prince in view ]:

The advisor to the prince occasionally faces the dilemma of balancing the benefits of the ability to alter events against the possibility of exclusion, should he bring his objections to any one policy to a head. How does the ability to modify the prince’s prevailing conduct weigh against the moral onus of participation in his policies? How does one measure the element of nuance over time against the claims of absolutes in the immediate? What is the balance between the cumulative impact of moderating trends against that of a grand (and probably doomed) gesture?

How Kissinger answers these questions and his ultimate assessment of Zhou is not in doubt; he called Zhou “one of the two or three most impressive men I have ever met.” God help us. How could we have let a man who could write these things into the very highest echelons of our leadership for a period spanning over five decades?

Kissinger implies that Zhou was a reluctant participant and a moderating influence to Mao’s reign of terror. This view is hotly disputed. In his Mao Zedong and the Cultural Revolution, for example, Angang Hu argues that Zhou’s support, far from moderating the Cultural Revolution, kept it going, and that Zhou was Mao’s enabler, not his moderator.

But let us set that argument aside, because ultimately it is morally irrelevant. Assume for the sake of argument that there is some support for the proposition that Hermann Göring was a moderating influence to the most terrible excesses of the Third Reich. If Hitler had conquered Europe, would it have been appropriate for an American statesman to later praise Hermann Göring and even sympathize with him for the terrible burden of “weighing nuance against absolutes” that he had to bear. I admit the analogy is not quite apt, because Mao killed tens of millions more people than Hitler did. Still, the very idea is absurd.

The “dilemma” Kissinger poses is a false dilemma. The kinds of calculations Kissinger has in mind are morally repugnant. Indeed, they should be unthinkable. Moreover, the measuring to which Kissinger alludes is not only morally loathsome; it is also self-referentially incoherent. It is in the very nature of “absolutes” that they cannot be “measured” or “balanced” against anything else (and most especially against “nuance,” whatever that means).

Absolutes admit no calculation. When faced with the choice of whether to engage in formal cooperation with evil of unspeakable proportions, the only moral choice is to refuse to cooperate. Let us say for the sake of argument that Zhou was in fact given the choice of being Mao’s henchman, in which case “only” 60 million people would die, and refusing to be his henchman, in which case 65 million people would die. Still, the only moral choice was for him to refuse to cooperate with Mao’s evil even if more people (including Zhou himself) would die.

This is not a “train switch” scenario. Moral philosopher’s love to talk about the hapless schmo standing at a train switch. An unstoppable runaway train is coming down the track. If the schmo lets it stay on its present track, 100 people will get run over and die. If he pulls the switch and shunts the train to another track, only 50 people will die. The obvious answer to this dilemma is to pull the switch. If death is inevitable due to uncontrollable forces of nature (in this case the forces of gravity and inertia), the only moral choice is the one that leads to the fewest deaths.

How is this different from Zhou’s non-dilemma? The answer is that the Cultural Revolution was not inevitable. It resulted from the conscious choices of moral agents. If all moral agents had refused to participate, not a single person would have died, because the CR would never have happened.

Some of my readers might remember the movie Sophie’s Choice (or the novel of the same name). The eponymous choice of the movie occurred upon Sophie’s arrival at Auschwitz. A guard forced her to choose which one of her two children would be gassed and which would proceed to the labor camp. If she refused to choose, both children would be killed. What was Sophie to do? Is it not the moral choice to choose one of the children to die so that at least one may live? Sophie chooses her son to live and her daughter to die. Sophie’s choice was profoundly immoral. The only moral choice is to refuse to choose even if this means both children must die. By choosing, Sophie entered into formal cooperation with the guard’s evil. And it is always evil to engage in formal cooperation with evil. Some calculations must be unthinkable. One must never engage in profound evil even if one could somehow attempt to justify it with Kissinger’s balancing act. Fiat justitia ruat caelum (“Let justice be done though the heavens fall”)

What does this have to do with Zhou? Just this. Zhou’s choice was Sophie’s choice writ large.

