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UD Live Event from Nov 3, US Election cont’d: BBC — yes the BEEB — on BLM’s Marxist founders, “[We] fought to change history and we won”

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Okay, we are looking at the victory lap being taken (a bit prematurely, methinks) by the BLM trio of marxist founders. Here is BEEB:

Black Lives Matter founders: We fought to change history and we won

Published14 hours ago

The year 2020 will be remembered for a lot of things – not least the rise of the Black Lives Matter movement around the world.

The organisation has led huge street rallies and high-profile campaigns against racism and police brutality.

Now the three women who founded the movement have told the BBC they believe it has transformed politics.

“Black people alongside our allies stood up to change the course of history and we won,” said Alicia Garza.

Garza and her BLM co-founders, Patrisse Cullors and Opal Tometi, spoke as part of the BBC 100 Women Masterclass 2020, a digital live event of masterclasses, big interviews and guests on 30 November.

If you doubted that this is a Marxism-driven, colour-culture revolution push using Critical Race Theory as key ideological wedge, there you have it from the horses’ mouths.

In short, 4th Gen War:

. . . based on colour/cultural revolution insurgency, including dirty form McFaul programme election manipulation:

Okie, Dec 17, I clip from 1333 below, a focal point:

Just remember, given the realities of 4th gen war, there is now no hard border — no specific, momentous declaratory threshold — between

a: information and influence operations [including, too often “education”];

b: politics, law and power balances stratagems, and

c: full bore high kinetics war.

The intent of all three in ruthless hands, subjugation under a new lawless oligarchy, demands that we understand that tri-polar spectrum, and that we determine to stand for a civilisation of truth, right, honour and liberty in the face of its most insidious, treacherous enemies.

H’mm, Dec 15, let’s add in the Overton Window (with hints of Plato’s Parable of the Cave), to help us understand political/policy thinking in light of BATNA points:

Where, we need to ponder the change challenge:

. . . and the Mountains/pillars of influence mapping model:

Where are we drifting to, why and how?

Now, let us continue the already in progress [for four weeks!] live event . . . from here.

First U/D, the Arizona hearing when I can get it up.

Meanwhile, ponder just what is being said now, and what it implies beyond how they would wish it spun, given their admitted Marxism. BREAKING, CONTINUING (AFTER FOUR WEEKS) . . .

U/D1: Arizona hearings:

https://youtu.be/QfC2T7UpxkI

U/D2: Ms Powell with Mr Dobbs on state of play, a case in VA on the table. Also, even as a restraining order was being debated in a see-saw back-forth, in Fulton County, a Server was taken by a technician on excuse of software update and has disappeared from chain of custody. From CA, a tape has been forwarded to Ms Powell and reveals 550 votes from 270 people, an indication of algorithmic manipulation:

Ms Powell, the entire FBI and Dept of Justice need to be hosed out with Chlorox and firehoses.

F/N: Was the Electoral College simply a way to entrench slavery — merely ramshackle defence of slavery? A discussion on republic vs direct instant effect democracy:

[PREDICTABLY, SADLY, CENSORED]

U/D2, Dec 2, hearings in MI:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZXkAv7yKgw

U/D3, Dec 2: HT BA77, we now have chain of custody on ballots going into PA by the trailer-load. The ballots seen coming in at wee hours were in similar containers:

U/D4, Dec 2: Spykman’s framework of heartland, rimland and the outer crescent of maritime Islands and continents:

This is the framework for geostrategic analysis. Desperately compressed, c 1904 Mackinder identified that rail, telegraph, telephone etc allowed mobilisation of continental resources in the heart of the Eurasian landmass that would counterweight the maritime powers, i.e. Britain with the US coming up behind. C20 can be viewed as the history of two German grabs and one Russian one, failed. Rimlands are a belt between, coast and near hinterlands. The outer arc is where maritime power and sea trade dominate. Thus, the chief maritime power guarantees global stability.

I have argued as follows c April 2016, the current US 4th gen civil war with global entanglement is a playing out of this picture. Notice the Iranian push, vulture no. 3. No Ko is a wannabe:

U/D5, Dec 2, Ordinary people have their say (and often get smeared by the media dominant narrative — a comment):

Hannity shows ordinary witnesses.Twitter so no YT link.

U/D6, Dec 4: Here is the Oct 2016 video of independent body blackbox voting dot org:

Note, from commented screen captures:

U/D7, Mr Giuliani requests disciplinary action for defamation violation of parliamentary privilege, regarding dismissal of evidence and attacking his professional integrity:

In the course of this he corrects widespread talking points: 3 cases brought not the 39 being talked about. 2,000 affidavits under penalty of law, and we know now of the video of four suitcases of ballots counted after scrutineers were dismissed, being told that counting was over for the night, in GA.

The member signalling intent to dox and harass a witness by demanding even her maiden name should take due note.

U/D8, Dec 5: Smoking gun? (Video here.) The midnight, unsupervised ballot counting in GA — though strictly, the count from its outset with scrutineers corralled, was invalid:

U/D9, Dec 7, concerns that Dominion machines have flipped votes and on a test run a sequestered machine has continued to do so:

Cf. Expert testimony:

https://youtu.be/ijtaV5Twf6o

Cybersecurity expert, Russell Ramsland is speaking under the umbrella of his affidavit.

U/D, Dec 10, Lou Dobbs on the “Russian intelligence”/ “conspiracy theory” dismissive talking points on Mr Hunter Biden (with implications that his chief asset on offer was access) and Ms Powell’s unleashing of the Kracken:

https://youtu.be/IQjjjrR9QUY

[PREDICTABLY, CENSORED]

U/D11, Dec 11: Here is a framework for addressing media spin and gaslighting, agit-prop etc:

As it is such a glaring example on what was said in the “fine people” remarks, and as Sandy brought it up, let me add this correction from the record . . . yes, transcript, on Charlottesville:

U/D13, Dec 12, here is a backgrounder on Alcibiades which also gives a useful survey of the Peloponnesian war. One hopes, this will not be censored:

U/D14, Dec 12 HT BA77, Dominion demonstrations, part 1:

. . . and part 2:

5:04 on in this part 2 shows scanning in then voting a BLANK ballot, which the operator says “totally bothers me.”

She demonstrates also how adjudicated ballots can be voted.

We separately know that the scanner can mark ballots, sold as a feature for the visually impaired.

In short there is now no responsible doubt that the sort of manipulation discussed is a real capability — means. Frustration of scrutineering creates opportunity and decisively undermines integrity of the election vote counts. Motive is easy, power in the midst of a 4th Gen Civil war, in the form of a colour-culture revolution push, theme colour black. The testimony of many witnesses, statistical red flags etc point to actual occurrence, but recall, this is secondary. The primary issue is massive injection of effectively uncontrolled mail in ballots with 3rd party ballot harvesting and similar frustration of scrutineering implying dubious chain of custody.

All of this then points to the 26 years of history going back to the PA case of 1994 and through the exposure of election gadgetry since the early 2000’s, then rejections by CA and TX as well as links to Venezuela and more.

I strongly suggest, download the videos for yourself before they vanish into the censorship black hole.

U/D15: Hima’s testimony, something needs to be fixed here:

U/D16, Dec 13: I think it is profitable to look at a backgrounder on Mountains/pillars of influence, dominant worldviews and agendas, the change challenge and the crooked yardstick effect. First, the seven mountains, a mapping model for dealing with a corrupt culture as a remnant of soundness under God (originally, Schaeffer et al, 1970’s):

Linked, the Machiavelli change-timing challenge:

Underlying problem: crooked yardsticks vs plumb-lines:

Deeper background, a sounder view on political spectrum:

Further deeper understanding of an en-darkened civilisation, adapting Schaeffer’s vision:

Our civilisation is at obvious kairos, a hinge of history, with major dangers and opportunities. It is time to be good people of the remnant in the face of an Ac 27 storm.

U/D17, Dec 14, Ms Powell on the state of the American Courts and Republic on a date that most likely will live in infamy:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKfK8jkSwPA

(Has this ALREADY been censored?)

Lou Dobbs with Ms Powell:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGEmSMLgVeY

U/D18, Dec 16: A summary of the lesson of 1876/77, on the price paid for a devil’s bargain that swallowed electoral fraud:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HbSgCpPors

Yes, the Democrats refused to acknowledge fraud and a devil’s bargain was struck over 20 electors that stopped Reconstruction in a way that opened up the abuses that lingered to the 1960’s.

U/D19, Dec 19: a summary of red flags from the Navarro Report, so we can see in the context of being an evidence summary:

U/D20: The “Solar Winds” Cyber attack, apparently in progress for 6 months, with direct entanglement with the tainted election (cf. 17:00 on):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=869&v=3T9VDichLPM&feature=youtu.be

[predictably, poof!]

China is named, along with Iran and North Korea. As well as, of course, Russia having been widely deemed suspect no. 1. This is an obvious example of an information-influence operation as act of 4G war, connecting the local civil conflict in the US to the global conflict, de facto WW4. Forbes comments:

The recently discovered cyber attacks against numerous U.S. government departments and  thousands of public and private sector entities around the world, via a compromise of SolarWinds software, underscore the risks associated with third party vendors and raise questions about liability. The attacks were allegedly perpetrated by Russia and were highly sophisticated . . . .

The attackers compromised the software “signature” of SolarWinds’s Orion network monitoring software and distributed malware as a software update. Public and private encryption keys are used to “sign” software. A software update is “signed” using an encryption algorithm and the developer’s private key, which creates a hash “signature.”  This “signature” is validated by the receiver of the software update by using the sender’s public key. The signature process assures the integrity of the update and instills trust in users of the software. 

In a December 14 SEC filing, SolarWinds said that of its more than 300,000 customers, they believed that less than 18,000 entities may have downloaded the Orion update during the March-June 2020 timeframe [–> the 6 months timeline], which likely included the malware. The malware operated stealthily and exfiltrated valuable intellectual property, confidential and proprietary data, emails, and other valuable information from victims’ systems. It was unknown until prominent cybersecurity firm FireEye, also a victim of the attacks, discovered the malware and reported on the attacks on December 13, 2020.

According to FireEye, once installed in a system, the malware remained quiet for a couple of weeks and then masqueraded as the Orion Improvement Program protocol. It stored data from its internal activities within actual SolarWinds files on the system, thereby making its detection all the more difficult.  The malware had highly credentialed access to the system and could disable system services, reboot machines, exfiltrate data, execute files, change system configurations, and perform actions usually taken by a highly privileged system administrator.

That sounds rather familiar, and illustrates what happens if a trusted supplier is compromised. Gen Flynn’s remarks at 16:05 on are worth transcribing:

When we talk about our election security . . . I think this is all part of it, because there is a relationship between this solar winds attack; which has basically penetrated our entire critical infrastructure as well as our election security. So we have to look at everything we’re doing . . . okay with all of the egregious behaviour that we’ve seen on our election security we cannot stand for foreign influence, which we have direct evidence of foreign influence. We also have direct evidence now from other countries, from other foreign partners who have evidence.

In fact they were watching the attacks on our election system, on our election process on the 3rd of November and they are willing to provide that directly to the President.

So we now have that evidence and have received that today. It’s very important.

So there are foreign partners and allies that are willing to help us with our election security and this Solar Winds system is really really dangerous and more has to be done.