Why does this all matter? I was prompted to write this post by an exchange with Mark Frank.

I wrote:

You know for a certain fact that torturing an infant for personal pleasure is evil at all places, at all times, for all people.

Mark replied:

I disagree. I don’t believe you know moral judgments as “facts” so I would say that as it stands it is false.

Mark added:

I stressed that it was because I don’t regard moral judgments as facts . . . I think they are opinions not facts.

Finally, Mark said:

I don’t know the innermost psyche of the Incas who performed child sacrifices but it seems quite possible they did it for personal pleasure and thought it was morally OK.

No Mark. You are wrong. Hugely, monstrously, horribly wrong.

It absolutely must be an objective fact that torturing an infant for personal pleasure is evil at all places, at all times, for all people or it is not a fact at all. It is a binary question. Yes/No. The only way the proposition can ever be true is if it is indeed an objective fact. The very act of suggesting that the issue is a matter of opinion as opposed to objective fact is immoral because it renders the proposition false. In other words, to even say that it is not unthinkable for the proposition to be untrue is profoundly immoral, because it is equivalent to saying the proposition is false.

Therefore, even assuming for the sake of argument that some Inca thought it was OK to torture infants for pleasure, it does not follow that his opinion on the subject is entitled to any weight whatsoever. Would we credit our hapless Inca’s views if his opinion were that 1+1=3? Of course, not. When the Inca is wrong about objective fact, we must not hesitate to reject his views categorically even if someone might accuse us of being “intolerant.” Error has no rights. The only moral position is to say that it is literally unthinkable for the proposition to ever be false.

As Zhoe’s non-dilemma was not a matter of calculation but of simple courage to do the only right thing, so too this proposition can never be a matter that could possibly vary due to circumstance, calculation or opinion. It is always true or it is never true.

It is immoral to say that the proposition “torturing an infant for personal pleasure is evil at all places, at all times, for all people” is up for grabs. Why is it evil? Because someone might believe you of course! By saying this you have undermined the “unthinkable-ness” of the converse of the proposition. And when you do that, you have opened a door that must always remain shut.