The likely allies obviously include Israel, likely Japan, South Korea, Taiwan and possibly Australia given the focus on China.

Again, we are back to whose report do you believe, why.

U/D21, Dec 23: It was not possible to find the 1984 Movie through a Google search (yes, they are that unconscious of the irony) but DDG showed it, here is a colour version at YT, this may be pretty important holiday viewing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl4kt4kUE88

If that gets purged, here is Web Archive.

U/D22, Dec 28: Understand the anger of the perpetually manipulated:

One does not have to endorse the above across the board to see that it has a telling point or two about the “Uniparty” and the issue of fundamentally unaccountable elites, leading a manipulated march of folly. Here, the lesson of Ac 27 is again all too relevant.

U/D23: A Canadian Lawyer and an American Lawyer discuss — as an example — the dismissal of the Wisconsin care; an example of how the election fraud concerns are being sidelined:

U/D24, Jan 3, what the Ukrainians have to say about corruption and investigation, through an Interfax press conference. Such needs to be soberly addressed in detail:

Comments
DiEb you claim, basically, that even though Trump is 3 times more popular than Biden, that Biden could still pull off his amazing record smashing vote tally if you somehow combine his total with Obama, or some combination thereof. Yet your hypothesis fails the smell test, Biden underperformed Obama (and Clinton) in total counties won,,, in fact he won "a record low" 17 percent of counties,,,
Reasons why the 2020 presidential election is deeply puzzling If only cranks find the tabulations strange, put me down as a crank Patrick Basham Excerpt: We are told that Biden won more votes nationally than any presidential candidate in history. But he won a record low of 17 percent of counties; he only won 524 counties, as opposed to the 873 counties Obama won in 2008. Yet, Biden somehow outdid Obama in total votes.,,, https://spectator.us/reasons-why-the-2020-presidential-election-is-deeply-puzzling/ video - He only won 1/6th of all counties, and failed to outperform 2016 in the largest counties, yet he won millions more votes than Trump, HRC or Obama? https://twitter.com/CortesSteve/status/1333481365749329920?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1333481365749329920%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thegatewaypundit.com%2F2020%2F11%2Frigged-election-biden-won-477-counties-vs-obama-won-689-2012-yet-biden-magically-gained-13-million-votes-obama%2F
Your hypothesis simply does not add up. Biden also lost support in a number of key demographics compared to Obama and HRC
Biden outperformed Obama…but underperformed Hillary Clinton? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UK0VkFMkeUc&feature=youtu.be 5 More Ways Joe Biden Magically Outperformed Election Norms Surely the journalist class should be intrigued by the historic implausibility of Joe Biden’s victory. That they are not is curious, to say the least. https://thefederalist.com/2020/11/23/5-more-ways-joe-biden-magically-outperformed-election-norms/
i.e. If there was a 'carry over effect' for Biden from Obama, to explain the record smashing vote tally that Biden received (despite lagging Trump in overall popularity by a wide margin), then it should have been a more consistent 'carry over effect' across the entire country, in counties that Obama (and Clinton) had previously won,,, yet that is not what we see,,,bornagain77
December 29, 2020
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KF, Follow-up: Nevermind. I was able to update the images. Thanks anyway. HeKSHeKS
December 29, 2020
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Seversky #1181 "If you can’t show fraud in 60 lawsuits filed then it probably isn’t there." The court cases have been dismissed on procedural grounds like Standing, Latches, etc., not on merits. Very few of them have even been associated with the Trump campaign and they haven't had evidentiary hearings. The one exception might be Nevada, but it's hardly even a real exception because, as I recall, they didn't allow for oral arguments, limited the number of affidavits that could be submitted, and focused primarily on voting machines rather than the more concrete examples of fraud that were uncovered. If you're basing your opinion on whether or not there was fraud on the way the court findings have been represented in the media, you're being misled. And I'll just add that I'm an apolitical Canadian, so I have no dog in this hunt other than trying to be aware of reality. Take care, HeKSHeKS
December 29, 2020
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Hey KF, Hope you're doing well. I haven't been around in a while but I have a totally off-topic question for you. I was discussing my argument against an infinite past (https://uncommondescent.com/philosophy/re-the-viability-of-an-infinite-past/) with someone off-site and tried to point them to my diagrams posted here but they aren't showing. Any idea why? Take care, HeKSHeKS
December 29, 2020
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Bornagain77/1808
Just released Gallup poll of most admired man in America, Trump tops the list, and is more admired than Obama. Three times more admired than Biden! Yet Biden supposedly *won the record smashing number of votes (81 million) for any presidential candidate ever?
What you didn't mention , as usual...
Americans are most likely to name President Donald Trump and Michelle Obama as most admired man and woman in 2020. Trump tied former President Barack Obama for the honor last year but edged out his predecessor this year. Trump's first-place finish ends a 12-year run as most admired man for Obama, tied with Dwight Eisenhower for the most ever. [My emphasis]
[…]
When the sitting president is not the top choice, it is usually because he is unpopular politically. That was the case in 2017 and 2018 when Trump had 36% and 40% approval ratings, respectively, and finished second to Obama as most admired man.
And, yes, in the poll which really counts, Biden won by 81 million to 74 million. If you can't show fraud in 60 lawsuits filed then it probably isn't there.Seversky
December 29, 2020
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BA77 @1808: Have a look at the details: "combined first and second mentions; rankings based on total number of responses" Who of those who mentioned Obama, Biden, Sanders or Dr. Fauci in first or second place did vote for Trump?DiEb
December 29, 2020
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Legal fight in Georgia. Stacey Abrams sister ruled in her favor.
Georgia judge, Stacey Abrams' sister, rules against voter purge before Senate runoffs
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/georgia-judge-stacey-abrams-sister-wont-recuse-election-suit-rules-against-voter-purge-before-runoffsjerry
December 29, 2020
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Just released Gallup poll of most admired man in America, Trump tops the list, and is more admired than Obama. Three times more admired than Biden! Yet Biden supposedly *won the record smashing number of votes (81 million) for any presidential candidate ever? Most Admired Man, 2020 What man that you have heard or read about, living today in any part of the world, do you admire most? -------------- % Mentioning ----- Number of top 10 finishes Donald Trump-----18---------- 10 Barack Obama--15------------ 15 Joe Biden--------- 6------------2 Dr. Anthony Fauci- 3 --------- 1 Pope Francis-------2 -------8 Elon Musk-------------1-------4 Bernie Sanders---- 1 -------6 Bill Gates----------1 -------21 LeBron James-----1 ------1 Dalai Lama----------1----- 11 Combined first and second mentions; rankings based on total number of responses GALLUP, DEC. 1-17, 2020 https://news.gallup.com/poll/328193/donald-trump-michelle-obama-admired-2020.aspxbornagain77
December 29, 2020
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DiEb, I have to honestly admit that the statistics that he used for Pennsylvania escape me.
Indeed, my comment in #1802 was about Pennsylvania (6% Hispanics), not Ohio (4% Hispanics). As a foreigner, I used Ohio because it is easier to spell!DiEb
December 29, 2020
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DiEb, I have to honestly admit that the statistics that he used for Pennsylvania escape me. But what I do know for sure about Pennsylvania is this piece of news that came out yesterday.
BREAKING: Pennsylvania Certified Results for President Are Found in Error – The Error Is Twice the Size of the Difference Between Candidates By Joe Hoft December 28, 2020 ,,,, What a mess. Republican State Representative Russ Diamond uncovered and reported today that the results for President are way off in Pennsylvania. More ballots were cast than people voted by more than 200,000 votes.,,,, The group of Republican Representatives released this message: HARRISBURG – A group of state lawmakers performing extensive analysis of election data today revealed troubling discrepancies between the numbers of total votes counted and total number of voters who voted in the 2020 General Election, and as a result are questioning how the results of the presidential election could possibly have been certified by Secretary of the Commonwealth Kathy Boockvar and Governor Tom Wolf. These findings are in addition to prior concerns regarding actions by the Supreme Court of Pennsylvania, the Secretary, and others impacting the conduct of the election. A comparison of official county election results to the total number of voters who voted on November 3, 2020 as recorded by the Department of State shows that 6,962,607 total ballots were reported as being cast, while DoS/SURE system records indicate that only 6,760,230 total voters actually voted. Among the 6,962,607 total ballots cast, 6,931,060 total votes were counted in the presidential race, including all three candidates on the ballot and write-in candidates. The difference of 202,377 more votes cast than voters voting, together with the 31,547 over- and under-votes in the presidential race, adds up to an alarming discrepancy of 170,830 votes, which is more than twice the reported statewide difference between the two major candidates for President of the United States. On November 24, 2020, Boockvar certified election results, and Wolf issued a certificate of ascertainment of presidential electors, stating that Vice President Joe Biden received 80,555 more votes than President Donald Trump. https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/12/breaking-pennsylvania-certified-results-president-found-error-error-twice-size-difference-candidates/
bornagain77
December 29, 2020
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@KF: Certainly interesting, but a tiny caveat: Shakespeare had no problem to create an Italian feeling in Romeo & Juliet. The fact that he did not name his play Paul & Mary does not mean that it really happened....DiEb
December 29, 2020
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DiEb, statistical patterns on name frequencies can go both ways. Similarly, I note that too good a fit to statistical models can also be a tell. IIRC, that is part of what tripped up Cyril Burt in the studies on IQ. Here is a case from NT studies that gives an idea of what is at stake:
https://crossexamined.org/are-the-gospels-based-on-eyewitness-testimony-the-test-of-personal-names/ Saturday, June 23, 2012 Are the Gospels Based on Eyewitness Testimony? The Test of Personal Names by Jonathan McLatchie Are the gospels based on credible eyewitness testimony? This is a question on which modern scholars line up on both sides of the divide. From my point of view, the cumulative case for the gospels being based on the testimony of eyewitnesses is clear and convincing. In his groundbreaking work, Jesus and the Eyewitnesses, Richard Bauckham (professor of New Testament studies at the University of St. Andrews, Scotland) lays out an array of compelling evidence for the trustworthiness of the gospels. Among them is the test of personal names, which is covered in chapters 3 and 4 of the book. What he finds is that there is a remarkable correlation between the frequency of names found in the Gospels and Acts and the frequency of names found in writings outside the New Testament. This argument is also developed by Peter Williams, of Tyndale House in Cambridge, in on of his lectures. The top 2 men’s names (Simon and Joseph) in first century Palestine outside the New Testament have a frequency of 15.6%. The frequency of those two names in the gospels and Acts is 18.2%. The frequency of the top 9 men’s names outside the New Testament is 41.5%; whereas the frequency in the Gospels and Acts is 40.3%. The frequency of the top two women’s names (Mary and Salome) outside the New Testament is 28.6%; the frequency in the Gospels and Acts is 38.9%. The frequency of the top 9 women’s names outside the New Testament is 49.7%; and 61.1% in the Gospels and Acts. The top 6 male names in first century Palestine are: 1) Simon/Simeon 2) Joseph/Joses 3) Lazarus/Eleazar 4) Judas/Judah 5) John/Yohanan 6) Jesus/Joshua The frequency of New Testament individuals with those names is 8, 6, 1, 5, 5 and 2 respectively. We can see, therefore, that there exists a remarkable correlation between first century Palestinian names outside and inside the New Testament. What is especially remarkable about this is that the rankings of names in Palestine does not correspond with the rankings of those names in other regions. For example, the rankings of names in Egypt during that period are: 1) Eleazar (ranked 3rd in Palestine) 2) Sabbataius (ranked 68= in Palestine) 3) Joseph (ranked 2 in Palestine) 4=) Dositheus (ranked 16 in Palestine) 4=) Pappus (ranked 39= in Palestine) 6=) Ptolemaius (ranked 50= in Palestine) 6=) Samuel (ranked 23 in Palestine) Such a correlation clearly suggests a close connection to the time and place (first century Palestine) in which the events that the gospels narrate unfolded. Curiously, this contrasts strikingly with the second century apocryphal gospels in which such a correlation is not borne out. Furthermore, even if a writer does have a close connection to the time and place of the events that they narrate, one’s intuition with regards the rankings of popular names is not likely to be very reliable. But we can go further. Consider the following excerpt from Matthew 10 (verses 2-4) where we are given the names of the twelve disciples. Where these names feature in the top 90 names, their ranking is given in brackets: Simon (1), called Peter, and Andrew his brother, and James (11) the son of Zebedee, and John (5) his brother; Philip (61=) and Bartholomew (50=); Thomas and Matthew (9) the tax collector; James (11) the son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus (39=); Simon (1) the Cananaean, and Judas (4) Iscariot, who also betrayed him. Notice that there is correlation between those names that have a high ranking and those names that are assigned a qualifier. The lower ranked names do not have a qualifier . . .