Comments
FG #169 That's a very nice and fair analysis of this frustrating circular debate.Mark Frank
February 7, 2015
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Brent  
If I am teaching a student some equation and the student gives an answer that I don’t THINK is right, but I’m not sure either, is it fair for me to mark the student’s answer as wrong before I verify? And if I am not able to verify, am I then justified in insisting that the student is wrong?
  I didn’t bother answering this because I couldn’t see its relevance to our debate. My (subjective!) opinion is you are not justified. That’s because it is mathematics and there is an objective right answer.  As a subjectivist I believe there is no single definitive right answer to moral questions - just opinions which can be held more or less firmly. The rub being that on moral matters mutually incompatible action results from the judgement so you can’t just agree to differ (If you think homosexuality is wrong and I think it is morally permissible then you are going to try to stop it and I am going to try to allow it). A better analogy would be that the teacher proposes extending the lesson for 10 minutes and the student disagrees.Mark Frank
February 7, 2015
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Mark Frank @199, Actually, it is you who are confused. When SB says, "According to your philosophy, if a subjectivist believes that it is moral for him to torture babies, then it is, by your standard, moral for him," you immediately jump to the fact that you don't believe it is moral for him because you personally believe it to be morally wrong conduct. But SB is saying, rightly, that, according to your philosophy which states that morality is subjective to each individual, you are both implicitly and, often, explicitly, saying that it is right for him in that he only has his own personal moral compass to consult with. When you are confronted you jump between two ideas of "right for him" to suit your argument. You are indeed, even emphatically, saying, "it is right for him and it is wrong for him." Again, drop the pretense about how your idea of morality is as robust as the objectivist and your problem immediately goes away. The new problem would be, then, that even you start to see Barry's monster in your bathroom mirror.Brent
February 6, 2015
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SB  
Is that they way you answer a refutation, by changing the subject? Your analogy is not properly set up in terms of your philosophy.
I was trying to explain something to you by using an analogy. I appear to have failed.
If her features are beautiful to her, then they are beautiful to her. It is, therefore a contradiction to say that you believe her features are not beautiful to her.
But I am not. I am saying they are beautiful to me and not beautiful to her.
Why not stay with the ethics? According to your philosophy, if a subjectivist believes that it is moral for him to torture babies, then it is, by your standard, moral for him. When, therefore, you say that torturing babies is immoral for everyone, including the subjectivist for whom it is moral, you are contradicting your own subjectivist standards. You are saying that it is moral for him and not moral for him. As I keep telling you, subjectivism is irrational. It contradicts itself just as surely as you are contradicting yourself.
You are confusing the person making the judgement with the person who is the object of the judgement. When I say torturing babies is immoral for everyone, “everyone” refers to the people doing the torturing not the people making the judgement. I am the person making the judgement. Likewise some nutter might decide it is moral for everyone to torture babies. He would be the one making the judgement and “everyone” (including himself) would be the object of the judgement. There is a severe disagreement between us but no contradiction in the concept of morality. Do I really have to explain this? It is elementary logic.Mark Frank
February 6, 2015
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I think the creationists are just as good at dodging questions. I asked Brent to answer his own question ... got a dodge. I asked Barry to answer his ... got edited out. UDEditors: Graham2, yes, you evade and obfuscate and try to turn the table. But you don't reflect on the poverty of your response. Sad.Graham2
February 6, 2015
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You guys must be competing to see who can tally the highest non-answer/evade count. Could be a pretty close race.Brent
February 6, 2015
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I think Brent is asking how can we assume to persuade others when we are aware of the fallibility of our own beliefs. Jeez, we do this all the time, eg: we advise our children to avoid drugs. What on earth is the problem ?Graham2
February 6, 2015
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Brent:
The subjectivist’s have the non-answer answer down pat.
Figured that out did you? Yes, when an answer pins down their irrationality they will dance around it; answer questions you did not ask; try to change the subject; ask how you would answer it -- anything other than face the poverty and intellectual bankruptcy of their worldview. One would think it would give them pause about holding a worldview that compels them to dance like that. But it doesn't. It's really an amazing thing to watch, but I've seen it countless times.Barry Arrington
February 6, 2015
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Brent
No thanks, Graham2. I’ll respectfully wait for fG and Mark Frank to reply so I can see if they are able to more artfully dodge such an easy question as you all have. Should be fun.
Brent, I did answer your question. In my subjectivist opinion you acted dishonestly when you first started teaching a student when you knew you didn't understand the material. Of course the whole affair is unfair to the student you (the rhetorical you in this case) committed fraud by framing yourself as being competent to teach the material when you were not..franklin