I note, at this stage that "Conspiracy Theories" is far too frequently resorted to as a way to dismiss evidence. The proper issue is warrant, and in this case whether name frequency patterns are reasonable. KFkairosfocus
December 29, 2020
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Silver Asiatic: But not all of our conclusions occur that way. In some cases, we have a built in response that is immediate. We don’t go through arguments and then make a decision. We can call those "gnostic" (small g) or "spiritual experiences." However, Reason remains the final arbiter when one cares about determining if the gnostic or spiritual experience is genuine. And all such experiences should be challenged, don't you think? How do you know it is God and not Satan who is giving a particular powerful immediate experience? Reason has to come in to play. In another case, St. Paul was knocked off of his horse – he encountered Jesus directly. He didn’t make a decision based on a rational, argumentative process. In fact, Jesus didn’t give him an argument to evaluate. Paul's experience didn't exist in a vacuum. And no "doctrine" or additional information was given in the experience. He doesn't go out on his on authority. He visits Ananias and other followers in Damascus who confirm his experience, and they baptize him. He hangs around the Damascus followers who accept his experience as genuine. In other words, Paul experience was rationally tested. Paul confirms this "testing" approach, "test all things, hold tight to those things that are genuine" in the context of "gnostic" or "spiritual" experiences. (1 Thess 5:19-21) Paul says that people may prophesy in church, and other should judge them. (1 Cor 14:27-29) 1 John 4, particularly verse 6, "don't believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see if they are from God... whoever knows God listens to us, and whoever is not from God does not listen to us." "Spiritual" experiences are not condemned any where in the Bible. But human reason is never jettisoned in the process of determining whether a direct immediate experience is genuinely from God or not. Again, the point is that directly powerful convincing types of experience can happen. But they are to be tested by Reason. Reason is always part of the validation process.mike1962
December 29, 2020
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@BA77, Silver Asiatic 1) Until now, Bobby Piton has not shown his analysis, only some results on twitter. 2) In Georgia, he complained that there were to many voters with TOP6 names (https://twitter.com/BobbyPiton3/status/1342502413815656454 ) , in Ohio he was astonished the there were to few voters with TOP1000 names. It's the hallmark of a conspiracy theory that it fits the evidence - and the opposite of the evidence. His assumption is that the distribution of surnames in the US is homogeneous, and that it can be modeled in each state using the census data for the whole of the United States. That's obviously nonsense: taking the TOP6 names (SMITH, JOHNSON, WILLIAMS, BROWN, JONES) you get names which are common in the black community, too. The next name in the list is GARCIA - I wonder why he did omit it. In the TOP1000, you find many names which are obviously not equally distributed over the US, and may be more rare in Ohio: GARCIA (7), RODRIGUEZ (10), MARTINEZ (11), HERNANDEZ (12), LOPEZ (13), GONZALES (14) - as only 4% of Ohio are Latinos (US: 14%). I dare to say that taking the right cut-off point, you can find (read: construct) interesting "anomalies" in the representation of TOPxxx names in each and any state.DiEb
December 29, 2020
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Bob O'H said:
OK, so he opens another submitted slate. Then what? That’s where the Electoral Counts Act comes in.
That's why I said his best path forward was to reject both slates from those states as illegal and unconstitutional before counting them, providing congress no say in the matter because there not be two competing slates for them to consider and debate about.William J Murray
December 29, 2020
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BO'H: the US Constitution is not a suicide pact. There is a deeper universal jurisdiction to the natural law than any civil law and the US Constitution acknowledges its context by reference to the US DoI. In that context, law is inherently accountable to the due balance of rights, freedoms and duties, so that the legislature of PA etc having a just power to appoint electors does not confer a power to do so lawlessly. Which is what is at stake. KFkairosfocus
December 29, 2020
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https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/12/president-trump-admired-american-beating-obama-crushing-joe-biden-dementia-joe-81-million-votes/ Most admired man in America, according to Gallup: Trump, with 3 times the mentions as Joe Biden. But yeah, Biden got 7 million more votes than Trump. Nothing to see here.William J Murray
December 29, 2020
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DEVELOPMENT IN UKRAINE: https://en.interfax.com.ua/news/press-conference/625831.html This has the vid I have clipped. Note GP discussion: https://en.interfax.com.ua/news/press-conference/625831.html The bill there is $7.4 bill. More 'splainin' needed. KFkairosfocus
December 29, 2020
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kf @ 1791 -
There is no basis for states not having a legitimate interest in how elections are done in other states for a federal office.
Well, except for the US constitution, of course. Article 2 states:
Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, ...
So the way a state appoints its electors is a matter explicitly devolved to the state. As one lawyer put it on twitter, if Wisconsin wants to use a cheese eating contest, they can do.Bob O'H
December 29, 2020
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SA, the vid shows Ms Blonde braids walk up to the corralled scrutineers and nearby workers, say something. They clear desks and leave. After that the cases of ballots are rolled out from under a covered table and 4 - 6 people proceed with counting stuff. Sorry, this is a case of officials with 'splainin' to do. KFkairosfocus
December 29, 2020
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WJM @ 1788 - No matter how many times you attempt to imply that the constitution says that he must count them all, Eh? I've never tried to imply that, because I've read the relevant part of the constitution and all it says is hat he has to open them. You can make that case until the cows come home; it doesn’t change the physical fact that if Pence decides otherwise, illegal or unconstitutionally or not, nothing can stop him from doing so at the time. OK, so he opens another submitted slate. Then what? That's where the Electoral Counts Act comes in. He asks for objections, and for any unofficial slates there will be. Then both houses go off to discuss them, and will be aware that legally for the slates that reached the safe harbour dates they have to reject the ones not submitted officially. For Wisconsin it's clear that the House of Representatives will vote for the official ones, and almost certain the Senate will too (several Republican senators have already indicated this). If they disagree, it's the slate that the state's governor submitted that gets counted. If Pence wants to go further and try to stop this process, guess what happens? No election of Trump or Biden as president, and guess who's next in line? Yep, you'll have President Pelosi. I suspect she's not a flaming idiot, so she'll then work things to get Biden president (at worse, she could make him VP and then resign).
What the states did was clearly illegal and unconstitutional, regardless of lower-court decisions otherwise. The SCOTUS rejected the Equal Protection case brought by Texas against those states on standing, not on merit.
No, according to law what they did was legal - courts have made that determination (rightly or wrongly), and the fact that SCOTUS hasn't doesn't change that. You may hold the opinion that what they did was clearly illegal and unconstitutional, and indeed the courts may have (repeatedly) erred in their decisions, but that's irrelevant.Bob O'H
December 29, 2020
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F/N: Let's see how the game proceeds: https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1343663159085834248 >>Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump · 18h “Breaking News: In Pennsylvania there were 205,000 more votes than there were voters. This alone flips the state to President Trump.” Election officials have certified Joe Biden as the winner of the U.S. Presidential election>> Meanwhile . . . http://www.repdiamond.com/News/18754/Latest-News/PA-Lawmakers-Numbers-Don%E2%80%99t-Add-Up,-Certification-of-Presidential-Results-Premature-and-In-Error
PA Lawmakers: Numbers Don’t Add Up, Certification of Presidential Results Premature and In Error Dec. 28, 2020 HARRISBURG – A group of state lawmakers performing extensive analysis of election data today revealed troubling discrepancies between the numbers of total votes counted and total number of voters who voted in the 2020 General Election, and as a result are questioning how the results of the presidential election could possibly have been certified by Secretary of the Commonwealth Kathy Boockvar and Governor Tom Wolf. These findings are in addition to prior concerns regarding actions by the Supreme Court of Pennsylvania, the Secretary, and others impacting the conduct of the election. A comparison of official county election results to the total number of voters who voted on November 3, 2020 as recorded by the Department of State shows that 6,962,607 total ballots were reported as being cast, while DoS/SURE system records indicate that only 6,760,230 total voters actually voted. Among the 6,962,607 total ballots cast, 6,931,060 total votes were counted in the presidential race, including all three candidates on the ballot and write-in candidates. The difference of 202,377 more votes cast than voters voting, together with the 31,547 over- and under-votes in the presidential race, adds up to an alarming discrepancy of 170,830 votes, which is more than twice the reported statewide difference between the two major candidates for President of the United States. On November 24, 2020, Boockvar certified election results, and Wolf issued a certificate of ascertainment of presidential electors, stating that Vice President Joe Biden received 80,555 more votes than President Donald Trump. The lawmakers issued the following statement in response to their findings: “We were already concerned with the actions of the Supreme Court of Pennsylvania, the Executive branch, and election officials in certain counties contravening and undermining the Pennsylvania Election Code by eliminating signature verification, postmarks, and due dates while allowing the proliferation of drop boxes with questionable security measures and the unauthorized curing of ballots, as well as the questionable treatment of poll watchers, all of which created wholesale opportunities for irregularities in the 2020 presidential election.” “However, we are now seeing discrepancies on the retail level which raise even more troubling questions regarding irregularities in the election returns. These findings call into question the accuracy of the SURE system, consistency in the application of the Pennsylvania Election Code from county to county, and the competency of those charged with oversight of elections in our Commonwealth. “These numbers just don’t add up, and the alleged certification of Pennsylvania’s presidential election results was absolutely premature, unconfirmed, and in error.” State Rep. Frank Ryan (R-Lebanon) indicated that state legislators sponsoring and participating in this analysis were himself and Reps. Russ Diamond (R-Lebanon), Dave Zimmerman (R-Lancaster), Barb Gleim (R-Cumberland), Stephanie Borowicz (R-Centre/Clinton), Dan Moul (R-Adams), Paul Schemel (R-Franklin), Dawn Keefer (R-York/Cumberland), Eric Nelson (R-Westmoreland), Mike Jones (R-York), Rob Kauffman (R-Franklin), David Maloney (R-Berks), David Rowe (R-Snyder/Union), Kathy Rapp (R-Warren/Crawford/Forest), Daryl Metcalfe (R-Butler), Jim Cox (R-Berks/Lancaster) and Brett Miller (R-Lancaster). Rep. Frank Ryan 101st Legislative District Pennsylvania House of Representatives
So, who fact-checks the self-appointed fact checkers of Twitter etc? KFkairosfocus
December 29, 2020
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your link to Am Thinker — https://thefederalist.com/2020/12/07/no-the-georgia-vote-counting-video-was-not-debunked-not-even-close/ — is telling
telling, indeed. the "debunking" of the video rests on this:
“There was never an announcement made to the media and other observers about the counting being over for the night and them needing to leave, according to [Frances Watson, chief investigator for the Georgia Secretary of State], who was provided information by the media liaison, who was present.”