February 6, 2015
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No thanks, Graham2. I'll respectfully wait for fG and Mark Frank to reply so I can see if they are able to more artfully dodge such an easy question as you all have. Should be fun.Brent
February 6, 2015
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Brent: Then why not put us out of our misery ... what is your answer ?Graham2
February 6, 2015
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Brent @ 190 That is your subjective view.Me_Think
February 6, 2015
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The subjectivist's have the non-answer answer down pat.Brent
February 6, 2015
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Brent @ 187 If there is a book which gives the correct answer with proof, then you can verify, but if there is no such book, the student's answer is as good as your answer. However if you are teaching an equation, it should have a proof. May be you are teaching CSI formula (which has no proof) , in which case I am inclined to agree with the student's answer!Me_Think
February 6, 2015
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Brent
If I am teaching a student some equation and the student gives an answer that I don’t THINK is right, but I’m not sure either, is it fair for me to mark the student’s answer as wrong before I verify? And if I am not able to verify, am I then justified in insisting that the student is wrong?
I would say that you shouldn't be teaching the student if you aren't familiar with the material in sufficient depth that you aren't befuddled by the math you are supposed to be teaching. I would try another example and see how that works.franklin
February 6, 2015
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Great! I don't ask anything remotely like the difficult 'trolley problem'; this one is NOT difficult. I don't need to be told "lots of questions are not 'yes/no'; this question IS. I would just like to be told whether your answer, explicitly stated by me to be YOUR OWN subjective answer (for crying out loud), is either yes or no. You avoid the question at all costs by answering what I haven't asked. Do you not think it is obvious that you have been caught out?Brent
February 6, 2015
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No, Brent. Its not a simple 'yes/no' question. Lots of questions are not 'yes/no'. The trolley problem is famous for this, thats why its so well known. If there was a simple answer, it would have been provided long ago, and we wouldn't have a 'trolley problem'. Regarding your question, If a teacher cant mark the answers to a test, then the teacher is unqualified, and shouldnt be doing it. Its not a moral question, its a simple administrative one.Graham2
February 6, 2015
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Graham2, No! I'm asking for the subjectivist answer. What about "your own subjective morality" don't you understand? I'm asking for the answer from within your own framework. It's a profoundly simple yes/no question.Brent
February 6, 2015
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Brent: You are supposing that all moral dilemmas must have an answer. Im guessing that this is a direct result of your assumption that there exists an objective standard that we can consult, and come up with a definite answer every time. Some moral dilemmas (most ? all?) simply don't have an answer. That's why the world is a messy place, and why Sophies choice, the trolley problem etc etc etc have been argued about forever. Its why judges 'judge'. The answer to your question is that the teacher just has to muddle through. Sorry, the universe doesn't have nice pat answers for you.Graham2
February 6, 2015
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fG and Mark Frank, I'm still giving you the benefit of the doubt here, but it is a bit concerning that you haven't answered my question.
If I am teaching a student some equation and the student gives an answer that I don’t THINK is right, but I’m not sure either, is it fair for me to mark the student’s answer as wrong before I verify? And if I am not able to verify, am I then justified in insisting that the student is wrong? Again: Is it, according to your own subjective morality, moral to insist that one IS wrong when you don’t know if they are wrong, even if privately you strongly believe they are?
fG, you said:
By now these discussions are clearly going round in circles. To step back a little, I notice a couple of things: - Objectivists find it extremely hard to think like subjectivists, even briefly and for the sake of argument. Time after time they attempt to ‘catch’ the subjectivists by making references to what the ‘real’ moral answers are. They seemingly cannot understand that this is literally a meaningless question if morality is subjective, in the same way that it is a meaningless question if, say, Picasso’s ‘Guernica’ is really a beautiful painting or not. Why is this so hard?
fG, this appears to me to be a cop-out. SB, SA, and myself are not smuggling in objectivism to show subjectivism wrong. We are showing you that it is internally inconsistent even by your own standards of morality, and it will ever hopelessly be such unless and until you drop the attempt to dress it up and make it seem as robust as an objective moral standard. Please do not, now, go off on a tangent about "nobody can show me the objective standard to which we all agree" misdirect. That may be a point to be gotten to, but for now, you appear to have no way to be internally consistent with your own moral standards. That's what's on the table. Please then: If I am teaching a student some equation and the student gives an answer that I don’t THINK is right, but I’m not sure either, is it fair for me to mark the student’s answer as wrong before I verify? And if I am not able to verify, am I then justified in insisting that the student is wrong? Again: Is it, according to your own subjective morality, moral to insist that one IS wrong when you don’t know if they are wrong, even if privately you strongly believe they are?Brent