There's visual evidence of the room being cleared out, along with sworn affidavits that people were told to leave. No counter-explanation is given for why the entire room cleared out except for 4 who stayed behind to count, unsupervised. Some people simply don't hesitate to tell absurd lies to the public.Silver Asiatic
December 29, 2020
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BA77@1779: it is self evidently true that voter fraud was taking place in the video
It's a good exercise in Intelligent Design detection. The room was cleared out except for the four women. That's irrefutable. The four women got bins from under the tables and continued to count ballots. People are denying that this happened. They're denying that there was a break in protocol. That's what we deal with from people who deny ID evidence in nature.Silver Asiatic
December 29, 2020
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PS: I suspect, whoever wins for the moment there is going to be an impeachment process initiated, or things along that line. I should add, absent absolutely devastating scandal.kairosfocus
December 29, 2020
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WJM, there can be no natural law duty to count tainted votes. The Constitution is a natural law context document, and this is a justice issue. They should have instructed TX to cure the filing and refile for expedited hearing. There is no basis for states not having a legitimate interest in how elections are done in other states for a federal office. Fraud would damage the interests of the state, as would unconstitutional changes to election law and regulations with force of law. KFkairosfocus
December 29, 2020
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BA77, your link to Am Thinker -- https://thefederalist.com/2020/12/07/no-the-georgia-vote-counting-video-was-not-debunked-not-even-close/ -- is telling. KFkairosfocus
December 29, 2020
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Bob O'H said:
True. It only says he has to open them all. And then that they are (all) counted.
No matter how many times you attempt to imply that the constitution says that he must count them all, it does not in fact say that. It only says that he must OPEN them all, and even that, as they say, is open to interpretation and SCOTUS judgement. ANYTHING in the constitution can be argued on the basis if interpretation and intent.
No, because each state only sent a single slate. It’s not relevant that a group of people saying their votes should count – they weren’t selected by their state. The Archivist of the United States has a list of the official electors, and legally their votes have to be accepted. Even if Wisconsin is set aside (because they didn’t reach the safe harbour date), Biden will still win.
You can make that case until the cows come home; it doesn't change the physical fact that if Pence decides otherwise, illegal or unconstitutionally or not, nothing can stop him from doing so at the time.
Right, so doesn’t that mean he should also follow the law?
As already discussed, not every law is constitutional or morally good, and from all reports and his own words and behavior, Pence looks first to his moral duties which, as KF has repeatedly and exhaustively explained, is the basis for the Declaration of independence with informs our "above the law" rights and duties (with regard, at the time, to the laws of England) to act in conflict with immoral laws. That informed and was the foundation for the Constitution, thus moral duty supersedes (as it must) both the constitution and law.
Um, but constitutionally what the states did was not illegal – several courts have already made that decision. Why wouldn’t overturning the authority of the courts not be unconstitutional?
What the states did was clearly illegal and unconstitutional, regardless of lower-court decisions otherwise. The SCOTUS rejected the Equal Protection case brought by Texas against those states on standing, not on merit.
FWIW, even if there was fraud, each state only has one set of electors, and constitutionally Pence’s job is simply to open their votes so that they may be counted. The choice of electors is up to the states.
What anyone, even the constitution, "says" Pence's job is does not change the physical fact that he could do as I described and nobody can stop him at the time. There's just no getting around that.William J Murray
December 29, 2020
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KF 1772
We know ourselves to be under built-in law, natural law. Law that is intelligible and of universal jurisdiction. The natural, built in law, the law of our human nature and so to of nature and of nature’s creator-God.
Yes, exactly. And as you pointed out, St. Paul appealed to the pagan Greeks on that basis. They already understood the natural law and could even determine characteristics and attributes of God from nature alone - without having any other source. So, Paul made good progress on that basis. The pagans knew and many practiced true virtues and also had reverence for God in some way. So, what more was needed? As St. Paul discovered, the teaching of the crucified Christ (His atonement) was "foolishness to the Greeks". This went beyond natural law - it was a revelation from heaven. It transcended a rational argument that the Greeks would have preferred. For St. Paul, he did not arrive at a Christian conviction through argumentation - but by direct power and communication from God. With that, it's not true to say that human reason is the ultimate arbiter. We can have encounters that transcend the rational process but which yield conclusions which are even more certain than logic. For St. Paul, he was martyred for his belief in the resurrection - and his belief did not come by rational argument. He was transformed by a reality.Silver Asiatic
December 29, 2020
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Es58, as I understand it, they are currently conducting a 'signature audit' in Georgia precisely because people have maintained that the audit conducted previously was, as you put it, an 'absolute farce'. For one thing the recount did not match ballots to actual people thus they did not know if what they were counting were legitimate votes or fake votes that had been injected into the system! Here are few more observations
Once the voter validation info is stripped away and discarded, the ballots all look alike. Similarly, injecting fake ballots into the stream after the validation phase is an easy cheat for the same reason. It's good that GA is doing a hand recount but that isn't enough. There are other methods of fraud this won't catch. From another thread: There are a variety of fraud methods that were used simply owing to the level of cheating required for Biteme to "win" given a huge Trump turnout. They were not able to cheat sufficiently in Florida or Ohio. In my estimation, they had to activate their contingency plan which was more likely to expose the fraud. They took the chance that even if discovered, nothing would be done about it. They may very well be right about that in the end. Lets examine the various methods of voter fraud work and whether various methods of mitigation can catch them: - Dead people voting. Clearly, this is fraud. Period, full-stop. Problem is, if you are willfully not checking for it, vote gets tallied. Judicial Watch sued numerous states to try to force them to clean up their voter roles and were largely rejected. So, if you're a Dim operative opening ballots, you won't know that the person listed on the envelope is dead. So, into the pile it goes. A recount won't catch that either because it will just tally the fraudulent one along with the real ones. A group of folks will be required to compare the state's list of who voted and compare that to other data. That takes time and money, neither of which is in ample supply. - Non-residents voting, some potentially in two states. Again, clearly fraudulent but the same attributes apply to the dead. A team will have to go thru the rolls and verify that the voter is, in fact, a resident and is not registered elsewhere. Recount won't catch this either. - Ballot harvesting. There are tens of thousands of nursing home patients in every state. Some of these folks have a legit need to vote absentee. Many, however, are not competent to manage their own affairs. We've already had people indicted and convicted of ballot harvesting from these place. Stealing ballots also works and has been caught. "Helping" older folks to fille out their ballot is frequently done by the Dims. I saw this fraud in person when the older lady showed up to vote in person and the lady got told by the Dim operative with a clipboard that she already voted. - Claiming someone else's ballot. Since the voter roles are public info, it is not at all hard to see which folks are unlikely to vote and simply filling out one in their name and sending it in. The only good way to catch this is if the actual voter shows up to in-person vote or they get a duplicate ballot via mail-in or drop box. The only way to catch this is with signature validation and NV already turned down theirs to the point that any chicken-scratching will count as a valid signature. - Willful "curing" of invalid votes. This has now been shown to be true in PA. By state law, problems with the voter's validation data makes the ballot invalid. The "problematic" areas in PA were doing a "pre-canvass" 3 days before the election to detect invalid votes and if they had reason to believe it was a Dim voter, they called to have those folks come down and fix the problems with their ballots. Note they didn't do the same for those they suspected of being Trump voters. Thing is, under PA law, what they did was illegal and yet the Dims filed sworn statements saying exactly this. The only way to catch this in other states is to have people willing to come forward and testify to that effect. - Adding votes which otherwise wouldn't be there. There is some evidence on video that in GA, PA, MI, WI, NV, and AZ, that if a ballot came in with no choice selected for Prez, the people doing the "counting" would fill in the bubble for Biden. Again, unless is gets to a court of law and people are given prison sentences, this kind of cheating will happen and not be caught. - Recylcling. This form of fraud merely takes ballots that should be for the preferred candidate which have already been run thru the tabulator and do it over and over. There have been affidavits filed in each court suit alleging this. It's common. It's fraud. Unless a whistleblower comes forward, it won't be caught. - Ballot injection. This form of fraud happens after the voter validation phase. Large numbers of suspect ballots arrived in Philly in the middle of the night via vehicles with out-of-state plates and magically the next day Biden is way up. Note that only Dim operatives were present when these suspect ballots arrived and were "counted". This is perhaps the easiest form of fraud to perpetrate when you have a large contingent of mail-in or drop-box voting, which would be expected due to Kung Flu, especially in the Dim terrorized states. A recount certainly wouldn't catch this fraud. Again, unless there's a sworn testimony or video evidence, you got nothing. - Fudging the tally numbers. Clearly in Virginia, this happened. It was so blatant, even I caught it. Fairfax County announced the next morning that, oopsie, we "accidentally" added 100k to Biden. So, small "fudges" can add up to a Biteme win. A hand recount would catch this type of fraud but ordering same requires a court to do so and that requires evidence that you don't have. - Malware in the voting machines and tabulators. There's already a thread or ten on this. The Dominion software and systems were analyzed by the State of Texas and rejected due to glaring deficiencies. The election software was updated the day before the election in several counties in GA. Likely this happened in other battleground states as well. This probably violates state election laws in those areas as the SoS has to certify voting machines and software being used for the elections. And, they are supposed to be physically secured prior to the election. And weren't. Unless there's some manifestation of malware (including the voting software or tabulation software) then it's likely this form of cheating won't get caught. Perhaps the tallies being jockeyed around with in real-time is probably sufficiently suspect to get a court to order a forensic examination of hardware and software and configurations. Again, takes team, takes a court order, and takes time. There are some good methods of statistical analysis that can tell you if there's likely to have been fraud committed. But, again, these are merely indicators, like the ones that triggered a deep dive on Enron. A court MIGHT be convinced by these statistical anomalies to order a deep dive. Again, takes a team, time, a court, and money. This election was stolen. As to whether we can rightfully reclaim victory, that remains to be seen. My hope is the Trump army of lawyers will be successful in getting wins for Trump in the battleground states. We shall see. https://www.ar15.com/forums/General/Georgia-recount-is-a-farce-No-signature-checks-count-must-be-certified-5PM-11-13-2020/5-2391179/?page=4#i89065746
Thus, as the video itself makes clear, there are very good reasons to demand a complete audit of all machines, software, and ballots, involved (especially the ones used by Ruby Freeman, et. al., in the video), and there is no good reason why Democrats should be stonewalling such a complete investigation as they are currently trying to do. After all, it is Biden's own best interest to have this cloud of illegitimacy removed from his presidency. It certainly can't be good to have up to half, or even more, of the American population thinking that you stole the election. i.e. Why is Biden himself not demanding a complete accounting of votes so as to clear his name?bornagain77
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