February 6, 2015
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Silver Asiatic @180. Yes, the contradiction is clear.
He determined what is morally good based on the ultimate authority – himself.
Precisely.StephenB
February 6, 2015
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Mark Frank
If I say a girl is beautiful and she says she is not is there a contradiction or just a difference of opinion? It is the same with ethics.
Is that they way you answer a refutation, by changing the subject? Your analogy is not properly set up in terms of your philosophy. If her features are beautiful to her, then they are beautiful to her. It is, therefore a contradiction to say that you believe her features are not beautiful to her. Why not stay with the ethics? According to your philosophy, if a subjectivist believes that it is moral for him to torture babies, then it is, by your standard, moral for him. When, therefore, you say that torturing babies is immoral for everyone, including the subjectivist for whom it is moral, you are contradicting your own subjectivist standards. You are saying that it is moral for him and not moral for him. As I keep telling you, subjectivism is irrational. It contradicts itself just as surely as you are contradicting yourself.StephenB
February 6, 2015
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MF
If I say a girl is beautiful and she says she is not is there a contradiction or just a difference of opinion?
If a girl says she thinks she is not beautiful, and you say she does think she is beautiful, there is a contradiction. If a subjectivist decides X is morally good for him, it is, in fact good for him (within subjectivism). If another subjectivist says X is not morally good for him, there is a contradiction. He determined what is morally good based on the ultimate authority - himself.Silver Asiatic
February 6, 2015
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SB If I say a girl is beautiful and she says she is not is there a contradiction or just a difference of opinion? It is the same with ethics.Mark Frank
February 6, 2015
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174 FG Ok, I don't see it that way but I understand.Silver Asiatic
February 6, 2015
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hrun True, my view of objective morality conflicts with that. I believe some people mean by "objective morality" the same as "objectively true, correct morality". For me, I believe the term "objective moral code" refers to several codes which are objective in nature and which can be evaluated as better or worse based on their authority. Aristotle's code of virtue Catholic Moral Norms Orthodox Jewish Morality Stoicism The Way of Shinto Universal norms accessed by conscience (natural law) among many others are objective moral codes Islamic, objective moral codes reference the prophet Muhammad (so ultimately an understanding of God) and the Koran as the source of authority.Silver Asiatic
February 6, 2015
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StephenB: The contradiction is obvious. It can’t be both right for him and wrong for him. faded glory
The solution is simple: he considers it right for him, and I consider it wrong for him.
That doesn't help you. According to subjectivism, which is your standard, he determines the rightness or the wrongness of the act. He has determined that it is right. If, therefore, you say that you believe his act is wrong for him, you are contradicting yourself, since you have also said that you believe that subjectivism determines that it is right for him. It is clear contradiction. You cannot escape it.StephenB
February 6, 2015
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Re #173: This view of objectivism also seems to clash with others here. Check out for example #48 from StephenB in this very thread.hrun0815
February 6, 2015
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SA, You are drawing the line between subjective and objective morality somewhere else than I am, so we are talking past each other. I see no point in continuing this conversation, no offense meant. fGfaded_Glory
February 6, 2015
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my standard applies to everybody in the world,
If so, then yours is an objective standard. Everyone in the world would have access to it. They would conform to an external standard (your standard), not their own individual standard. That's not subjectivism.
when it comes to me making judgements. his standard applies to everybody in the world, when it comes to him making judgements.
A subjective standard applies to the individual. What the individual decides as morally good, is morally good for that individual. In subjectivism, an external, objective standard cannot be applied to other individuals. That would conflict with subjectivism.
By omitting this specification, you are unwittingly assuming there is a single standard – this is where you bring in objectivism.
An objective code would apply to everyone - as you said your code does. So, you're not talking about subjectivism. A subjective code applies only to the individual. If your code applies to everyone, then that's objective - external, independent of the individual. Everyone has to comply with your code (how would they even know what your code is though?). That's objective morality. We observe a code, external to the individual and conform to it. The objective code can be based on philosophical constructs or religious revelation (among other things), but the authority for that code is not in the individual. In your case, applying your code to the whole world makes you the moral authority for everyone. That's perfectly fine (as far as it goes) but it's not subjectivism.Silver Asiatic
February 6, 2015
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